[Durandro]

Source: clavarnway Not to mention Blade Warding is useless against magic damage, and there's alot of that in Ulduar.

The added Parry helps slightly with Blood, what with Spell Deflection. But it's very minor.

[clavarnway]

Source: Durandro The added Parry helps slightly with Blood, what with Spell Deflection. But it's very minor.

Good call, I didn't think of DK's reliance on Parry - but as you said it's very minor, and as I understand it DK's suffer the most from Parry diminishing returns.

[steadymobn]

i've heard bleed effects from druids and warriors actually, refresh the duration on this enchant? is that a bug, cause thats a huge advantage over paladin tanks using this... can blizzard make SOV refresh this buff please?

[Smeg]

Source: steadymobn i've heard bleed effects from druids and warriors actually, refresh the duration on this enchant? is that a bug, cause thats a huge advantage over paladin tanks using this... can blizzard make SOV refresh this buff please?

Given that the tooltip specifically mentions bleeds, I doubt it's a bug.

[steadymobn]

Source: Smeg Given that the tooltip specifically mentions bleeds, I doubt it's a bug.

aaah never actually fully read the tooltip...


ya, they need to hook up us paladins, let our tanking seal keep it refreshed or something, us having to worry about it dropping off and warriors and druids not having to is bleh.....


i like the chant so far tho, uld 10 the other day it healed for 60k, uld 25 on tuesday only 30k

[clavarnway]

Source: steadymobn aaah never actually fully read the tooltip... ya, they need to hook up us paladins, let our tanking seal keep it refreshed or something, us having to worry about it dropping off and warriors and druids not having to is bleh..... i like the chant so far tho, uld 10 the other day it healed for 60k, uld 25 on tuesday only 30k

It has like a 50% proc rate once the 10 sec cd expires, you're saying you don't hit things for 10 seconds at a time??

[steadymobn]

Source: clavarnway It has like a 50% proc rate once the 10 sec cd expires, you're saying you don't hit things for 10 seconds at a time??

waiting for adds on razorscale, it falls off.... if im on constructs for ignis, its probably going to fall off.... council, the little dude that does the big AE thingy, it might fall off... going from tanking kologarns chest to rubble adds, back to chest, it might fall off... thorim, it might fall off... mimiron, shockblasts its probably going to fall off... general when u have to kite, its going to fall off....

moving from trash to next trash pull, its going to fall off...

and it takes 50 seconds or so to get a full stack... so ya

[Ieatpugs]

I wouldn't really consider it dropping during adds/trash a large problem. Not to mention on ignis you can easily keep it up by attacking ignis between constructs.

For stormbreaker and mimiron how are you having problems keeping up the 20s duration when you are only running out for ~5s? Kologarn adds, it's ~2s walk over there. General kite is also only 10 seconds, it won't fall off every time.

[Lilithium]

What do we know about this enchant for dual wielding? Two stacks, or faster stack building? I'm a dw DK (waits for flames) and find that my dual Blade Warding only yields one stack, so if I could get one or both weapons enchanted with Blood Draining I'd be willing to give it a shot.

If no one knows for sure, guess I'll try and report back.

[Denaro]

I went for Accuracy. Though I had my doubts about maybe switching back to Mongoose or even Executionar(which I used when ZA was out).

It is a hard call though.

[ItZMuRdA]

Not sure about DW, but I'm still preferring this enchant so far for MT progression tanking (as a warrior at least).

Even though Accuracy is technically the best threat enchant still, I find that there's so much hit readily available on gear as it is, and even if I sit at like 5-6% without Draenei in normal gear, I can easily cap that at 8% if I swap one piece or two for a specific encounter. I haven't found a reason to enchant Accuracy on any of my weapons in Ulduar just yet.

Blade Ward is underwhelming, but alright. In some fights its uptime is straight-up terrible, and at that, your parries while it's up are also extremely low. When I test out BW, I usually find it doing the least damage of any of my attacks (even under Heroic Throw in a fight that I might only use HT 2 or 3 times). It's an okay enchant, imho, but I'm afraid to say that I believe Mongoose wins out in that department if you need an avoidance enchant. The full duration of the proc (along with the added crit/armor/haste) just outweighs the low uptime of Blade Ward and the buff falling off upon your first parry. At that, I still hardly find myself needing to use either of these enchants in Ulduar except for testing purposes, and can't think of (m)any situations where they would be superior than Blood Draining for the scenario that I'm in.

Sorry for going off on a tangent regarding other enchants, but I was just giving my 2¢. I see any of them being viable in different situations, but Blood Draining wins out for me atm in a MT progression scenario, which is basically 95%+ of the time.

[Badga]

Bladewarding is garbage. I don't know anyone who started using it and kept it. There's a bunch of posts on the official wow tanking forums about it.

Pre-DR mongoose gives a warrior ~1.6% to dodge and 240 armor. Pre-DR, blade warding gives you ~4% parry per proc. You will get less than these avoidance values because of DR, it's just a question of how much, everyone will be different based on their gear choices. Parry has a hard cap of 47% for warriors, dodge has a hard-cap of 73.5%. The parry will diminish much more quickly than the dodge will. You need to do some math to really figure out how much avoidance you are getting from either enchant.

For bosses I tanked for the full duration of the fight without any tank swaps, etc. I had an average uptime on bladeward of about 15%. Your mileage will vary based on your pre-existing parry statistic from your gear. Mongoose has an uptime of at least 30-45% for most fights. So it's up at least 2x as much. The base proc rate on bladewarding appears to be somewhere between 5-8%, which is far too low for an enchant that falls off the next time you parry.

The value of the avoidance on this enchant not only scales slower with your DR on parry, but it also "clears" itself much more quickly if you've got too much parry. As you get better gear, it's considerably worse than mongoose because of the clearing mechanic. Items like the royal seal of king lane make the proc even worse.

The damage proc from bladeward was ~1-2% of my total damage dealt. Mongoose increases my haste and increases my physical crit rate by about 1.9%. In my threat spec, a crit is worth more than 2x damage because of deep wounds and impale. It's safe to say that between the faster heroic strikes and higher crit rate on specials, mongoose is more damage (even when you factor in parry haste). In addition, the proc from mongoose adds to your damage even if you aren't getting attacked, unlike bladewarding.

I also wouldn't suggest blood draining.

Your options are what they were before 3.1 - mongoose or accuracy (maybe a weapon chain if you're trying to cut costs).

Protection Gear Quick Reference - Page 6 - Elitist Jerks

I can not take credit for that post and calculations.

That post was made by Mulack on elitist jerks and the comparison was mongoose to blade warding, however there has yet to be a comparison on mongoose to blood draining. The numbers from mongoose still seem to be a fairly high proc rate even with the reduced effects. I am very curious to see blood as well as mongoose compared. I can see how mongoose is an outstanding enchant for a fight that requires a lot of threat where as blood draining is more so used for survival. However he does make a strong arguement with mongoose over blade warding.

[Lizana]

You cannot compare and avoidance enchant, to a EH enchant to a threat enchant.

Thats like asking whats better,

A boat, A Harley or a 5 course meal...

Each is a totally separate category of things.

[Kinetix]

You also have to consider that blood draining might save you in the case that your healers are a litlte laggy, or slow to react because they're busy moving out of the fire. I know this has done its job for me on Hodir during frozen blows.

[Lae]

I've tried both enchants out, currently using Blade Ward. I'm currently OTing, not MTing, so take this with a grain of salt, but I never found Blood Draining to be all that useful. Any time you're tanking something that hits hard enough that a blood reserve proc would save you, your healers are on you. Yes, they may be moving out of a shadow crash or jumping to get rid of the biting cold debuff on Hodir, but you're going to have something. Druid HoTs ticking, a priest shield, a pally shield, a riptide, whatever.

I understand the idea of it being an EH enchant, but in my experiences thus far in Ulduar, I was either dead anyway, or the next hit wasn't fatal. When I was using it, I was watching combat logs and WWS and it never made a potentially fatal attack non-fatal. I've been playing with Blade Ward, still watching to see how it turns out, but it's been a lot more useful to me recently than Blood Draining was.

Plus, you can't 2-shot a rogue in greens with a built up 5-stack of blood reserve and a shield slam like you can with Blade Ward.

[Dragaan]

you are building up 5 stacks of blade ward on a single target in pvp?

[Rages]

I have read a lot of people recommend this as a Feral Druid enchant. I have been a Feral druid for 2 years and I would never use an enchant that lowered my dps especially with the addition of Savage Defense. I would never use or recommend this enchant to a Feral Druid.
Mongoose is pretty much it for Feral Druid tanking enchants. I prefer Massacre the 110AP enchant for OT duty and trash and for MT I switch to my trusty Origin of Nightmares with Mongoose on it.
I have a Journey’s End laying around that I have thought about putting Blood Draining on for soloing stuff but, it’s rare that I get below 35% hp and when I do I barksin, hit survival instincts and then use Frenzied regeneration. I would never sacrifice dps/threat & mitigation for a weak heal that only works once in awhile. I enjoy the challenge of soloing things so I did look at this enchant as a possibility but increased dmg is just as important as survivability when your soloing. I was able to solo the 1st boss in regular HoL and I get the second boss to 9% so I thought about this enchant a lot (maybe that weak heal would be enough to finish him off but, my dps would have been slower so I probably would have never got him down that far). I wish it was an improved version of lifestealing where it would work all the time not just in the worst case situation. I carry health potions I don’t want one as an enchant.

[SNB]

If it was like lifestealing it would be close to useless.

[Lizana]

Source: SNB If it was like lifestealing it would be close to useless.

There is already an enchant like that, Lifeward and it is close to useless

[Thad]

wws doesn't seem to track blood draining. whats a good mod to use that will track its effect so i can tell how often it actually goes off. or is it that i need to track it myself with wws?