Prot Warrior, getting Impale at 80

[Fenicks]

I plan on going with this 12/8/51 build: Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

[Entry]

If I get Impale (and I intend to, seeing as the damage modifier combined with the increased critical chance on Shield Slam, Devastate, and Heroic Strike make it hilariously effective), I'd go Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft. This build is of course assuming there's a Feral or some other tanking class that can apply the 20% attack speed reduction, and it's on some single target fight like Patchwerk. If Imp. Thunder Clap was necessary I'd go Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft. Dropping Warbringer hurts for some fights, but it's a largely trash/situational boss encounter ability anyways. Easily picked up if required though.

With the amount of mitigation blocking provides right now, I really don't think dropping any points out of Shield Specialization would be wise. Speaking of dropping points, I despise Shockwave with a passion, and the ability is really irrelevant for the builds I linked (hard to pull that talent point for a horrendously situational ability like Shockwave).

[Unger]

One thing that I have noticed while tanking in 3.0 is that the stun effect from shockwave takes some getting used to. Since I know its coming, I can hit a TC right away and begin to position the mobs as I want them AFTER the stun has worn off (to avoid PATs, etc.). The stun effect can mess you up if you're backing up a group of mobs and one isnt along for the ride because its stunned. Meanwhile, your favorite hunter in the raid is blasting away at it and continuing to build threat. No bueno.

It is because of this that I don't like the improved revenge. While additional damage on revenge is nice, you can't spam it anymore because of the changes to shield block. Granted, its up frequently, but you don't know when. The bigger issue I have is that I absolutely hate when I am tanking a group and I am dragging them somewhere and I notice that I have stopped attacking because Imp Revenge procced and the mob I was attacking is stunned, 4 yards away from me. As a tank, you HAVE to be able to manipulate the positioning of the mobs..... maybe its close quarters and you want to take everyone who is ranged out of melee or maybe you need to move the pack to avoid a PAT. Whatever the reason, an unexpected stun of the mob we are tanking is a bad thing (article on why I yell at rogues for stun locking later in the programming).

Here is my build:

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

You have to have SaB, puncture isn't needed based on the amount of rage I have been generating (plus, between BR and charge, your ability to get more rage has never been higher) and I just cant pass on impale. I have always liked the TM talent although I admit that its less useful now that you can charge and berserker rage in any stance. What you still can't do is hamstring or hit the long cooldown abilities that are no longer tied to shield wall (Recklessness and Retaliation). Retaliation is particularly effective in holding large groups of mobs you need to have on you.

You could go with the stun resistance here if you prefer but you don't need imp HS. Between the procs you get from glyphs, etc. and the amount of rage you should be generating, you wont need it.

You could very easily spec out of vigilance and go 5/5 cruelty if you want, but in every single raid, there is always one party member that is too caught up in the damage meter to pay attention to Omen. For me, its usually a fury or arms warrior, but it could be anyone. Having their DPS help you build threat represents a significant reduction in their ability to rip from you. And in the event that they do, the 3% damage mitigation is great for helping them survive that first shot before you can taunt or they can activate a threat reduction effect.

Just one tanks thoughts.

Unger

[Squirrels]

nice build, but why get tactical mastery when u can a) charge in defensive stance and b) use beserker rage in defensive stance? with the glyph of charge to reduce it to 12 sec CD, ive seen like 1 time where i should of stance danced to zerker stance and intercepted. Its not really a big dead now to use the other stances while tanking unless u REALLY want to get that wirlwind off after a shockwave.

Imo, i would rather the 25% off stuns just cause their a HUGE P I A while tanking a lot of mobs @ once.

[Bullwerk]

Just a general dump of information for anyone thinking about their lvl 80 raiding spec already. A bit of sobriety perhaps

There is some really good information on the Cruelty vs Impale debate in this thread:


Impale vs Cruelty


Bottom Line: Cruelty>Impale for a tank as we are not able to stack the crit % neccessary to make Impale superior. You may like to see the big numbers that impale puts up but when real tanking lands again (talking post Naxx here) and those prot talents are startin to look more and more useful it will be a no brainer to give up on Impale and keep cruelty. This is the prudent choice since maximizing DPS and THREAT and SURVIVABILITY will be what pushes progression.

Think of it this way. Why would Blizzard go through all the trouble of balancing tank mitigation across class based upon or respective talents and then expect warriors to drop 10% or more in favor of damage? They wouldn't bosses will hit hard again and we will be forced to play the survivability game again. Remember the mantra the dead DPS does no damage, dead tanks are even worse. NO Threat, NO damage and a wipe.

I know I'm close to off topic/rambling here but I've noticed a tendency of people to expect WotLK end game to be equal to the lolfaceroll joke raiding is right now. Have your fun and drop your mitigation talents while leveling but don't expect your Level 80 spec to be missing any of the old standbys in favor of extreme damage. Our damage will come from the stats on our gear and our defensive talents (Critical Block, SnB, Imp Revenge etc.)

[Unger]

nice build, but why get tactical mastery when u can a) charge in defensive stance and b) use beserker rage in defensive stance? with the glyph of charge to reduce it to 12 sec CD, ive seen like 1 time where i should of stance danced to zerker stance and intercepted. Its not really a big dead now to use the other stances while tanking unless u REALLY want to get that wirlwind off after a shockwave.

Imo, i would rather the 25% off stuns just cause their a HUGE P I A while tanking a lot of mobs @ once.

As I said in my post, its a personal choice.... the three things I like to use when tanking are retaliation, hamstring and at times, recklessness. You're just as well going for imp heroic strike... I just found that I don't need it. There really aren't that many choices beyond that.....

[BuliwynT]

I'm with Fenicks.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Imp. spell reflect is cool, but with gag order and heroic throw + tc having unlimited targets (assuming you're in range of the caster), the imp. version of spell reflect seems be more effective for pvp.

[Rootkitworm]

I'm with Fenicks.

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Imp. spell reflect is cool, but with gag order and heroic throw + tc having unlimited targets (assuming you're in range of the caster), the imp. version of spell reflect seems be more effective for pvp.

/Agree. Only thing I might think of moving would be 2 points out of Anticipation and putting it into Bloodrage or something else. Or possibly the 1point in Vigilance into something else. Depends on what you're doing I guess.

Imp. Spell Reflect isn't all that great because: Most Bosses and Raid Mobs damage are mellee-based and the magic damage that is caused generally doesn't seem to be constant enough to matter that this talent would be an issue. Only maybe worth it if you are heavy into PvP. And even then, the Spell Reflect use is not lengthened with points in this talent, and the effect does not last long at all.

Imp. Spell Reflect is also very obvious when it is used to Horde watching you. All they need to do is wait 3 seconds before fireballing your face again. This talent would be much better for PvP if the effect itself was lengthened with points, imo. As I have already tried spec'ing into this and that was my observation in PvP.

If I had free points I might put it into Improved Disciplines and/or Bloodrage, as Shield Wall being shorter, now is seemingly possible to use more than once in a boss fight, and more so with a point or two in it.