Taunt the boss NOW!!!

Paladins can. But you need somebody to taunt the boss before you hit heroic will to keep the threat lead.

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Originally Posted by Dreador

If the debuff is blockable, why does a CTC capped tank get sundered at all? I find the debuff falls off once in a blue moon but I attributed it do avoidance rather than a block. Other than that I agree about the debuffs at least on normal, my other tank is a little derp and I've been double-debuffed rather often without problems.

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ok maybe blocklable was being precise over accurate, you can block the attack, but block only works against the damage, debuffs still get applied as they have since i started playing

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Originally Posted by Tengenstein

ok maybe blocklable was being precise over accurate, you can block the attack, but block only works against the damage, debuffs still get applied as they have since i started playing

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Actually, it used to be (WAAAY back in patch 1.3ish) that if you blocked even 1 damage, no debuff would be applied. A lot of Rogues and Warriors complained it it got changed to what it is now (if it does damage, it does its debuff)

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Originally Posted by Herr Drache

Ah yes, the good old BC times, where you had that great definition of "Main Tank" and "Off Tank" which still haunts us - and pisses me off!
Main Tank: Gets all the glory and all the first upgrades. Why? Because he drags the boss over there somewhere and keeps him still.
Off Tank: Gets the "Oh, you're just the off tank" treatment. Stands around somewhere to eat sparks. Stands around somewhere to eat the Hurtful Strike" Or runs around like mad collecting adds.

Thank you. I'd rather taunt-swap a single boss, or taunt-swap adds (Hi Ulduar Trash!) and have both tanks required to be similarly geared - and it not really matter "do you or I take him first", because it's two tanks playing, not MT and OT.

And I hate the current "Oh, single tank everything" stuff. If I wanted to play DPS, I'd bring my mage. Or my rogue. No, I don't have a dps spec, and my bags are full with trinkets and gear already. And the other tank is a tank because he likes tanking, too - and because he hates being Ret.

BC wasn't all great and wonderful, and Cata isn't all bad.

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Funny thing about the Main Tank getting all of the glory is normally the Off-tank's job was harder. I also personally dont remember that much of a hierachy, the MT always got gear first for progression purposes. Bare in mind TBC had a lot of encounters that required more then 2 tanks (something I think they should revisit in Hard Modes what with dual spec n all) so there was normally a defacto Main Off-Tank if not an official one who was considered damn near as important. It was the ones under the main Off-tank that got shafted lol.

Well, if we want to get technical, a blood DK with pro button skills can solo tank ultraxion without any help at all. And yes, Spine and Madness are also very doable with 1 tank on 10n (not sure about 25 for madness).

Warmaster: I've been wanting to try one tanking that for while now. The adds debuffs just kind of tickle a little bit, and with good DPS and alternating priority i imagine they could be kept well under control. The only thing that separates Blackhorn from Morchok IMO, is that Blackhorn's hits actually pack a solid punch, and even more so when he's at -30%. That and at around 8(?) stacks Morchok will have a blood of the earth phase which lets you drop your stacks. But I would imagine for Blackhorn there is a simple enough way to get your stacks off. Maybe tanking in one corner and running to an apposing corner while he casts Shockwave, further mobility from there.

We semi-one tank Warmaster 10 man. We use one tank for the adds (our Warrior) and the other tank (DK) runs around getting in whatever little swirls he can and Deathgripping Sappers. When the boss lands both tanks go to him, but I can't say they really taunt off; he's been dying pretty fast these days. Healing the raid provides more work than the tank. I'd say it's pretty one tankable. Especially, when Radiance hits 10%.

This is all on normal.

I wouldn't want to solo-tank blackhorn until 15% (P2 at least, the tank damage in P1 was pathetic before the debuff, and is even moreso now). Without a cooldown running, his melee swings and Devastate can get really evil sub 20% with more than 3 stacks of the ArP debuff.

1 tank - 2 heal is actually easily possible for every single normal mode (+ you can solo heal Morchok np) if you have people skilled enough. I would say that all heroics apart from Madness are 2-healable at the moment. Some heroics are even solo-healable like Ultraxion and Warmaster (we have only solo-healed P2 on heroic because a healer was DC, but p1 requires a lot less healing anyway, so I think it's possible to do if you pop your mana CDs + a potion at the transition from P1 to P2). My point is, a really good healer, with the support of high enough DPS to down everything really fast, could most likely solo-heal every single DS fight on normal and I'm not even convinced it needs that much gear. You'd just have to be assisted by tank 4-sets on heavy AoE damage phases like Warlord black and you are good to go.

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Originally Posted by Valaras

Some heroics are even solo-healable like Ultraxion and Warmaster (we have only solo-healed P2 on heroic because a healer was DC, but p1 requires a lot less healing anyway, so I think it's possible to do if you pop your mana CDs + a potion at the transition from P1 to P2).

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Just looking at our recent kills, it's 60k rdps during phase 2 with both drake and boss up and until the end and that's ~ 180 seconds. Adding another dps might decrease the time spent in that phase by 20-30s but that's still an insane job to pull off. On the plus side: disrupting roar is on a long cooldown and you got all the time in the world to bring your raid back up but the tanks eat 30k on top of that.

Phase 1 don't require high hps (compared to p2 - 40-50k ish depending on your raids ability to avoid blade rush) but some neat bursts to top soakers off.

Anyway i just want to rephrase

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Originally Posted by Valaras

if you have people skilled enough.

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to "if you have people geared enough." I assume that your roster don't change totally and people don't have to adapt to completely new playstyles, just pushing their buttons at the start of t13 as hard as today... but all those procc trinkets & weapons + 4 piece boni on everyone is an insane push over t12 gear (eg arms warrior +30% total dps), making fights considerable shorter (on top of those recently implemented icecrown esque buff).

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Originally Posted by klausi

Anyway i just want to rephrase

to "if you have people geared enough." I assume that your roster don't change totally and people don't have to adapt to completely new playstyles, just pushing their buttons at the start of t13 as hard as today... but all those procc trinkets & weapons + 4 piece boni on everyone is an insane push over t12 gear (eg arms warrior +30% total dps), making fights considerable shorter (on top of those recently implemented icecrown esque buff).

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No, normal modes do not need ridiculous gear to solo heal. Some people push their buttons better than others and that's it.