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Thread: Mallet and Cleaver.

  1. #1
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    Mallet and Cleaver.

    Ok I have

    [item]mallet of the tides[/item] with Mongoose.

    [item]cleaver of the unforgiving[/item] with Executioner and a +10 crit(yellow) gem.

    Do I have the best set up on them?

    Im using the cleaver for trash/pvp/dailies and I figure it would be good to lvl to 80 with as prot. I use the mallet for all boss fights.

    Opinions?
    There is something so appealing about backhanding someone across the face with a shield.

  2. #2
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    in my opinion keep doing what ur doing, mallet for bosses, cleaver for trash and what ever else.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodasafa View Post
    Ok I have

    [item]mallet of the tides[/item] with Mongoose.

    [item]cleaver of the unforgiving[/item] with Executioner and a +10 crit(yellow) gem.
    As a human, the Mallet with no enchant will generate more threat than the Cleaver with any combination of gem + enchant.

    You can change weapons in combat. The Mallet should be your threat weapon. Ideally put Executioner on it.

    You can make the Cleaver whatever you want, other than a threat weapon (you already have a better one). Personally I would use either a [item]Thick Lionseye[/item] or [item]Enduring Seaspray Emerald[/item] with Mongoose.

    Lastly, just for the record, +10 Hit rating is more threat than +10 Crit rating unless you are hit capped vs. your current target.
    Armstrong
    <Elysium>
    Burning Legion US

  4. #4
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    There is an excellent post from Hypatia here http://www.tankspot.com/forums/gear-...breakable.html

    Quote Originally Posted by Hypatia View Post
    Oh, hey. You mentioned Cleaver of the Unforgiving, which I completely ignored. I am looking at it now and will update talking about it momentarily.

    Cleaver of the Unforgiving:

    110-205 weapon damage range ~= 157.5/hit
    31 stamina ~= 356.5 hp (BoK, Vitality)
    20 parry rating ~= 0.89% avoidance
    0 expertise rating ~= 5 expertise = 2.50% dodge+parry removal (orc)
    12 hit rating ~= 0.76% miss removal

    The weapon also has a yellow socket with a +3 stamina socket bonus. We'll address that after the base weapon comparison:

    Mallet of the Tides vs Cleaver of the Unforgiving:

    -1.6 weapon DPS
    +7.0 weapon damage per Devastate
    +34.5 hp
    -0.08% avoidance
    +0.27% block
    +3.55 expertise (1.77% dodge+parry removal)
    +8.55 expertise (4.28% dodge+parry removal) (human)
    -1.45 expertise (-0.73% dodge+parry removal) (orc)
    -0.76% miss removal

    Overall dodge+parry+miss removal:
    +1.00% dodge+parry+miss removal
    +3.52% dodge+parry+miss removal (human)
    -2.21% dodge+parry+miss removal (orc)

    This weapon is slightly lower weight-class than any of the three others we've looked at so far... until you count that gem slot. With the gem slot, you've got some great alternatives. I'd say that if you're going for hit chances, you should use the Mallet, so look at gemming for either stamina or defense rating—probably stamina.

    I'd personally gem for stamina and only consider using this weapon in a fight where high burst damage is a great danger—especially high burst magic damage. But it's still a good all-around weapon, with a lot of ability for customization. For orcs, I'd say this weapon is the Mallet of the Tides compared to The Brutalizer.

  5. #5
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    I already have enough expertise without the mallet to achive the hard cap for dodge.

    At this point in time if I were to put on all my expertise gear I would only have 52 skill, wich is still short of the Parry hard cap.

    So what I dont understand is if Im over the dodge cap in expertise with the cleaver, how dose the mallet give me more threat?

    I dont see how it would. could you elaborate more please?
    There is something so appealing about backhanding someone across the face with a shield.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodasafa View Post
    I already have enough expertise without the mallet to achive the hard cap for dodge.

    At this point in time if I were to put on all my expertise gear I would only have 52 skill, wich is still short of the Parry hard cap.

    So what I dont understand is if Im over the dodge cap in expertise with the cleaver, how dose the mallet give me more threat?

    I dont see how it would. could you elaborate more please?
    Equiping the Mallet as a human increases your expertise skill by 8.55 points. Even if you're above the dodge cap, that's still 2.14% of your attacks that will now land instead of being parried. If you were previously using the Cleaver, you do lose 12 hit rating (0.76% hit), but in the end you're still landing 1.38% more attacks with the Mallet.

    Just for the heck of it, let's pretend you put a +10 Hit gem in the Cleaver. Going from the Cleaver to the Mallet you gain 2.14% parry reduction via Expertise, and lose 1.39% chance to hit from the 22 Hit rating. Mallet wins again.

    Not sure how else to explain it. Hopefully this makes sense.




    By the way, a little off-topic, but in case you're looking for other ways to optimise your gear, consider the following:

    Your current chest and bracer enchants and glove gems give you:
    - 270 hp
    - 18 defense rating.

    If you were to enchant your chest and bracers with Defense (+15 and +12 respectively) and gems your gloves with +12 and +15 stam (just to maintain the equivalence), you would end up with:
    - 270 hp
    - 27 defense rating.
    Armstrong
    <Elysium>
    Burning Legion US

  7. #7
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    The set you armory me on was my trash set I logged out in last night while trying to lvl my 1h axe skill to 350.

    I had to put the defense gems in those gloves to reach 490 def, as with most ZA peices blizz convneintly forgot defense equips.

    Im a raid MT for my guild and have no problem tanking the bosses in the content we do 6/6 ZA, 5/6 SSC, 2/4 TK, 1/5 Hyjal and we did a dip into BT and got Naj' to 35%. I have a EH set, Avoidance set, and a Threat set.

    Im just trying to figure out the best place for my new cleaver in those sets, if there is a place for it at all. I knew the mallet was the best wepon I could get as a human warrior, but I was seeing if the cleaver would work somewhere.

    If Im understanding your analysis of the threat issue.. The mallet with executioner is the best for threat because even though I will not completley stop parries from getting thru (because im not hard capped), I still will recive more of a chance to avoid them because of the added expertise.

    Is that right?

    If so in all reality the Mallet should be my only wepon thru all the sets im thinking. Cause canceling out dodges and parries in a boss fight is a high priority. If thats the case I would rather have mongoose on it for all around utility. I guess in the end I wasted a bunch of badges on new gems for my cleaver/glove to get to 490 and a but load of mats on executioner, when I had the best all around set up to begin with. Mallet with mongoose.
    There is something so appealing about backhanding someone across the face with a shield.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodasafa View Post
    If Im understanding your analysis of the threat issue.. The mallet with executioner is the best for threat because even though I will not completley stop parries from getting thru (because im not hard capped), I still will recive more of a chance to avoid them because of the added expertise.

    Is that right?
    Yes, more attacks that land = more threat.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bodasafa View Post
    If so in all reality the Mallet should be my only wepon thru all the sets im thinking. Cause canceling out dodges and parries in a boss fight is a high priority. If thats the case I would rather have mongoose on it for all around utility. I guess in the end I wasted a bunch of badges on new gems for my cleaver/glove to get to 490 and a but load of mats on executioner, when I had the best all around set up to begin with. Mallet with mongoose.
    Going to disagree here. There are many boss fights where threat is not a priority and where having a second weapon focused on survivability stats is a good thing. Given that you can switch weapons in combat, you might as well max out your two weapons' potential in each particular field. Mongoose on your stam / avoidance weapon, Executioner on your threat weapon.

    I agree however that epic gems and weapons enchants are expensive. If you'd rather stick with only one weapon, Mongoose is the better all-around tanking enchant indeed.
    Armstrong
    <Elysium>
    Burning Legion US

  9. #9
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    Ok I think I understand now. Thank you for your help Armstrong.
    There is something so appealing about backhanding someone across the face with a shield.

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