+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 50

Thread: 3.0.3 Sudden Death Nerf

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Tampa
    Posts
    8
    I am stacking crit currently with my 53/8 build not so much for the Sudden Death procs but more for the rolling Deep Wounds.

    Deep Wounds is accounting for roughly 20% of my DPS which on most BT / MH boss fights no less than 2000 dps to 2700+.

    - Bodd
    If at first you don't succeed, skydiving may not be for you!
    http://www.tankspot.com/signatures/u...sera/image.jpg

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonypablos View Post
    It's an ambiguous statement and Serennia has been known to be very pessimistic about changes that hurt the warrior class.
    Truth. I wonder sometimes if that guy is optimistic about anything. I'm not a fan.

    It's one of two things that will happen.

    1) GC may mean that even with the nerf, they weren't happy with the change in damage for Fury being closer and decided to buff Fury at that point. In this retrospect, the 9% to hit is still there and they're simply buffing Fury.

    2) GC may mean that when they saw the changes to arms even after the 9% hit change, that it was the wrong way to go so they decided to scratch all the plans and simply buff Fury. That's where a lot of arms warriors are concerned and hoping that it doesn't go it.
    The second option is my take on that statement, but I guess we'll see what happens when it goes live.

    Let me state this much: the 9% hit is not as significant of a nerf as people are worrying about. Yes, if you have a high amount of crit, you'll see a lil less Sudden Death procs, but now, even your hits will have a chance to light it up which in turn gives you a steady percentage of chance to get SD to go off. It's a change but in no means a huge change that will drastically lower the DPS you're currently pulling off with arms.

    Remember that Crits can miss. which means you might have 60% chance to crit, but you still can miss that white damage. It doesn't remove the miss chance, it just replaces the hit chance with a crit value. That's the commonly accepted view of how Blizzard's attack table is.
    Understood. I know it's not a huge nerf, but it is a nerf. I'm prot probably 80-90% of the time, but there was a long period both pre-bc and in TBC that I was fury, and Arms is like a huge breath of fresh air. I'd rather they not change it in order to make another tree more appealing, and would rather they left it as is and made the changes mentioned to Fury.

    Either way, I'm fairly certain it won't be a huge change to the playstyle.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Baltimore/DC area
    Posts
    1,380
    It wouldn't be a change to the playstyle. It won't really even be a change to the gearing, because you'll still want to have crit for Deep Wounds.

    It will just make crit a little less valuable in the sense that it doesn't help you proc sudden death. But if you've been keeping up with my "When to Execute?" thread, you'll see that you shouldn't use execute above 50 rage (and depending on your gear/glyphs/etc, that number goes way down). Slam is better, then.

    Sudden Death is great in an infinite rage situation, but execute is still a weak attack when looking at it from a Damage-per-Rage situation.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    362
    if it's any clarifications...

    MMO-Champion BlueTracker - Sudden Death not getting nerfed?
    [blizzard]We tried a couple of nerfs to Sudden Death, such as less damage or less chance to proc. We didn't like any of them, so for now the ability is staying as is. [/blizzard]

  5. #25
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    Posts
    7,442
    then that means crit's still going to be a great stat to work and the rend--> op rotation will still be a good one. So nothing to see now, moving on

    Tankspot Moderator
    Twitter: Follow me on Twitter! @Krenian

    "Damnit!" - Jack Bauer, 24


  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    362
    so for now the ability is staying as is.
    As in 9 % chance per hit ? or 30 % chance per Crit ?

  7. #27
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    Posts
    7,442
    30% chance per crit.

    Think about it. He's saying that the talent was being fixed and nerfed and that they couldn't find the right change to it. So they buffed fury and left it the way it is now. i'm almost sure that means 30% per crit.

    I could be wrong.

    Tankspot Moderator
    Twitter: Follow me on Twitter! @Krenian

    "Damnit!" - Jack Bauer, 24


  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    362
    let's hope you're not !

  9. #29
    so as of now will everyone be stacking crit?

  10. #30
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    Posts
    7,442
    If it stays the way it is right now, Crit's going to be the stat to stack once you're Hit capped, yes.

    Hit Capped > Crit > Strength > ArP/Expertise > Hit

    Tankspot Moderator
    Twitter: Follow me on Twitter! @Krenian

    "Damnit!" - Jack Bauer, 24


  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Tonypablos View Post
    If it stays the way it is right now, Crit's going to be the stat to stack once you're Hit capped, yes.

    Hit Capped > Crit > Strength > ArP/Expertise > Hit
    Should we still be looking for a balance in crit/str at this point or pretty much +10 crit in every slot possible?

  12. #32
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    11
    Hello
    As it is my first post here on tankspot I hope you can bare with me if I'm asking a noobish question.
    Have any of you had Threath problems with the 53/8 build ?
    I'm asking as last night in BT I pulled aggro on 2!! bosses. As I see it I got OP and SD very early and that seemd to be enough when they both critted.
    Should I ask the warrior tank to put up Vigilance on me on every boss fight or was the Tank not doing his job or (even worse) am I to eager to start utilizing my SD and OP proccs ?

    Cheers

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    179
    Warrior threat is not linear until he has sufficient amount of rage so you either started too early or just simply out-DPSed your tank in terms of threat. I'd say the first option is the scenario that will happen time and again when I tank for people.

    If you feel unsure about your abilities to maintain threat, ask for vigilance.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    362
    Quote Originally Posted by Sigge View Post
    Have any of you had Threath problems with the 53/8 build ?
    Definitely :-P

    I had occasions where I had to stop dsping altogether to avoid pulling aggro, waiting for the tank to build up a more sizable gap and be able to close it under 3 seconds due to lucky crits. Aggro generation can get very bursty, especially when executing.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    Posts
    7,442
    Quote Originally Posted by Brainwreck View Post
    Should we still be looking for a balance in crit/str at this point or pretty much +10 crit in every slot possible?
    You'll probably will want to have a decent amount of both for the AP boost Str will give you and the crit boost that bring up the chances of you to crit.

    I'm thinking a little bit like this:

    Red: Orange Gem (Crit + Str)
    Yellow: Crit Gem
    Blue: Purple Gem (Str + Stam or Crit + Stam)

    I'm not sure of the point conversion at this time as no one has come out with a said point conversion but I have a sneaking suspicion that Crit will be the higher stat desired due to how execute works. The build just simply works better that way.

    Tankspot Moderator
    Twitter: Follow me on Twitter! @Krenian

    "Damnit!" - Jack Bauer, 24


  16. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Baltimore/DC area
    Posts
    1,380
    On a 25man last night, we only had one prot warrior.

    We had a ret pally and myself (53/8/0) at the top of the meters.

    At first, the tank was giving Vigilance to the ret pally. I suggested that he give it to me instead, because the ret pally has an aggro dump and I don't.

    On bosses, I am often threat capped (usually after I dump a 100-rage execute that crits) without Vigilance.

    At this point, I ask for it as the #1 priority person, and my tanks almost always oblige.

    As for stat stacking, there really hasn't been any real work done on it yet. It's on my list to do if nobody else does first, but I'm still in the middle of working out our rotation. Once I can accurately model our rotation and estimated damage/dps, I can come up with some SEP values (Strength Equivalent Points, for those who don't know).

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Tampa
    Posts
    8
    Yes threat unfortunately is an issue. I pulled aggro the other night on RoS and died p2, got brezzed for middle of p3 and still ended up with 2500+ dps.

    On Teron we had our pally tank him and while I was able to reach over 2800 dps, I got tons of warnings.

    So yes even though tank threat has gone up, I still need to watch the threat.

    - Bodd
    If at first you don't succeed, skydiving may not be for you!
    http://www.tankspot.com/signatures/u...sera/image.jpg

  18. #38
    Just posted this on the TG thread as the discussion had drifted to Arms threat issues but it applies here as well.

    From EJ on Threat Mechanics

    Warrior
    Defensive Stance: 1.3 modifier
    Defiance: 1.15 modifier
    Battle and Berserker Stance: .8 modifier
    Improved Berserker Stance: .9 modifier
    Devastate: 100 added threat
    Heroic Strike: 220 added threat
    Execute: 1.25 modifier
    Thunderclap: 1.75 modifier
    Thunder Clap: 130 added threat
    Demoralizing Shout: 43 added threat
    Battle Shout: 55 added threat
    Revenge : 201 added threat

    Arms warriors loss out on Improved Berserker Stance as well as use a plethora of Executes, which have a positive threat modifier. This causes Arms warriors to produce significantly more threat than a fury warrior doing the same DPS.

    This has always been a bane of warrior DPS in general and blizz has done some (read Imp zerker) to improve the situation although pre 3.0 I was usually dancing the threat cap anyhow. Arms has not gotten any means to reduce threat other than a soul stone or battler rez. I hope that if blizzard wants arms to be a viable raiding DPS spec that this is looked into. Even removing the added threat from Execute would help immensely.

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Baltimore/DC area
    Posts
    1,380
    Being that arms is one of the only (if not THE only) classes without an ample threat dump, convince your warrior tanks that you need vigilance more than that pally, mage or warlock.

    I agree though, threat is certainly higher for an arms war than a fury war, even for the same exact dps.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    11
    So conclusion is that we should demand Vigilance as we have high threath talents and no aggro dump ?
    When I raided pre 3.0.2 as Fury DW it wasn't at all the same problem , probably because of Imp.Zerker Stance and not a weilding HUGE 2-hander.

    Also the threath "bonus" to Execute really makes Vigilance a "must" for Arms SD specced Warriors. (Atleast I gonna say so to the prot tank )

+ Reply to Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts