I'm having a bit of a problem on Brutallus, I get killed. Alot. I just got my Commendation, and my Pocket Watch.
I have been gemming for Sta, seemingly the best BT Progression stat.
My question is:
Should I regem for Dodge, in Sunwell? I have acquired a pretty good Expertise/ Threat set for farmed BT bosses. I've seen tanks that are working on, and killed Brut, gemmed for Dodge. 3 in Chest, Two in Shoulders, and so on...
Wat shud eye dew!?
You can go either way. Personally I think that since I can't possibly get enough stamina to survive an entire extra hit during stomp compared to when I don't gem for stamina, it's more logical to gem for avoidance to reduce the chances of getting hit several times in a row. Both methods work fine though.
"We actually talked today about adding an item level 300 shirt that did absolutely nothing but mess with mods that attempt to boil down players to gear scores." -Ghostcrawler
For brutallus himself, you should first get your HP to 21-22k buffed, then mindlessly stack avoidance and armor from there.
Threat isn't really a issue since you get SO much rage that you can literally spam heroic strike on every single melee hit and you'll never be below 90 rage for more than half second.
If you can afford, best trinkets to use are Shadowmoon Insigna + Moroes Pocket Watch.
You can then rotate Moroes -> Insigna -> Last stand -> Moroes -> Insigna -> Shield Wall for the stomps. (us poor paladins use Nightmare Seeds instead of cooldowns <.< )
Worlde - Prot Paladin
Darkworldie - Tank DW Frost DK
Uord - Prot Warrior
Huordie - Feral / Resto Druid
Do your shaman have Ancestral Fortitude? It makes a world of difference during stops.
My question for Brutallus is this:
What consumables should a prot warrior be using against Brutallus? The main warrior tank that is doing it now uses: 30 stam food, 20 agility scroll, elixir of major defense, elixir of major agility, and ironshield potions throughout the fight.
My question is this: should I be using a flask of fortification instead of the elixirs? Also, I have heard that the Hyjal ring overrides any protection scrolls you have active, so I would use agility scrolls for him, but if you flask up, can you use a scroll on top of it? I used to know but can't remember.
Brutallus still waits for me, so I've not thought about the consumables in detail, although two elixirs might be an option for me. But before I can give a reliable answer I have to think about it (maybe a good time to start, because i guess I will see Bruta in 2-3 weeks).
To the general part: yes, it is correct, that the Hyjal ring overrides a protection scroll. That's the reason why one should have this in mind when comparing other rings to the Hyjal ring. You can still use agility and strengh scrolls, they are not effected (I wondered, because it seemed to me that you wanted to use them "instead", of course you can use both or all three, only that the protection scrolls vanishes if the ring proc occurs). At last: yes, you can use scrolls in combination with a flask.
I hope I could help you (and that it is not a problem that english is not my first language ;-)).
Survival, Survival, Survival.
Gear for survival. Get your 21-22K HP, then go for as much avoidance as you can. You'll want 24-25K minimum HP (or a ridiculous amount of avoidance) per stomp.
I can see an Agi/Def elixir combination working, but my guild provides flasks, so I've always run with fort.
Don't worry about threat stats on Brut. Stick to your rotation, you will have infinite rage. Have a plan for every stomp. Personally I use Trinket (shadowmoon, still don't have watch), Nightmare Seed, Last stand (couple are skipped because we hold taunts until stomp goes off), and shield wall for the last one, so the healers can throw a couple smites or whatever. When you farm enough sunwell gear and have the avoidance, you can start swapping in threat pieces.
As you get more comfortable in attempts and they get longer, you can consider using Xav's idea of a threat weapon early on, build a threat lead, then switch to your mitigation/avoidance weapon.
As far as gearing in sunwell, just try to swap for more avoidance gear at this point. A lot of the gear I used when learning, and on the first kill had a lot of avoidance on the gear itself. I gemmed for avoidance on some of the gear I got in sunwell, but unless you can get yourself a second set of T6 I wouldn't regem it.
Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity. -Seneca
Everyone marvels at a square egg, but only the chicken understands the PAIN.
I use Scroll of Protection/Agility, chain Ironshield Potions, eat a mudfish and have a fort flask on. The trinkets I personally use are the Commendation and the Pocket Watch.
On the first stomp, I use the pocket watch. Second stomp I use a nightmare seed/last stand. Third stomp I use the pocket watch again and the 4th stomp I use shield wall, then he dies.
Gurtogs trinket with a seed is baller for this too.
"Buy the ticket, take the ride" - Hunter
just tell your healers to not suck. i tank this shizz last week with 26 dodge 19 parry unbuffed, trinkets were autoblocker and commendation. forgot to switch from my trash set el oh el.
Your healers weren't great, you just were EXTREMELY lucky. I'm surprised you didn't die on stomps with less than 30% avoidance.
No healer, for how good he can be, can heal a roflstomp (stomp + 4 hits in a row)
Worlde - Prot Paladin
Darkworldie - Tank DW Frost DK
Uord - Prot Warrior
Huordie - Feral / Resto Druid
damn I didn't know what I just said would get taken so seriously. allow me to elaborate.
first off, and a minor point at that, i definitely had more than 30% avoidance (add like 7% from miss). So was I lucky? Sure. But you pretty much have to be to not die every single attempt. No gear, for how good it can be, can help you avoid all the roflstomps. it will happen, maybe a bit less often with more avoidance, but it will happen. At that point, it's all about heals landing and cooldowns being hit.
this is also not to say I advocate doing it in terrible avoidance gear, or would do it again myself. It's not a strain I would want to actively place on the raid every week. But I'm just putting it out there for those people who say "you have to have x% avoidance to tank brut".
When you post something as awful as your previous post, what do you expect?
Anyway, we recently killed Brutallus on our alts (with a few people in guilds that don't raid sunwell and started raiding with us on these characters), and had a 1% wipe the night before with one of our tanks in pretty atrocious gear.
Wow Web Stats
This is the armory of one of the tanks we used the first night, The World of Warcraft Armory
As you can see, pretty much nonexistant avoidance stats, due to gear being sub par in many slots.
This is one of the tanks we used on the kill: The World of Warcraft Armory
What I'm trying to say is, gearing isn't even the most important thing, it's being prepared for the stomps and how you handle them. Taunting at the proper times to minimize the number of stomps you tank through, and having a cooldown up for every one, with ample warning for the healers, will go a long way to keeping up even a sorely undergeared tank on Brutallus.
Wow, thank you Xav, that really boosts my confidence in tanking Brut. I have been listening to Ventrilo as they fight Brut and the tanks do seem to give ample warning when a stomp is incoming, or a taunt is. I think maybe the taunt rotation could be better, I am not sure. Throughout the fight only one stomp I believe is negated by taunting. I have talked to a couple other sunwell-clearing people and they say that their tanks only negated one stomp too, but from the way you worded your post, it would seem several stomps should be avoided.
Also, do you pop trinket/last stand/nightmare seed right before stomp? Or can you do it as he does it? Whenever I have been knocked on my ass as a tank, I usually can do nothing whatsoever, but I don't know if stomp works differently.
Last edited by Myntokk; 07-22-2008 at 12:30 PM.
You'll generally only die shortly after a stomp hits, not several seconds into one, so it's usually okay to pop the cooldown right before you expect the stomp to come (since there's like a 2 second window where he can decide to use his abilities) and be okay.
what i said was pretty much true and mirrors exactly what you said (and i've been saying it since my guild's first brut kill), except i just failed to mention the minimizing stomp dmg by timing taunts appropriately, but i assumed that was understood as a basic aspect of the fight?
Last edited by byechee; 07-22-2008 at 02:16 PM.
I was talking about this:Originally Posted by byechee
That should've been obvious too, right?
Since we are on the brutallus topic, and even though tanking in our attempts seems good I 've been reevaluating my tactic. I mostly use avoidance trinkets on the tank switch, since I usually find it more dangerous than stomp. Do you think this is the wrong approach? I have fair avoidance (about 38% dodge 22-23% parry almost 8% miss) and I usually sit at 21.3k hp with commanding and fortification flask. After having discussed it with a healer as well he says stomp is usually not that much of a problem since they know exactly when it is due to hit, however the taunts can sometimes vary depending if we are trying to avoid a stomp or if brutallus is casting, etc.
This does of course leave me vulnerable on those "unlucky" stomps where you get hit by stomp main hand and offhand in very short timeframes.
I use pocketwatch + empyrean tortoise on the switches, and seed / last stand / shieldwall (if needed) on the stomps. There have been times that I had wasted my trinkets because I had burn and have done transitions successfully, and there are times that I may be using pocketwatch (+16%) and still die on a tank switch.
Do you think I should change my tactic to make stomp easier?
You shouldn't die during a transition, ever. I'm not being a jerk when I say this - your healers need to learn to adjust.
"We actually talked today about adding an item level 300 shirt that did absolutely nothing but mess with mods that attempt to boil down players to gear scores.
Sorry, next time I'll make it more clear I knew what you were referring to, and only said what I said to redeem myself after your scathing remarks!
Xav is a mean one, but his bark is worse then his bite. =P
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