10 man -
Ok, so we are trying this strat with the Frost DK, in tank gear, in blood presence, blasting the worms and kiting - which works beautifully, but i noticed one thing, i cannot click on Magmaw's head AT ALL when im 10'/5'/or standing right on him. I get the grey arrow, but no matter how close or how far I am to him, it never turns green.
When i go pure dps and stay dpsing on him and we let the ranged dps handle the adds, without the kiting DK, then the arrow lights up just fine for me and i have no problems getting on his head.
Has this mechanic been recently changed, as of the patch that went down on 2/15/11???
The only other option we have is to bring one other melee dps to the raid, taking out a ranged to jump on his head with me still kiting the adds. Will this work or is there something im missing or?
Wondering if the mechanics of this fight have changed in the last week or two? Does the one person at range strategy still work?
My guild tried magmaw tonight for our first time. i was expecting a really rocky experience figuring were made of a bunch of raiders that just recently came back to wow after a 9 month vacation. Our group consisted of one pally tank on magmaw, we had a DK kiting the worms, 2 arcane mages, 1 ele shammy, 1 fury warrior, 1 rogue and 3 heals(priest,druid,shammy combo). it was a bit rocky at first with how melee heavy the group was but ended up downin the boss anyway after our 6-7th attempt. The main problem we ran into was our warrior getting smashed as the head pops back up but to counter that we just had him pop into prot stance right before he popped back up and that usually gave him just enough to survive. we had only the two mages and the dk dpsn the worms with both mages just single targeting and had absolutly no issues with them. all would be dead before the head dropped so all dps could just unload on magmaw. last attempt all dps were pushin min of 10k and went down like a charm :)
My guild and I have wiped on this guy about 10 or so times now (which was partly because of strategy and not being well enough geared, they are now though). My question is, I've seen a lot of strategies that rely on kiting the adds around. Myself (warrior tank) and a Prot Pally are our two tanks. Would I be better off kiting the adds as my warrior, or would the Pally make more sense? And in kiting the adds, am I just holding threat on them and kiting then throughout the room making sure none get to the "melee group?" Like would I just be thunderclapping/shockwave/demo shouting to keep them on me, but not getting hit by them, or would we be better off having the pally tank them?
I realize that a DK tank would probably be the best strategy, but I can't guarantee that one will be there. Also, what would they do? Just continue to kite the adds around the room?
Thanks to all for the strategies.
Yannzi - I'd like to reiterate: Hunter traps + Boomkin shrooms = 50% of the worms HP. Add in cyclone for pushback and the fight becomes fairly easy as long as people move out of the steam.
If you don't have a well geared add tank that can kill the worms quickly, you're looking at maybe needing a third healer (2 to help the MT through mangle). Maybe as you gear this won't be as needed. So you're looking at MT, OT, 2-3 healers and 5-6 DPS.
With a boomkin and hunter (I am assuming you have access to these - which may not be the case) you're looking at MT, 2 healers, and 7 DPS. The extra DPS on the adds and Magmaw really speeds up the fight.
I feel like that I could either have myself or the Pally tank the adds with a little help from a warlock, hunter, and mage?
Glyped Shadowflame (I think it's shadowflame) from a warlock applies a 70% slow. I'm just not sure of any other classes with a pushback. The shrooms of doom helps a lot and then the pushback. The pushback for if DPS isn't fast enough is as important as the shrooms for doing a tankless fight.
It's still possible, as long as range DPS is quick to switch (DBM says Pillar of Fire range ignores Magmaw and gets ready to AoE down adds) and it is pretty good. Save a bunch on heals too.
Traditional Strat: This is the one you find in the video attached at the beginning, wherein you have a range pile that moves collectively and deals with the parasites. The video does a masterful job with the detail explanation and I see no reason to needlessly repeat it here. Pros to this strat: you get training handling ads, which is important for later fights (the last 3 bosses, especially) and your raid awareness is tested. Cons: 1 idiot can wipe the raid. Easy to get out of control very quickly.
Alternative "easy mode" strat: Everyone excepting the magmaw tank and a kiter will be in the melee pile. Calling the kiter the "parasite tank" is a bit of a misnomer, because the person dealing with that (which we will henceforth call "the worm dude" for the sake of simplicity) doesn't actually HAVE to be a tank. We happen to use our DK tank because we don't need two tanks on the fight and he can grab range aggro easily. But that is really the crux of it. Whoever stays out to handle the ads doesn't NEED to be a tank, they just have to be able to grab and HOLD aggro on the worms, preferably at some sort of range. Hunters, Boomies, Frost and fire mages, frost DKs...All are perfectly viable options for the worm dude. We even had an elemental shammy do it with little trouble.
The tank tanks magmaw, everyone but the worm dude dps's magmaw from inside 5 yards, and the worm dude hangs out, grabs all the worms, and kites them around the room. Note that when performing this strat, it becomes completely unnecessary to DPS the worms. The worm dude is keeping them busy by running about and should never be hit. Even if you are hit as the worm dude, it isn't the end of the world. One or two parasites getting ahold of you should barely phase you, esp if a healer is ready to throw some love your way. The worms only become an issue, head bursting wise, if they get into the melee pile. That's when you get overwhelmed.
To recap: Magmaw tank on magmaw, worm dude at range kiting worms, everyone else kitty corner to the tank dpsing Magmaw from within 5 yards. If dps are feeling helpful, they can toss a frost trap or a blast wave or something out there to help on the parasites, but I'd just rather you spend the GCD on Magmaw instead, esp since you risk messing with the worm dude's aggro. You could have a lock or a hunter pet on aggressive going nuts in the worm pile, since pets can't be infected, but even that is unnecessary. Really the only thing that the dps have to worry about at that point is avoiding the steam, which, at least for us, is rarely an issue. The whole point of this strat is to remove the need to DPS the parasites, instead focusing all that firepower Magmaw.
Pros: It's easy. The "easy mode" strat allows you to down Magmaw with less gear then is recommended, and takes most of the need for raid awareness and places it squarely on the shoulders of 1 to 2 people. It's much easier to "carry" raids or undergeared toons this way.
Cons: All of the early fights are practice and training for aspects of later fights. By bypassing learning add control and raid awareness, you shoot yourself in the foot for fights like Cho'Gal and Maloriak. Then again, if you're having trouble on Magmaw the mechanics of farther along bosses prolly aren't of much concern.
To answer your question more directly, I would go with the warrior to kite ads (although personally I'd be looking at one of the rDPS as a better option for "worm dude" and just have the OT switch to DPS for the fight). While neither the pally or warrior are ideal, the warrior has more range aggro and "get in and get out" options in heroic throw, thunderclap, heroic leap, cleave, etc... Pallies are just fine at tanking but in my experience they need to be in the mix to really build and hold aggro, and, at least when it comes to being the worm dude, in the mix is not where you want to be.
I'm a bit frustrated that neither the video nor the seven pages of ensuing discussion here mention Massive Crash even once.
We had everyone stack in melee range, 1 Hunter at range to deal with the adds. We did ask RDPS to switch off Magmaw and kill the adds though after reading the discussion here I think we will just have everyone stay on Magmaw in our next attempts.
That being said, the raid was still taking huge amounts of damage from Massive Crash. Tankspot doesn't mention this ability. It's not even documented on Wowhead's database. The only written guide I could find that mentions it is at raidbs.com and he says "Shortly after each Mangle, Magmaw will use this ability." which is NOT accurate in my experience. Massive Crash was occurring BEFORE Mangle and there didn't seem to be any indication of its direction or how it could be effectively avoided.
The damage was taxing our healers, and eventually causing wipes.
So does anyone have accurate information on this ability and how to properly predict and avoid it?
When you chain him (during Mangle) he will drop down once before rodeo is over. Everyone standing in his front will get hit from Massive Crash, but it only has a very short range.. 8y maximum.
For people who are having trouble with magmaw insta killing a dps while only running one tank. When your tank gets mangled he has the ability to attack magmaws head. Your tank also has the ability to tab through targets and will get Magmaw and the exposed head of magmaw. Every time magmaw Mangles the Main tank loses agro and the next person in line will be hit and possibly killed by a 100k+ hit. While the tank who is being mangled is in the head that person can taunt the normal boss and regain agro and move back to doing dps on the head. It's a slight dps loss to the tank to taunt but overall it's a dps gain because your not going to have your dps potentially die because the tank doesn't have agro.
this is kind of a rundown of how I do it in 10m
I get mangled(and lose agro)
I dps the head of magmaw
2 dps get on magmaw and chains
magmaw comes up I target his body and taunt
he goes down releasing me and I continue dpsing
he comes back up and starts attacking me.
no dps die or get hit and healers don't have anything to worry about.
When we first did it we ran 2 tanks to taunt the boss when the first tank got mangled but once we realized that the main tank can taunt magmaw then we were able to run with just 1 tank.
The only problem is when we try it again we probably won't have a DK, but we couldn't seem to get Maloriak down right away. It takes some time, but I think that we'll get there. The biggest thing is getting those adds down. It seems like we only got the adds down quick enough because of the DK's howling blast, so I wonder how we will do if we don't have that.
We made our first real run at this boss last night in 10 man. I think we have the pillar-parasite mechanic down - we're using a kiting method. We also have the burn phase mechanic down. The problem we seem to be having is that our healers are tapped on mana by the time the first burn phase is down.
Our last attempt of the evening netted us our best result - 20%. But our healers still feel like they're struggling for mana.
This change was put in last week
Anyone have any knowledge of how much of a change this was?Quote:
Magmaw overall damage and health was a little too high on all difficulties and has been reduced slightly.
From one of the hardest heroics in Blackwing (dps and healing requirements) to totally doable for everyone who can beat Chimaeron or Maloriak.
Time requirement down ~ 20% & tank as well as raiddamage down ~ 15%
I would agree with the assessment above. We struggled with this fight last week as our healers had a difficult time keeping up (as mentioned above) but last night, our healers found the fight entirely manageable and after a couple of unfortunate wipes because of movement, we were able to down him.