Closed Thread
Page 1 of 40 1 2 3 11 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 800

Thread: Death Knight AOE Spec, MT Spec and Rotations

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171

    Death Knight AOE Spec, MT Spec and Rotations

    *Revised for 3.08 to include more builds*
    * Being updated for 3.1 * - 6/17


    UNHOLY TANK

    Unholy Single Target Threat - Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

    Unholy Hardmode Survival - Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

    Defensive

    Anticipation
    Imp. Icy Touch
    Blade Barrier
    Bone Shield
    Magic Suppression
    Anti-Magic Zone

    Single Rotation: IT, PS, BS, BS, SS, SS When Excess Runic Power is available Use Unholy Blight, Death Coil and Rune Strike as Runic Power Dump

    Rotation Priorities =
    1) Use Defensive Abilities when Required
    2) Use Horn of Winter when Applicable
    3) Keep Both Diseases on target
    4) Keep both Blood Runes on Cooldown
    5) Keep Unholy Blight up
    5) Keep Runic Power from hitting 100 using Death Coil and Rune Strike
    6) Use Scourge Strike on Cooldown

    AOE Rotation: DnD,IT,PS,PEST,BB,UB,SS,SS, BB When Excess Runic Power is available Use Rune Strike as Runic Power Dump

    Nine Button Rotation = 13.5 seconds for 15 seconds of cooldown (this gives you one extra CD per rotation for Runic Abilities such as Horn of Winter or Icebound Fortitude

    DnD - Death and Decay
    IT - Icy Touch
    PS - Plague Strike
    BB - Bloodboil
    UB - Unholy Blight
    SS - Scourge Strike
    RS - Runic Strike
    BS - Blood Strike
    PEST - Pestilence



    FROST TANK

    Frost

    Merko's Frost Raid Tank - http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deat...2&version=9757

    Frost Hardmode Survival - Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft


    Stam +0%
    Str +0%
    Expertise +5

    Defensive

    Anticipation
    Imp. Icy Touch
    Blade Barrier
    Frost Aura
    Acclimation
    Lichborne
    Frigid Dreadplate
    Guille of Gorefiend
    Unbreakable Armor

    Single Rotation: IT, PS, BS, BS, OB, OB When Excess Runic Power is available Use Frost Strike and Rune Strike as Runic Power Dump

    Rotation Priorities =
    1) Use Defensive Abilities when Required
    2) Use Horn of Winter when Applicable
    3) Keep Both Diseases on target
    4) Keep both Blood Runes as Death Runes
    5) Keep Runic Power from hitting 100 using Frost Strike and Rune Strike
    6) Use Obliterate on Cooldown

    AOE Rotation: DnD,IT,PS,PEST,HB,BB,FS,OB,HB,PEST When Excess Runic Power is available Use Frost Strike and Rune Strike as Runic Power Dumps

    You can only use DnD every 2nd Rotation

    DnD - Death and Decay
    IT - Icy Touch
    PS - Plague Strike
    BB - Bloodboil
    RS - Runic Strike
    BS - Blood Strike
    OB - Obliterate
    HB - Howling Blast
    PEST - Pestilence




    BLOOD TANK

    Blood - Satorri's Blood Raid Tank - http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?deat...5&version=9757


    Defensive

    Anticipation
    Imp. Icy Touch
    Blade Barrier
    Blood Aura
    Rune Tap
    Spell Deflection
    Veteran of the Third War
    Mark of Blood
    Vampiric Blood

    Single Rotation: ...

    Rotation Priorities =
    1) Use Defensive Abilities when Required
    2) Use Horn of Winter when Applicable
    3) Keep Both Diseases on target
    4) Keep Runic Power from hitting 100 using Death Coil and Rune Strike

    AOE Rotation: ... When Excess Runic Power is available Use Death Coil and Rune Strike as Runic Power Dumps

    DnD - Death and Decay
    IT - Icy Touch
    PS - Plague Strike
    BB - Bloodboil
    RS - Runic Strike
    OB - Obliterate
    HS - Heart Strike
    DC - Death Coil
    DS - Death Strike
    PEST - Pestilence



    Runeforging

    2H
    Stoneskin Gargoyle - 25 Defense Skill, +2% Stam
    Swordshattering - 4% Parry
    Spellshattering - 4% Spell Deflection

    DW
    Swordbreaking - 2% Parry
    Spellbreaking - 2% Spell Deflection

    Glyphing

    Rune Strike = 10% crit on 8 swings per minute = ~2000+ damage / minute
    IT = 10 extra RP on 2.5 IT per minute = ~2500+ damage / minute
    Frost Strike = 8 extra RP on 6 FS per minute = ~4500+ damage / minute
    Unbreakable = Mitigation for 20 seconds

    Glyphs Variables
    DW or Hateful Strike boss where faster swings rates will cause your Runestrike to Swing Ratio goes up making Rune Strike stronger.
    Last edited by Merko; 06-18-2009 at 09:22 AM.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    184
    I haven't played with an Unholy spec much at all. Why not pick up Reaping?

  3. #3
    Great post. I am looking Forward to trying out a deathknight. I think with duel-specs in the future, a Frost primary and Unholy secondary combo will make them very viable MTs.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171
    The purpose i would have for avoiding reaping is in a proper aoe rotation those death runes will be used as blood runes anyways since both pestilence and blood boil are good aoe abilities that use blood runes. When i get a chance to run numbers on a Solo Tanking spec i plan on taking more advantage of death runes

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171
    Keep the questions coming... once i get more knowledge on solo targeting threat/rotations and questions answered i plan on making a "tank spot" worthy guide for DK tanking

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    184
    Frost has the most survivability in the forms of:

    Guille of Gorefiend, Unbreakable Armor (38 Seconds of Pure improved mitigation every minute)

    Lichborne (fear ward + 25% avoidance for 15 seconds every 3 minutes),

    Frigid Deathplate (6% extra avoidance)

    Improved Icy Touch (6% boss attack speed reduction)

    Frost Aura + Acclimation (Large Magic Resistance)
    Love frost, (had a daliance with Blood on beta but now back to Frost) and you are correct frost has some fun mitigation/survivability to it. Only thing I find it lacking is no Sta or Str boost at all. Both Unholy and Blood have both.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2,021
    That might be intended so that unholy and blood had something to counter Frost's mitigation talents

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    184
    Yep I imagine you are correct.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171
    I have done some more testing since the most recent patch changes using the 3 lvl 55 dummys (to simulate better raid gear with hit and expertise than i have access to at the moment)

    in premade gear (non glyphed, non buffed) and in frost presence since the patch:

    unholy tank/aoe spec (2250 dps down from 2450 dps) has taken a small nerf and rotation changes however this is still the most dominant of all aoe specs (frost 1850, blood 1725)

    For single target tanking keeping unholy blight up no longer has the benefits it once had and holds unholy at the lowest dps 1250.

    Despite its lack of strength, frost (1510 dps) still holds up particularly well compared to blood (1550 dps).

    Since i am at work at the moment, i can not access the specs and rotations i was using but i will post later this evening.

    *frigid deathplate got nerfed from 6% to 3% avoidance*
    Last edited by Merko; 10-20-2008 at 08:51 AM.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    18
    frigid DREADplate. SHEESH!

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Yardley, PA
    Posts
    1,222
    I think you can make a better Single-target Unholy tanking spec.

    I think unless you're dealing with a big magic-heavy boss, don't worry about Magic Supression/AMZ. I would put those points into frost to get Lichborne, and this would be a better single-target (physical tanking) spec. It's another "oh-shit" button that's easily obtainable.

    So, you can put 2 points into Black ice (buffs IT/FF, which outweighs Glacier Rot), one point into Lichbourne, and the remainder you can probably leave in Magic Supression, or put it into a threat talent of sorts.

    Edit: You have reaping in the new spec, but you'll be weaving in Death Strikes for Scourge Strikes for extra healing, and that's where the Death Runes come in handy.
    Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity. -Seneca
    Everyone marvels at a square egg, but only the chicken understands the PAIN.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171
    I like your idea on this one and will put two both specs up and make a note how your build has a bonus to tps and is more practical for physical bosses... It is true considering how few bosses in BC there were where the extra magic protection is nice.

    I do wish i had the extra magic supression/amz for Kael on our first few attempts getting to phase 4 tho >.<

    ..memories..

    *just got back from trip and will finish my blood section off*

    thanks ttocs for the tip

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171
    I also would like to know from people how DK threat gen is on bosses and the viability weaving death strikes in while keeping threat way ahead. I haven't ran anything with *competitive dps* just some pugs with guildies playing on premade toons for fun until wrath goes live so i have not had a good chance to get an idea of whats ahead.

    short form - is it like playing a warrior on live where you do twice the threat of any class?... besides ret pallys of course

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    184
    On bosses with the new Runestrike that is the only thing you really need to spam. Hit that whenever it pops and do a normal one mob rotation and you should be good. I'm not sure if Death Strikes add agro with the heal or not but it is always nice to have a little extra help.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    4,930
    There are two things I can offer your testing so far.

    1.) For frost, I find Howling Blast preferable to Obliterate whenever the CD is up (so Oblits only to use those runes while it's on CD). It does comparable or better damage, and what's more it is not subject to avoidance or mitigation, and if talented (which I do even in my tank spec) it gets buffed by IT.

    2.) There's a couple of faults in testing on premades. The gear is not itemized the way tanking gear is, most notably it has crit value that will vary in TPS for the various specs.

    I'd also point out there is definite room for personal swings on tanking specs, and those will flavor the rotations and dynamics of the tank. Offering specific specs as doctrine is a narrow view that usually makes me wince.

    Oh, and tanking on my 80 DK that was pure leveled, and moderately geared for tanking, I was usually maintaining about 3x the threat of the other classes barring the class glitch periods. The threat buff from Frost Presence and the fact that we can generate 100% of our threat without ever being hit and without being diminished by time. DK's are great tank threat. I expect the major emphasis will be on gearing and survival over threat margins.

    Thanks for running some numbers though. =)
    The (Old) Book on Death Knight Tanking
    The New Testament on Death Knight Tanking
    -----------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by Horacio View Post
    Who f-ing divided by zero?!?

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    184
    For Blood I would go more with a spec like this 53/8/10
    Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

    Not a fan of Will of the Nec or Spell Deflection. Bladed Armor will help your dps which helps threat. Scent of Blood will help rp which is then dumped into Rune Strikes. And I love Epidemic, its always hard for me to make a spec that doesn't have it.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    4,930
    That's totally what I mean too. =) I like Will of the Necropolis (good functional EH value). I also tend to favor Blood Worms. It may not scale as well with tank health, but it can easily measure to Blood Aura for self-healing.

    My Blood tanking spec of choice:
    Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

    I change it fairly frequently depending on what I'm trying to get out of it as well. In general I've never had any problems, whatsoever with threat, which leaves me feeling less like I need to buff DPS abilities too much. I like Spell Reflection, but it is only valuable in certain situations. I'll take it if I know it'll come in handy. I like Bladed Armor too much for tanking to not take it. Sometimes I take Lichborne and Annhilation, sometimes Morbidity, Epidemic, Ravenous Dead, and/or Blood Aura.

    To each their own, that's something I love about the class.
    The (Old) Book on Death Knight Tanking
    The New Testament on Death Knight Tanking
    -----------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by Horacio View Post
    Who f-ing divided by zero?!?

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Posts
    184
    Totally agree. I'm actually having a tough time with what tree I want to spec in because I enjoy them all so much (probably unholy for leveling at least).

    Yeah can change around a few talents here and there, I'm thinking morbitiy might not be as needed as I first thought.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171
    In the 58/8/5 spec would you find that without the death rune mastery, you find yourself struggling do use your extra frost and unholy runes? I find when i pop on obliterate at the end of my rotation using those 2 now death runes gives me 2 more heart strikes... also giving you 2 more chances to get a free death coil

    ...also in my builds i am going to consider getting rid of my points in the anti-magic talents that you listed above... as nice as they look they are situational and should the time come where i need it for a boss i can always respec quickly.

    but yes I totally agree the great thing about death knights is how versitile they are as long as you pick up certain abilities depending on your role. The main reason i am working on this is to get some rotations down because as i am sure everyone who has had the chance to play a death knight knows is that if you are a just aiming blindly as which ever rune happens to pop up next people are going to struggle at keeping there tps/dps high and keeping the target diseased. I foresee a larger margin in player skills of death knights than any other class come Wrath
    Last edited by Merko; 10-29-2008 at 10:08 AM.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    171
    Also in the 53/8/10 build... would it be more beneficial to pick up 2 points in ravenous dead since strength increase parry... and with the 12 seconds to normal diseases without epidemic. your rotations after you get the two deathrunes from obliterate will be

    (2 blood, 2 death, 1 unholy, 1 frost)

    IT (frost) 0
    PS (unholy) 1.5
    HS (blood) 3
    HS (blood) 4.5
    HS (death) 6
    HS (death) 7.5
    Oblit (unholy + frost) 9
    Death Coil
    Death Coil
    Death Coil (if sudden doom procs)

    This rotation will give you a chance as well in case you miss or get dodged to not run out on your 12 second disease timers giving you an Obliterate with 2 diseases still up.
    As well this rotation shows how morbidity (depending on how it scales with gear) does have its value for the blood tree.

Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts