That made me chuckle. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Wickedtribe
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That made me chuckle. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Wickedtribe
People need to learn that that the first part of H HoR is CC fight, not a mob tank and spank. If more players used their CC abilities (or even remembered they had them), it would make it sooooo much easier.
So i've noticed everyone is saying to run infront of the lich king in the second piece... I 've actually found standing at the door and waiting for that whirling white shit around him to start... Once he starts walking forward just follow him... Here's the key... The abominations and everything spawn right ontop of the tank... which gives you a good 20 second head start on all mobs that come out.. its quite easy to handle the mobs this way too..
the first part really pisses me off though... blizzard may have made it a bit to challenging for people... most groups i've gotten wont get on vent to talk back and forth so you really have to know what your doing as any class, but specifically in this run... it makes dps actually do part of their jobs... CCing... because people havnt really been doing this for so long always feeling the tank should just grab it all and boom down they go... (these days are gone) people actually have to help the tank out in this, so i dont think its a tanks fault and we shouldnt be getting the blunt end because people cant get used to the fact that they do need to CC now.
i'll stop freakin out just had to put in my two cents... btw let me know if behind the lich king works out better for yas :)
Geezus pete. Had a DK do AotD on the last ice wall group that came out. Had two abominations turning like merry-go-rounds. Very irritating. Only issue I have with this dungeon is really to get DPS to follow your lead. Kill the targets you want kills and so far.
The waves for the first two bosses can be tank and spanked. Mostly focus fire the mage and priest then the mercenaries I would say. Other than that its pretty cake.
Considering that most of the mobs are melee (even the priests) it's pretty trivial to get them rounded up and then drag the bunch over to the ranged mob that pops.Quote:
People need to learn that that the first part of H HoR is CC fight, not a mob tank and spank. If more players used their CC abilities (or even remembered they had them), it would make it sooooo much easier.
Sure, you get two ranged occasionally, but it's not too hard to deal with that. I'll usually drag the bunch to the hunter and occasionally feral charge/bash the mage. (And they don't do much damage anyway.)
I prefer not to use CC or LoS tricks on this fight. It's one of the few places that I actually get to work a little as a tank.
After a lot of dieing, and cycling out three different DPSers that just couldn't cut it we managed to do this with a not so great healer.
Warrior tank. We did this the hall way strat. I had a paladin and rogue, the paladin would usually pentence a mage or priest possibly turn undead if we had two mages. The only real problem you run into with tanking some of the ranged ones is if you get stunned by a mercenary. Our Kill order was Priest > Mercenary > What ever is left/not cced.
It's important to remember that you can drag the Hunters to you with disarm if you have to, and to kill the hallucination of the mage before the mage. Make sure you're standing the furthest out when each spawn starts to get aggro and your DPS knows to focus/ LoS something if they're getting hit. Only had some one die if I got CC'd to hell by the mobs.
The strat here of tanking the Aboms and focusing the witches worked like a charm for us, we cycled out the rogue for his bank alt Arms war and it was easy mode.
Was wondering if anyone had some wise suggestions for the Fear boss? We got killed like 3 times on him, but that's mostly a healer fight.. isn't it?
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Originally Posted by Baridin
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Originally Posted by Kiyah
I have not done this, as Warr tank, yet, but as Shadow Priest. The alcove, I think, is still best, but what I would do as Warrior tank, would be to position more out front of the alcove, to grab aggro, and charge/intercept the melee and riflemen, who seem to enjoy heading straight for the clothies. As Shadow, I could handle the riflemen, although they slowed my casting down a lot--the buggers. But the melee mobs hurt--I would kite them to the tank, or Fade, and that would do the trick. More than once, I've stood between them and the healer to draw aggro, too. Perhaps a melee dps, in the group could watch for them, and drag them out of the alcove to the tank, too.
Point is, in that fight, the tank needs the dps to wait extra long, for him to gain aggro, with each wave, and that reduces the mobs peeling off to harry the others, but the dps, and healer have to be smart, too, and not stand there like deer in headlights, getting hit, while they try to do the usual dot and burn...go to tank, let him gain aggro, then go back in alcove. Don't wait for tank to taunt, or intervene, as he may not see, or be able to leave four or more mobs to do so, depending on stage of the fight. Use CC, or avoidance abilities, on whomever enters the alcove (or gets behind the tank, in the hallway scenario). It's a frantic, but fun fight, if everyone gets this...
I must say, I completely forgot about shackle, as I've never used it before, but I will remember it, next time...melee mob, I'm looking at you!!
Oh, and when it gets to the mini boss, at the end of the waves? Everyone go outside the alcove, spread out, and throw up anti-fear trinkets, spells, interrupts. When not feared, burn him down!!
Had done it a couple of times as a DPSer, but tried H-HoR as a tank for the first time this morning with a fresh 80 healer friend. I found it really difficult and we never were able to get past Falric. I had a lot of respect for tanks previously but after seeing HoR from the tank side, any tank that kept it under control, you're gods amongst men.
Having never played as a DK tank seriously probably did not help especially when I went into a spec I had no experience with (standard Frost). Long cooldown on death and decay made it difficult to use more than once per wave or risk not having it initially on the next wave. Through the first half of the AoE threat cycle, I found it immensely difficult to grab threat quickly with all the LULS MUST SPAM AOE DPSers (DnD -> Diseases -> Pestilence), I wouldn't even get to Howling Blast in time it felt like.
I have mixed feelings about hiding inside the LoS alcove. It makes sense but with DPSers that don't interrupt or move out of fire, having a mage drop flamestrike on that corner tended to get people killed because they took the stand in corner too literally.
As well, I felt as though I was taking a lot of damage the whole time with mobs dancing all around. If I wasnt able to position them with a hungering cold, they pretty much ran willy nilly hitting me from any direction.
I think it's also extra difficult given that even if you were lucky enough to random some DPS pugs that would CC, as a DK, you just ended up pestilencing and breaking it.
They dont need toQuote:
Originally Posted by Kiyah
Then stand near the healer, problem solved if hes not willing to stop pre-healing but hes breaking LoSQuote:
Originally Posted by Kiyah
Let them dieQuote:
Originally Posted by Kiyah
If people just break LoS they come to you. You can still fight them hidden in a corner..Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiyah
Taunt and run out of LoS works fine.
Worked wonders. Makes the fight a joke. Mobs get tanked quicker and in turn die faster. the 6 minute run is even simpler.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tacticaldragon
In HoR, there are two no-longer used WoW concepts that makes the fights stupidly easier.
1) LoS pulling (corners)
2) CC
For the first one, this is pretty straightforward. I do suggest once the mobs get to you that everyone but the take get out of the corner, though. This prevent Flamestrikes/priest aoes from eating your crew.
For the second...Misdirect works great in here. Disarm works on the hunters, keeping them close. Stuns are godly, everyone that has them should be keeping the priest/mage locked down as much as possible. Ditto with interrupts. Death grip is great if you get a ranged mob out of control. Even if the DPS casts it, you can taunt back. Freezing arrow also works well on hunters/mages. Frost nova works great on EVERYTHING. So does Shackle. Yeah, shackle. Whens the last time you used that, kara probably? Works great though. If all else fails Turn Evil works, And this is also one situation where AoTD might not be a bad thing if things go south.
The problem is, all DPS cares about anymore is spamming their rotation and being at the top of the meter. If you can get them to remember they used to have a job BESIDES pewpewing things, this fight gets so much simpler.
I get shocked every time I see a dps throwing any form of ability that is not good only for dps these days.. Not to mention seeing DPS that actually know what a LOS pull is and recognize it when they see one :o
Well, I tried out "Shackle Undead", on the riflemen, and it worked...however, it got broken by aoe so quickly, that it was a waste of mana...
Has anyone even tried voice channel, in the randoms? I've yet to see anyone using it, or vent. Heck, over the last few days, hardly anyone bothers to even type, "thanks for the run", at the end...sigh...
Radical thought, I know, but could it be communication might be useful, on this fight?
I find there are a lot of problems overall with HHoR. Maybe it's based on my bad luck with the people I get randomed or my inexperience as a tank, being probably the least optimal tank class (DK) for the instance (imo) or some combination.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisen
AoE threat is just absolutely mandatory regardless unless you managed to get a 5 repent hybrid paladin group or something since otherwise, they'll just eat the healer. And with no AoE threat outside of I guess chall shout/roar that is damage free, it's pretty difficult to actually do the whole shackle or trap thing if you even get a priest or hunter. Overall, i've found hard CC to be pretty... hard to actually pull off. One pestilence with the pestilence glyph if the target happens to be RNG'd a little too close and it's rendered worthless.
What else do you really have for control? I don't know about your experiences in random PUGs, but I am actually shocked if I get randomed anyone at all that interrupts (be they pummel, kick, counterspell, or anything at all) a single spell throughout an entire instance let alone in every wave for HoR. Forget dismantles or disarms no matter how much emphasis I even try to put on this.
So the question is, how would you do HHoR if you factor in the lowest common denominator. Surely someone has a more foolproof way unless the answer is leave the instance immediately if you don't get a good group.
Can the tank carry non-cooperative DPS (the standard run of the mill randoms) through HHoR without being a paladin tank or am I being too hopeful? I'm not even concerned, in the least bit, over the 2nd half of the instance since the tank can carry, but i'm not so sure about the first half.
One thing I would like to add (as a warrior tank) concerning the long run at the end:
Save TC. If your dps is burning the witch doctors like they SHOULD be and aren't harassing the aboms, you should have an easy time holding them with just cleave and devastate. That way, as new waves of aboms and doctors come in, your TC is always available to grab them as they run by (and I usually wait until they get a hair beyond me before I TC, that way, they take a step or 2 past me and turn to face me, keeping them facing away from group with little to no movement on my part). This usually gets the witch doctors and the aboms all on me. For the occasional mob that gets through, a quick taunt or HT will suffice, then I spam cleave and rotate devastate again. As long as you don't have a dk itching to AotD, you're golden.
I'm not familiar with other tank classes spells and abilities, but I'm sure there are similar mechanics they can use in this situation.
It took me a couple of runs, but I have found a pretty darn near perfect way to make the trash waves significantly less annoying (as long as there's a Pally in the group). Eisen mentioned it, but Turn Evil is amazing in here. As each wave is spawning, I stand out in the middle of which ever boss alcove we're in so I can see what mobs are spawning in what positions. If possible, I pick out one of the Footman and fear him as soon as I can cast on him. With a decent group, you can get through a mob and a half before the Footman can make his way back to you.
I'm also a fan of using the Glyph of Turn Evil in this instance. Despite the +8 seconds that get added to the CD, the instant cast makes it possible to quickly re-fear your mob if your DPS is having trouble burning through the larger waves. I tend to swap out my Glyph of Divine Plea when HoR comes up on the random rotation. It's a nice glyph when I'm doing a raid instance, but a little sub-par for heroics.
Done it. repeatedly. Mostly screaming and cursing at my monitor every time something threatend to get hairy.Quote:
Originally Posted by keLston
Sounds familiar, hahaQuote:
Originally Posted by Eisen