[Akeber]

Source: Tels The consecrate one I use for fights where I do a lot of aoe.(sarth 3d, thorim arena)

Do yourself a favor and test what your consecration ticks for, with and without that libram. I guarantee you'll DE/vendor it after.

[Tels]

I'm not an idiot, I know its worthless but the block value isn't important for threat considering most aoe packs die quickly anyways, the few extra threat it adds is better than nothing, the new str libram tho is amazing for threat

[billscrzykid]

First, AWESOME guide. Second, your WoW Armory gear suggests you might have some changed opinions on BiS since 3.2.

I am a social guild master on Kul Tiras, so I shoot for 10 man content. Seems like there are very few gear guides for the tankadin with emblem of conquest and ToC 10/25 gear added into the mix.

Even with the burden of plate, could I ask you to spend some time and rate some of the newer stuff in your guide?

Cheers

Bill

[Jayson]

So... I've just been lazy this patch. For example this morning... could've been working on Coliseum loot updates, but wasn't ; ]. I do expect to get this done however within the week. Just an update for you all.

[Akeber]

Source: Tels I'm not an idiot, I know its worthless but the block value isn't important for threat considering most aoe packs die quickly anyways, the few extra threat it adds is better than nothing, the new str libram tho is amazing for threat

Late reply I know.

You seem to be forgetting an added benefit to block value besides increasing what your ShoR hits for, it increases the amount of damage your shield will block. With talents it's about 500 BV shaved off every incoming hit that you block. In AOE situations that adds up to a ton of mitigated damage, providing much more benefit that the marginal, 7-8 dmg per tick, boost in consecrate damage and the paltry threat assiciated with it.

The SBV cap only applies to ShoR damage, not the amount of damage we can block with a shield, that is still unlimited. Tanking is more than just threat generation, our primary role is to stand there and take damage, mitigating as much as possible. High SBV sets are godly for add/trash tanking. There is nothing better than tanking a huge AOE pack and having every incoming stike either dodged, parried, or FULLY blocked.

[UrbanLegend]

Hey Jayson, got 2 questions for you.
1: I started a guild a few weeks back and are only doing 10 man content until we get more for 25 man. So we got Ulda, Toc, Onyxia on farm. In regaurds to a weapon ive been running around with the (PeaceKeeper Blade) and just got the (Crusader's Glory)last night. Now I know the 19 dodge is laughable, but with the higher str for thr and armor im thinking its better since we got a minor nerf in our Rightous Fury, and Gaining SP with Str instead of sta. Any thoughts? better yet anything in 10 man I should be striving for?
2: I know you've gotten this Q a billion times and ive read a lot on it, but i still hear people saing Expertise is crap(judgment, SOR cant be parried, dodged etc) and some saying its one of our better thr stats. ???

[Tels]

Source: Akeber Late reply I know. You seem to be forgetting an added benefit to block value besides increasing what your ShoR hits for, it increases the amount of damage your shield will block. With talents it's about 500 BV shaved off every incoming hit that you block. In AOE situations that adds up to a ton of mitigated damage, providing much more benefit that the marginal, 7-8 dmg per tick, boost in consecrate damage and the paltry threat assiciated with it. The SBV cap only applies to ShoR damage, not the amount of damage we can block with a shield, that is still unlimited. Tanking is more than just threat generation, our primary role is to stand there and take damage, mitigating as much as possible. High SBV sets are godly for add/trash tanking. There is nothing better than tanking a huge AOE pack and having every incoming stike either dodged, parried, or FULLY blocked.

Yet again, I'm not an idiot, but name one place where tanking multiple mobs where your in any place of danger, no where, killing the mobs faster (more threat) is more important than taking a minor amount of less dmg(since 70% of heals now a days is overheal) mana is and never has been a problem in this expansion if your dying on trash you shouldn't be looking at your gear but at your healers, even more so since if your geared properly you'll be taking next to no dmg as it is, and possibly be in mana problems, 10 man ulduar I'm starved because I never take dmg

[Knaughty]

Source: UrbanLegend 2: I know you've gotten this Q a billion times and ive read a lot on it, but i still hear people saing Expertise is crap(judgment, SOR cant be parried, dodged etc) and some saying its one of our better thr stats. ???

Expertise has been an acceptable threat stat since SoV started having an "on melee swing" proc.

More interestingly, Expertise is over 95% as effective as Dodge Rating at reducing melee swing hits from bosses that can parry-haste.

See Theck's posts on maintankadin for the full details.

[Zothor]

Source: Tels Yet again, I'm not an idiot, but name one place where tanking multiple mobs where your in any place of danger

Uh, Heroic Anub'arak.

[Knaughty]

Source: Tels Yet again, I'm not an idiot, (1) but name one place where tanking multiple mobs where your in any place of danger, no where (2) killing the mobs faster (more threat) is more important than taking a minor amount of less dmg(since 70% of heals now a days is overheal)

(1) As mentioned, Hard-mode-Anub adds is the obvious one. Single-tanking hard-mode-twins (I've tried it, tanking part worked OK, but we went to two tanks since we had way more DPS than we needed). In Ulduar:Yogg+0 or even Yogg+1. Tanking everything at cat lady, or even just "all adds". Even some Freya+3 strats.

(2) I can't actually work out what your point is. There are many places where taking a little less damage is important. I've survived (or died) by only a few hundred health enormous numbers of times. Beasts hard the first week we were there was a MASSIVE tanking check. Algalon. Thorim-hard. Hodir-hard (as progression fights you don't out-gear). Yogg adds the first time you get there with Naxx gear.

There are a few places where burst threat is important.

The fact that massive overheals are the norm is meaningless. The issue is whether you have the mitigation and EH to live through the burst between heals. We did 4/5 CC-25-hard this week, I peak at 52k health. There was one point in the clear where I was burst down to about 300 health between two 1.4 second Holy Lights on the very first boss. You need the overheals so you're utterly topped off, and they have to spam because burst damage can get you very low very fast. Impaler's worst-case combo is about 60k.

[Tels]

You guys should probably reread, the conversation was for trash

[Pranksta]

I created a Paladin solely with tanking in mind. I hit 80 a few days ago and I have a very noobish question. My main is a Mage and I leveled my Pally on the side, so please forgive my ignorance.

What exactly is Avoidance in reference to? Is it block, dodge, parry, what?

[Knaughty]

Source: Pranksta I created a Paladin solely with tanking in mind. I hit 80 a few days ago and I have a very noobish question. My main is a Mage and I leveled my Pally on the side, so please forgive my ignorance. What exactly is Avoidance in reference to? Is it block, dodge, parry, what?

Avoidance is "miss + dodge + parry" (yes, bosses have a chance to miss, and don't wear +hit gear)

[Pranksta]

Source: Knaughty Avoidance is "miss + dodge + parry" (yes, bosses have a chance to miss, and don't wear +hit gear)

ok thank you

[Jayson]

Well... now that I've missed a tier and a half of updates for my guide, with another tier on the PTR, it's time for me to accept the truth. Jayson has slipped into near retirement. I still play the game, I still make all raids I can with my guild, Journey, but I am working 2 jobs and spend most of my remaining time with the girl friend.

The support and discussion has been awesome, almost 95,000 hits gives me confidence that the guide was used well. Should I reach a period of time off, I will gladly run a new update for Icecrown, but please do not count on it.

If you have questions, feel free to shoot them my way in the form of a message here on TS or in-game mail to Jayson (Gilneas).

Jay, out.

[Mert]

I always found your guide to be the most useful of these kinds of things, simply for the fact it recognises that there isn't a single "best" item for all things a tank might do. My only question really is whether you'd be happy for someone from this community continuing your work in your absence and perhaps putting together a Tier 9 version?

Best of luck with your two jobs and hope things settle down for you in the future. Thanks again for the guide, it helped me right the way through Ulduar

[Leha]

thanks Jayson for all you have done so far

i have only just started contributing to TS today, but I have looked at you guide many times over the last few months

[Petrus]

Thank you for your help, Jayson. I'll put in an effort to create a guide like yours when Icecrown comes out (or at least when we start seeing the loot) and see if I have the time/ability to get it done.