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Thread: Dungeons 101 - A Noobs guide - please review :):)

  1. #1
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    Dungeons 101 - A Noobs guide - please review :):)

    Hey all, I had some friends recently start playing WoW, and we were going to run deadmines for the first time this week. I tried to find some beginner's guide to dungeons, but nothing was too satisfactory that I found (maybe my googlizing skills weren't that great). Anyway I thought I would post this here, both for review, and in case anybody else has friends that could benefit from it. Please keep reviews constructive, I'm sure there are factual errors as well as a large amount of trivialization, and I'm sure somebody will be offended

    Dungeons 101 - a noob's guide to grouping in WoW

    WoW Jargon

    Noob/newb/n00b/nub - someone who is new to the game and doesn't know "common knowledge"

    Instance/Dungeon - This is an area in the game that you can enter without interference from other players, i.e. you're on your own. You should do this in a party. It is a good idea to do it with at four others, although if you outgear the instance, you can do it with less. Instances are made up of trash and bosses

    Mob - a computer controlled enemy

    Trash - groups of lower level mobs

    Boss - usually individual mob(s) who are higher level and have special abilities, they have a lot of health and can take a lot of time and sometimes special tactics to kill. They drop nice loot i.e. gear which you can look up on wowwiki.com or the atlasloot addon

    NPC - Non player character - these are the people you interact with who are not players, for example quest givers. There are very few of these (sometimes none) in a dungeon.

    DPS - Damage Per Second - Either how much damager you're doing on average every second, or someone whose role is to provide damage. if you're old school you would call this role DD for direct damager.

    CC - Crowd control - this means the ability to take a mob out of the fight for a period of time. Examples are a mage's ability to turn a humanoid into a sheep, a druid's ability to sleep a beast, a rogue's sap or a hunter's trap, a priest's mind control, a shaman's hex. Some forms of CC are talented for example paladin's who specialise in retribution get repentance - a 1 min duration CC. Some people count a warlock/priest's fear as a CC. This is somewhat true, but I would advise against using fear in a dungeon.

    For this guide we will not be talking about more complex dungeons or raids with 10/25 people.


    Your group:

    The ideal group usually consists of 1 tank, 3 dps and 1 healer.

    Wait what's a tank I hear you ask?

    The tank's role is very important, but may not be obviously required in the earlier dungeons. The tank's role is to soak up the damage, all the mobs who are currently fighting should be hitting the tank. For this reason the tank should be a class with high armor and high health. Typically tanks are:

    Feral Druids
    Protection Warriors
    Protection Paladins
    Any Deathknights

    However for low level dungeons any of those classes can tank and even classes like rogues, enhancement shamans if they have good gear, heck even pets can substitute sometimes.

    Why does it matter that all mobs are hitting the tank?

    It makes it easier - if the tank is taking all the damage, the healer only has to focus on healing one person. In addition tanks usually have higher armor or avoidance and therefore take less damage, therefore requiring less heals.

    How does the tank keep all the mobs hitting the tank?

    Mobs choose who they hit based on the amount of threat you have generated towards them. There are addons that can measure your threat, the most commonly used is called omen (usually you wont' have to use omen until later). This display bars for each player showing how much threat they have generated on the targetted enemy. When the mob is targeting you, you are said to have "aggro".

    Threat is based on various things:

    Amount of damage you did - more damage = more threat

    Threat multipliers - certain spells/abilities generate extra threat either as a percentage of the damage or as a fixed number. High threat spells and abilities usually say so in the tooltip. Certain other auras/stances can increase/decrease threat generated.

    Distance to the target - in order to get aggro you must exceed the current target's threat level by a certain percentage. This percentage differs depending on how far you are away from the target. if you are less than 30 feet away, you need to exceed 110%, if you are more than 30 feet away you need to exceed 130% to get aggro. Therefore it is generally good practice to stand as far away as you can.

    Amount of healing done - Each heal generates threat on all mobs, regardless of who it is to.

    So what does the tank do?

    The tank will need to use their abilities to generate threat. The tank must do this to all of the mobs. Typically the tank will mark a target with a skull to designate that this is the target to kill first. He will then "pull" the mobs, usually by doing a ranged attack. Once the mobs get to where the tank wants to fight them he will start putting aggro on all of the mobs. Once he does that he will probably then focus on the mob with skull over its head the majority of the time. If your role is DPS, bear in mind that it will take a few seconds for the tank to gain aggro and get the mobs controlled like this, don't start attacking skull until you feel the tank has them under control.

    Because the tank is the one trying to control all the mobs they usually do the pull, decide where to tank, and the kill order. For these reasons the tank is usually the group leader.

    I'm dps, but I keep on getting hit - what is going wrong?

    It could be one of two things - either you are generating too much threat or your tank is not generating enough threat. Usually it is your fault, slow down the amount of damage you are doing, give the tank time to build aggro. It is more important to stay alive than to maximize your damage, this is usually forgotten by dps's. Alive low dps > dead high dps.

    If you are getting hit you can do two things - keep hitting or stop hitting and wait for the tank to get aggro back. If a mob is about to die, it's probably ok to keep hitting. However don't expect any heals - the healer should be focusing on keeping up the tank first. In the earlier instances you can usually get away with being hit by mobs, when you get to harder stuff later on there's a good chance you'll die in one or two hits.

    I'm a healer I keep on getting hit - what is going wrong?

    Your tank is not putting out enough threat. Typically the tank will focus on skull to try and stop the dps getting aggro. He may lose aggro on the other mobs, or simply have wasted taunt cooldowns because dps are being idiots. As a healer you should prize a good tank who will keep you alive.

    I'm a tank how do i improve my threat generation?

    Read up on your class and study which abilities generate more threat. Study which stats on your gear will help you generate threat and which will help you survive. Pay attention to how much damage you receive, talk to your healer, is it easy to keep you alive, or hard. As a tank you should prize a good healer.

    I'm a healer and I can't keep my tank up, what's going wrong?

    Are you spending time healing DPS instead of the tank? Always prioritize the tank, if there is AOE (area of effect) damage, try using an AOE heal (if you have one). Otherwise it could be that the tank is not geared well enough, or they are trying to take on too many mobs at one time. Try using CC. If you are running out of mana then use mana potions during a fight, and get your mana back up by drinking after a fight.

    I'm a healer how do I make my heals better?

    Focus on stats like:
    spell power - to make your heals bigger
    intellect - to increase your mana pool (longer until you go out of mana)
    spirit - increases how fast your mana regenerates
    crit also never hurts

    I'm a dps who casts spells, how do i do more damage?

    Focus on stats like:
    spell power - to make your spells hit harder
    critical strike - when you "crit" your damage for that spell increase by 50% or 100% usually, you can see the likelihood of you critting by looking at your character stats
    intellect - to increase your mana pool (longer until you go out of mana)

    I'm a dps who hits stuff, how do I do more damage?
    For warriors/ret pallies focus on strength(or attack power) mainly and critical strike (or agility)
    For feral druids and rogues focus on agility above all, then AP and critical strike


    For shammies well I have no idea.

    I'm a tank how do I stay alive longer?
    Find gear with high armor, lots of stamina and defence. If you can equip a shield, make sure you do! If you want to tank more, consider making your talents based in the tanking trees of your class.

    Ok, we killed a boss what is this thing saying need/greed?

    So typically whenever something good drops a window will pop up that says need or greed or pass. First look to see if the item says Bind on Equip or Bind on Pickup. Bind on equip means that you can take it and sell it on the auction house even if you can't use it. If it's bind on equip, it's good practice to always click greed. If its bind on pickup, look at the item and decide whether you need it. Things to consider are is it something that i can wear - for example mages and druids can't wear mail, then is it something that's suited to you. Are you a warrior and the stats are for someone who heals? If you think you need it, then click need, if in doubt ask the group if its an upgrade for you. If you don't need it then ask if there is a disenchanter in the group. Disenchanters can turn that unwanted item into an piece of enchanting materials. Later on you can all rolll to see who gets these enchanting materials usually called shards. If there is no disenchanter then just click greed. Once you've clicked you'll see something like this in the chat window: HappyKiller greed roll 74(1-100), this means that WOW has assigned a random number to you (HappyKiller) which is 74 on a scale of 1-100. Need always beats greed regardless of the number, pass means you've chosen not to roll.

    Now you may sometimes be asked to roll for something, like the disenchanting materials or a treasure chest. To do this just type /roll.

    What happens when you die?

    If someone survives who can resurrect people then they should rez them. Otherwise you will need to run back from the graveyard to the entrance to the instance. You do not have to find your body in the instance, instead you come back to life at the entrance. The entrance is the funny portal looking thing. Beware - sometimes mobs will respawn inside the instance, also make sure you don't get lost or run into groups that you skipped previously.

    Expect to die, particularly when you're new and don't know what's going on. If something goes wrong don't run away - in an instance the mobs will follow you all the way to the instance entrance and chances are you won't make it. Try and make the pull work. Initially it can be daunting to work in a group, particularly if you go with people who expect you to know what's going on. Sometimes people are assholes, don't let them get you down if they are. Everyone was new once. When you wipe (everyone dies) on trash it's usually poor coordination and group play, or insufficient cc/aoe. This can usually settle as the group gets to know each other, however boss wipes might be because of tactics or simply a gear/level issue.

    What role should I be?

    If it's your first dungeon I would highly recommend DPS as it's the simplest role to learn right away. After some time learning how to play in a group as dps then switch to healing and tanking and see how you enjoy them.

    How do we find people, if we don't have 5?

    Asking is the fastest way. You can ask in the local chat channel (usually /1), the trade channel if you're in a city (usually /2), or use the LFG interface, or simply your friends, or your guild. The LFG interface can be brought up by pressing one of the buttons to the left of your bags. You can select either looking for group or looking for more from the tabs. LFM is used if you already have a group, LFG is used if you are on your own. You can then select what you need a group for, for example dungeon - the deadmines. If you are in LFM you can then see a list of other people who are interested in that instance. You can talk to them and see whether they want to come. It is a good idea to find out what role they want to play so you don't end up with 5 dps or 3 tanks, or 4 healers.

    Consumables

    Some food gives you a buff such as stamina or attack power or something like that. Also scrolls and potions can help you either stay alive longer or do more damage. Some people spend money and use these, some people don't. In beginner stuff I would say don't bother, except for the tank who should probably have some health potions.

    This is really all there is to dungeons - tanks keep the healer alive, healers keep the tank alive. DPS kill mobs while trying not to get themselves or anyone else killed. If you don't know what you're doing, ask

  2. #2

    Good Guide

    This is a very nice guide for beginning players. I would add one comment to it;

    Deadmines can be done by 5 level 16s who are prepared to work well as a group and learn from mistakes.

    If you take a disparity of levels then you have to be aware of the possible outcomes, the most likely is that if you have a L20 mage and a L16 tank then the mage WILL get aggro.

    Some classes can shed aggro, rogues can vanish, hunters can feign death but probably not at deadmines level. Mages however have no way do shed aggro and they deal damage in big lumps, the rogue will inflict the death of 1000 cuts and can stop if their threat builds too high, if the mage crits with a fireball it's Boom, Aggro.

  3. #3
    Join Date
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    just a thing to add

    Shammys can easily tank low lvl dungeons aswell while using a sheild + frost shock for aggro. atleast i had no problem doing this all the way to sm cath

  4. #4
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    Good write-up. I'm not sure what audience you're trying to reach, but I suppose Tankspot isn't being read by complete newbies... maybe check Blizzard's Newcomers forum section?

    Before you repost it there however, I've one correction to make:

    Distance to the target - in order to get aggro you must exceed the current target's threat level by a certain percentage. This percentage differs depending on how far you are away from the target. if you are less than 30 feet away, you need to exceed 110%, if you are more than 30 feet away you need to exceed 130% to get aggro. Therefore it is generally good practice to stand as far away as you can.
    It's not 30 feet, it's the mob's melee range. This is usually around 5 yards, more for large mobs, especially dragons.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
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    Thanks everybody, yeah I wasn't trying to reach newbs on tankspot so much, just this is where I tend to post for feedback on things that I don't know much about. Plus with the marmot guides the site is getting more attention.

    Thanks for the info on the aggro range - having always raided as melee I've never worried about it! I'll make some updates to it

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
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    125
    Afaik with the standart blizz Interfache Threat Warning you pull aggro at 100%. Maybe you want to note that.

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    Is that so, does the blizz %'s adjust for range? I hadn't noticed that, since the current state of endgame threat isn't often a fine distinction, it's an all or nothing situation...
    The (Old) Book on Death Knight Tanking
    The New Testament on Death Knight Tanking
    -----------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by Horacio View Post
    Who f-ing divided by zero?!?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
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    As a amateur writer with no publications or professional reviews, I'd like to give my not-so-humble opinion.

    Over all, there's a lack of flow in some areas. Make separate sections for healers and their role in a group, same for tanks, same for DPS. Right now they are all jumbled together.

    Smaller problems I have with the guide are easy to fix.

    There are some terms not defined in the definitions (LFG, Threat, taunt cooldowns, etc). Having them all in one spot provides a more uniform guide. If this is truly a guide for noobs, you can't expect them to know everything. A lvl 18 priest might have a good handle on their abilities and talents, but would have no idea that warriors can Taunt a target and what that means.

    Some of your headers are out of format. For example, "Your group" should have a formal header, then with the (as previously suggested, rearranged) role definitions below as subheaders.

    "Amount of damage you did - more damage = more threat" Don't present things as an equasion when they could be described in words. Anyone who reads that will find it to be an illogical formula. Instead I suggest "The higher one's damage output is, the more threat one will build on a particular mob." or "Damage: the more damage you cause, the more threat you build."

    Little things like not capatalizing an "I", maybe some spelling or grammar errors.

    Now that I nit-picked away, the information is great. I read through it in the state of mind I had when I first walked into RFC as my first dungeon, and I would've liked to have something like this back then (of course, that was only a few days after launch 4 years ago, there wasn't as much knowledge freely available as there is now).

    Good job, tighten it up with a few of the suggestions here, and find an appropriate place to put it (Khordam said it best: people coming to tankspot.com won't be needing this), and you'll help many a noob!

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