Tanking help/recommendations

[zander1976]

Hello All,

I tried tanking Utgarde keep last night and got destroyed. Not sure if it was lack of heals but i get a feeling I was taking too much damage to fast. I kind of power leveled a warrior so I haven't been playing him long and my other toons are casters so there is a lot to take in. We never killed Prince.

1. I wasn't prepared to mark at all and didn't have any marks hotkeyed. I think I am going to use my number pad for marking. I didn't know the pulls and over all didn't feel confident in my ability to tank the place in the first place.

2. Pulls where cc was fine I had no problem keeping sheild block up and moving things around to were I was more confortable but if i needed to tank more then 1 i was taking way to much damage (even on the first few pulls). Not sure if I wasn't keeping shield block up or since I was nervous I was messing things up.

3. Found out the hard way that the dragons do a aoe while i was still trying to turn him. Also got a knock back during that too that cause me to be out of range of the healer. How do people turn stuff fast, move straight threw him and hope you don't take a hit to the back on the way threw. I moved one of the dragons so I had my back to the wall but I guess one of the ccs broke because the healer got killed and I couldn't see anything threw the dragon. How do you deal with that. Should I just tank them where ever and let them throw me around for my healer to deal with?

4. From what I read the same dragon pulls are in again later but with additional adds. How do you handle them, pull them all to a wall.

As you can see we got all the way to prince in a horrible way. For prince my health went really low really fast and the healer everytime got ice tombed and that was the end of that.

As far as threat I was fine, I was usually about double the second place person ( on omen, i know its not good to mesure with omen but it tells you how close number 2 is to you ).

When do you call it quits? I am not the type of person to quit ever but after such a rocky start I was feeling bad for the people that came with me(PUG). I have tough skin so to speak so I don't mind being told what I am doing wrong or that I suck but man I don't know if I want to walk in there anytime soon again.

I did power level my warrior so I haven't been tanking long so I am not very confident in my abilities so I know that doesn't help. When things start to go wrong what do you do to get things on the right track again.

That one kind of shook me. Had to sit back and go wow, I got rocked a few times. Few times I died on a pull within 5 seconds so I know I didn't have shield block up. Do you apply shield block before the pull or ss, rev then put up shield block/clap/demo shout when you have time.

Also what about battle shout I find I never really use that. How helpfull is it.

Thanks, Ben
The World of Warcraft Armory

[drizzy]

Looking at your armoury, you have slightly more defense + avoidance and slightly less HP than I had when I did UK, but probably 2000 less armour. I'm pretty sure there's a better shield than the one you're using at the moment as a quest reward in Borean Tundra which would account for about 1000 difference. I felt like I was taking a lot of damage, but it was manageable.

We didn't have any CC when I did it, but usually charge/tclap/shockwave/shield block when the stun wore off gave about 15seconds or taking almost no damage. That should be enough time for at least one in the group to be dead, and you'll be able to shockwave again soon after.

Re #2: Keeping shield block up? You do realise it's on a 40second cooldown now, right?

Re #3: Run through but kinda circle strafe a la any FPS game ever. I didn't bother trying to get position against a wall, if you're quick you can charge straight back in after a knockback.

Re #4: Just tank em all on the spot.

The prince boss guy sucks cos he seems to just cast shadow bolt over and over and over again, like some sort of demented destro lock, and you can't interrupt him, and you can't even reflect his bloody shadow bolts. Having someone with a shadow protection buff helps, and probably just wearing the most stamina gear you can as your defense gear won't help much against 2-3k shadow bolts.

[dirt]

Well just glancing at your armory, I'd say you are a bit under geared for UK. Your going to need mitigate a fair amount of damage in there and your HP & Armour is around 10k. I'd say pick up a few quest blues, might help get a 1k in each.

Most dragon fights it's always best to turn them away from the group cause of breath, in some fights dragons also use the tail as a weapon(not sure in UK) but it's best to have dps & heals to a side of them, rather than front or back. If they break CC or head for your healer, use your charge & taunt/mocking blow to get them back.

[Tendo]

My first UK run was the same thing: undergeared, underexperienced, and myself (prot warrior) and 4 clothies pug.

But we persevered, and 4 hours later, managed to kill Ingvar on the 7th try.

Yes, many corpse runs. 2 respawns. But we had nothing better to do (hated trying to quest that early in release, as there were too many people) and my pug stayed with me through the end.

Get better gear, usually about 10 quests and you should be in a much better position. If you have warbringer use it when the dragons knockback (face so that you don't get knocked back into another group).

Prince: fight farthest from the door the skellies spawn in. When they get to your group (which should all be standing right behind prince, casters too) just AoE tank them. Don't worry about killing the skellies, neither should your group. Just DPS Prince down. Have a designated Frost Tomb breaker, you back him up if he should be Tombed. Simple stuff.

Next bosses, bring the warrior boss down to 10-15%, then kill the caster completely. Go ahead and kill the warrior. If the warrior boss comes back as a ghost, you won't be able to get aggro and he'll tear your healer in half.

Ingvar: Keep group to the side to use the pillars as Line of Sight breaks, and have EnemyCastBar on to run away from him (about 10 yards) when he Smash/Dark Smashes. Don't have healer heal during the bosses resurrection in the middle of the fight, save the mana and have everyone bandage instead.

[xKhellendrosx]

Ingvar: Keep group to the side to use the pillars as Line of Sight breaks, and have EnemyCastBar on to run away from him (about 10 yards) when he Smash/Dark Smashes. Don't have healer heal during the bosses resurrection in the middle of the fight, save the mana and have everyone bandage instead.

Instead of running away from him, running through him might be easier. Ingvar stands in place when he is doing his smash/dark smash attack so you can completely avoid it by running through him. Just make sure to tell any melee dps that you are doing this and that they should possibly back up a little bit so they don't potentially eat a cleave or somehow move forward and end up in that cone as I've seen it one shot a rogue or two.

[Synapse]

Instead of running away from him, running through him might be easier. Ingvar stands in place when he is doing his smash/dark smash attack so you can completely avoid it by running through him. Just make sure to tell any melee dps that you are doing this and that they should possibly back up a little bit so they don't potentially eat a cleave or somehow move forward and end up in that cone as I've seen it one shot a rogue or two.

That's not a risk, even after Smash he stays still for a second or so. More than enough to go back.

[Remymartin]

Hello All,

I tried tanking Utgarde keep last night and got destroyed. Not sure if it was lack of heals but i get a feeling I was taking too much damage to fast. I kind of power leveled a warrior so I haven't been playing him long and my other toons are casters so there is a lot to take in. We never killed Prince.

1. I wasn't prepared to mark at all and didn't have any marks hotkeyed. I think I am going to use my number pad for marking. I didn't know the pulls and over all didn't feel confident in my ability to tank the place in the first place.

You could either bind the marks or use an addon (I use LuckyCharms myself). Even when I'm running with 4 friends I always at least throw up a mark for first kill target. If you (or the group) is undergeared for an instance focused fire becomes even more important. If you're running an unfamilar instance a good rule of thumb is to kill/cc the caster/healer first.

2. Pulls where cc was fine I had no problem keeping sheild block up and moving things around to were I was more confortable but if i needed to tank more then 1 i was taking way to much damage (even on the first few pulls). Not sure if I wasn't keeping shield block up or since I was nervous I was messing things up.

The people AOEing through these instances generally (1) came in to WotLK with gear to support that or (2) have more experience tanking and a better idea of what they can handle or perhaps (3) have overgeared DPS than can burn mobs down faster than the mobs can kill the tank. You might need to run things a little slower (i.e., use CC, plan the pulls, etc) until you get the gear/experience to just AOE through the instance. You'll get the experience and get more confident in what you're doing (and get better gear as well).

3. Found out the hard way that the dragons do a aoe while i was still trying to turn him. Also got a knock back during that too that cause me to be out of range of the healer. How do people turn stuff fast, move straight threw him and hope you don't take a hit to the back on the way threw. I moved one of the dragons so I had my back to the wall but I guess one of the ccs broke because the healer got killed and I couldn't see anything threw the dragon. How do you deal with that. Should I just tank them where ever and let them throw me around for my healer to deal with?


4. From what I read the same dragon pulls are in again later but with additional adds. How do you handle them, pull them all to a wall.

Pull them further away from CC'd mob. You don't have to tank them against the wall, but until you're confident in moving mobs around, handling knockbacks, etc the safest place is still up against the wall - you don't want the dragon facing your party and you dont want to get knocked back into adds (or get knocked back into your party for that matter).

As you can see we got all the way to prince in a horrible way. For prince my health went really low really fast and the healer everytime got ice tombed and that was the end of that.

As far as threat I was fine, I was usually about double the second place person ( on omen, i know its not good to mesure with omen but it tells you how close number 2 is to you ).

Don't forget about Last Stand, Shield Wall, Frenzied Regeneration, Trinkets, etc for times like that when the healer is out of action for a moment. And as far as I know, Omen is the best way to monitor threat.

When do you call it quits? I am not the type of person to quit ever but after such a rocky start I was feeling bad for the people that came with me(PUG). I have tough skin so to speak so I don't mind being told what I am doing wrong or that I suck but man I don't know if I want to walk in there anytime soon again.

Many people have different tolerances for rough instance runs. Some people will drop almost instantly after the first sign of trouble, some will stick it out to the end. Myself, unless the group is made up of some real assholes, I never just drop. Some people (ok, a lot of people) expect runs to be fast. If you try to run too fast while you are learning you 1) won't have fun and 2) will most likely make more mistakes. So perhaps tell the group up front where you're coming from - better that people drop before the run than after everyone gets in.

I did power level my warrior so I haven't been tanking long so I am not very confident in my abilities so I know that doesn't help. When things start to go wrong what do you do to get things on the right track again.

That one kind of shook me. Had to sit back and go wow, I got rocked a few times. Few times I died on a pull within 5 seconds so I know I didn't have shield block up. Do you apply shield block before the pull or ss, rev then put up shield block/clap/demo shout when you have time.

Also what about battle shout I find I never really use that. How helpfull is it.

Thanks, Ben
The World of Warcraft Armory

You should probably forget about Battle Shout for now and always keep Commanding Shout up while tanking. At this point in your progression mitigation/health are your priorities more so than the additional DPS.

[Kazeyonoma]

Moved to armory Suggestion.

[manatank]

I'd strongly recommend looking into some of the Northrend crafted greens. Pick up some cheap borean armor kits to up the stam, and give your healers some breathing room.

[zander1976]

Thank you all for your responses. Have a much better idea how to approach it the next time. Its kind of funny how you do stupid things when you are nervous. I have no problem charging in after a knockback and do it all the time but I was so busy making sure they were against the wall that i completely forgot that. Infact I find doing that a lot of fun.

Prince: fight farthest from the door the skellies spawn in. When they get to your group (which should all be standing right behind prince, casters too) just AoE tank them. Don't worry about killing the skellies, neither should your group. Just DPS Prince down. Have a designated Frost Tomb breaker, you back him up if he should be Tombed. Simple stuff.

Did have 2 questions about this one, what side do they spam the right side? Also, how do you move him. Everytime i tried he just spammed me with shadow bolts or does he take a break from them. Can you reflect or pummel them?

Thanks, Ben

[Korvid]

/agree with manatank

Look into some of the new crafted items, I suspect there are some that are significant upgrades. I also noticed that there are no gems in you shoulders. that's an easy +36 stam right there, or def + stam.

good luck with you gearing!

[Tendo]

Did have 2 questions about this one, what side do they spam the right side? Also, how do you move him. Everytime i tried he just spammed me with shadow bolts or does he take a break from them. Can you reflect or pummel them?

Thanks, Ben

They spawn from the right as you enter the room (the hallway with the non-elites). It's possible to take out the 4 adds just before the Prince, run the edge of the room and take out the non-elites, then fight Prince in that hallway. In that case, break line of sight to get him to chase you into the hallway.

I say fight as far from the spawns as possible. The extra few seconds of them shambling over to you means that's a few seconds of damage you don't have to take. Once they are near, I grab them all with a t-clap/shockwave combo, and if DPS concentrates solely on the Prince, I can keep the skellies beating on me through T-Claps alone. Since they respawn, there's no sense in killing them. Just think of them as your own private rage engine at that point

[Deefunk]

As far as turning a mob quickly.. what I like to do is run through the mob and once I reach the center of it, Ill jump and turn 180 degrees and walk back out the other side. I find it easier than strafing for me.