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10 man heroic nef:
is the accepted strat to push all electrocutes in phase 3? Im the ony+add tank in phase 1, and the add tank in phase 3 - and by the time the shadowflames are at 5 second intervals nef still has 35-40% health left, making it quite difficult for me.
If you can't control the adds properly (= need to tank them) you'll have to push all crackles during phase 3 or the adds will gib you at around 20 stacks even with shieldwall, shieldblock and trinket up during a breath. Having only one drake breathing and tail-lashing makes phase 3 more attractive as well.
The shadowflames never come at a 5 second interval, it's always 10 seconds -> I've enough time for plant my shockwaves in between during all the fight. The only problem might be that you're running out of external cooldowns for crackle but that's less likely with the added raid shout, spirit link totem and shield block reducing magical damage as well.
Technically you can kite the adds infinitely in terms of the shadowflame casts. At it's lowest point its 10s between casts, but it feels shorter since the travel time of the flame gives you about 5s after it hits the ground before the next one is being cast because of travel time. You can indeed do all of the fight in p3, if you are kiting correctly and not moving to much on each movement so you don't run out of room.
The point is: if you want to kill Nefarian heroic, you have to be able to kite the adds well either way - even if you only need 6-7 crackles in phase 3. I donīt think its possible to mess kiting up and somehow "zerg" Nefarian down (at least not more than 10-15%). And if you figure out how to do it, it doesnīt really matter how long you have to do it.Quote:
10 man heroic nef:
is the accepted strat to push all electrocutes in phase 3? Im the ony+add tank in phase 1, and the add tank in phase 3 - and by the time the shadowflames are at 5 second intervals nef still has 35-40% health left, making it quite difficult for me.
I (Warrior), too, have to kite the adds in Phase 3 and it took me 5-6 tries to figure it out. Also they have to be positioned well in Phase 1 so they get all hit by the first blaze at once (or at least 4 of of them at once). This makes kiting them lot easier since they will all fall apart at the same time and you also can pick them up together again.
My biggest issue was our Main-Tank, a DK, pulling heal aggro from Skeletons that were resurrected across the room because of bad luck (shado blazes missing them continuesly) or a healer pulling aggro without me being in range to taunt them. Because of that my healer has been a Paladin with Righteous Fury activated, he basically always has the initial aggro. Also, DK healing doesnīt produce aggro anymore (yay!).
Maybe if you could describe, whats the problem for you, I could provide more tips.
Apart from kiting, I think it should be possible to have some crackles in Phase 2 now. The damage is laughable compared to before 4.1.
Wrong place--I meant to put this in the normal thread...
Not true. We had a death on a platform and someone else on that platform went to the wrong one. Needless to say the other 2 platforms had to stop dps at under 10% and just sit there interrupting not attacking until the last platform finally got it low enough to push (at least a minute later).Quote:
Originally Posted by Herbnosis
There is a "premature" end but it is when a single add dies not 30%
Sorry, I meant to post that comment in the normal thread, which is why I deleted it here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Darksend
To those who have actually succussfully killed Nefarian, from what I gather, it's basically the same fight as normal,
except in phase 1 you have the portal thing so people need to mash 2 until next to portal press 1, and dps like nuts with new boost?
in phase 2. you have people who get debuffed jump off (need more interrupt redundancy for this, but if we already had 3 interrupters per platform we're covered yes?) and because of this, we don't push any extra electrocutes during phase 2.
phase 3 doesn't seem to have any change at all except it's a lot longer now because of lack of phase 2 dps on nef. Is this right or Am i missing something. we've started working on him and I think we have phase 1 down and just need to work on phase 2 and want to be prepared for phase 3.
correct, but realistically you will only push 1 crackle (on normal we did 2 or sometimes even 3)Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazeyonoma
correct. unless you have 3 priests with barriers one on each platform but it really is a waste of cooldowns and healer mana especially if your kiter is reliable.Quote:
in phase 2. you have people who get debuffed jump off (need more interrupt redundancy for this, but if we already had 3 interrupters per platform we're covered yes?) and because of this, we don't push any extra electrocutes during phase 2.
You should end this phase between 85-82%
also in 25 man (do not know in 10 but since you have 3 interrupters per I assume you are asking about 25) 3 debuffs go out at a time. I assume 1 interrupt per platform is a ranged interrupt who can hit it from the lava in the VERY VERY unlikely event that all 3 go on the same platform (no truly random sequence is random if the same thing does not happen a few times in a row. last week 3 wipes in a row because all 3 healers on a platform got the first debuff 3 attempts in a row)
you get the portals in phase 3 like you did in phase 1Quote:
phase 3 doesn't seem to have any change at all except it's a lot longer now because of lack of phase 2 dps on nef. Is this right or Am i missing something. we've started working on him and I think we have phase 1 down and just need to work on phase 2 and want to be prepared for phase 3.
Ah, okay, so yeah i expected that to be the case, and with the portals in phase 3, you basically get a damage buff to make up for the larger health pool going into it. phase 3 is essentially all on the kiting tank to kite/survive the entire duration of the fight, and dps just goes boom boom and not fail domination. That's what I expected. (yes we have several shamans that we split across the platforms to wind shear in 25m)
If you have a fury warrior rallying cry is amazing for when you don't have a barrier for the raid. Even in full 372 gear (hence the extra stam from iLvl) crackle will one shot most classes without some sort of a cooldown even from 100%. But beyond that, disc priests are a must for phase 3 and properly timing barriers. As you get better gear and you push each 10% faster you get to a point where even with 3 barriers they are all on cooldown for the 4th one in a row at some point.
We are consistently getting through stage 1 and 2 and into stage 3 with 25 people up. We get fairly far into stage 3, we are ahead of the enrage timer, and everything seems good. But as we get towards 30% some adds always have 30+ stacks. Our add tank always dies, even with 4 healers assigned to him. Is this normal? Or is our kiter doing something wrong, and if so what can be done to fix it. Does anyone have a detailed explanation from someone that has done it using the tankspot strat on a kill?
Well obviously your kiter is doing something wrong, its either him haveing the adds near the shadowblaze or the Nefarian`s shadowflame breath is hitting them. If they dont reset each 50 seconds its going to be nearly impossible to heal your add tank regardless of how many healers you stick on him.
To avoid his head you can
- move nefarian with his gut always faceing the add tank as he kites (have to move the raid too)
or be static and let your tank know that this breath will always be in a cone faceing S/N/E/W so he can always keep that in mind and avoid as much as possible that territory.
To avoid haveing bad shadowblaze reset the add livetime you can
- pile your adds in p1 better so they all stand up on the first cast or just stick em in fire so they all have the same energy in the beguining.
- emphase your shadowblaze timer in your boss mods and stick the adds in the border of the outer circle and move when you hear ''one'' on the counter.
-face your camera on top of your head and zoom out enouth so you can see how fire moves and where nefarian head/tail is.
Proper reset happen at 13-14 empower, so there's something really wrong there. Especially on 25m he shouldn't worry to much about selfcooldowns, there are plenty of external cooldowns whose can take care of electrocute spikes. Focus on the job and that's proper kiting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooberz
In my experience using the DBM shadowblaze warning, you want to move them about 3-4 seconds when you see the "shadowblaze soon" warning. Just strafe full speed away from the landing spot and then park them there. If you have a shockwave ability, the best time to use it is right after you just pulled them away from the incoming shadow blaze. If you have good timing, and move an appropriate distance, then you will never run out of room to kite, and the fire will never creep into the raid (it will chase you instead).
What is the name of the addon you use for explosive cinders?
When will the Shadowblaze fires disappear? I m quite expierenced with kiting adds on normal mode. In our early tries, i had to reset them 2 times. How often do i have to reset them on hero?
We tank nefarion in one "corner" so i have a "D" as kiting place. Is this tactic still viable, or will i run out of place because of the fires?
We'd like to finish this current tier with alittle bit of a bang and were thinking about going to Heroic Nef and skipping over Omnitron and Conclave in favor of the harder fight. If we get it we can really feel good about ourselves going into firelands and get to see a more challenging version of a fight most people in the raid really enjoy. With 4.2 persumably close there isn't a whole lot of time to finish this teir and we'd like to get a nice cap stone fight before time runs out. We're under no illusion this fight is going to easy but everyone is excited at the prospect of trying it, even if we don't kill him in time.
We have pretty solid interrupts, tanking and healing on the normal mode version of the encounter. I'd apprciate some input from other people on if there's anything we're missing going in. Why should we try? Why shouldn't we?
- Healing can be rough during phase 2 (~ 45-50k hps) and you'll need a backup interrupt for every platform (any shaman/paladin healer can do that, shouldn't happen more often then once a try). This can also be true for phase 1 if you don't kite the adds and your Onyxia tank gather them all, i can peak up to 20kish while cycling through my cooldowns with a tail-lash knockdown on my two healers once in a while.
- Your tanks* will need the Tol Barad trinket (which they should have farmed anyway) or they'll run out of cooldowns for crackle. *except for DK because they have AMS :X
- Go for Nef, if your offtank is (really) decent at kiting. I'd rank that fight below Brainfuck-o-tron.
You can't tank Nef in a corner on heroic. Fire takes about 90 to despawn I think.