UI/ADDON INFORMATION:
Lore's UI (10 Man Videos): Lore's UI
Ciderhelm's UI (25 Man Videos): Ciderhelm UI Information Please post any questions about UI/Addon's in their respective threads and not in this thread
Eagerly awaiting this one, other videos I've seen aren't to clear on how the OT handles the golems and I've seen different graphics for the scorch all over the place.
An error occurred, please try again later. You lied to me Cider.
__________________ "We actually talked today about adding an item level 300 shirt that did absolutely nothing but mess with mods that attempt to boil down players to gear scores. " -Ghostcrawler
Excellent guide, we struggled with this last night using a different (and much worse) positioning approach. I wonder what options there are that don't require 2 druids in the raid?
Source: swelt
Excellent guide, we struggled with this last night using a different (and much worse) positioning approach. I wonder what options there are that don't require 2 druids in the raid?
Well, you can do what the movie suggests with a single Druid rooting and another tank bringing them to position. We specifically used this as our 10-man strat as well so with no Druid I don't have an answer other than to suck it up and eat the fire damage in 10-man (hopefully someone else has a better idea and can post it).
Hey Cider by any chance you or someone could upload a transcript of you dialog, so I can translate it to spanish for my fellow guild members? I'd like to help do so for the rest of the community, as time is avaliable for me to do it. Nice vid.
Source: Ciderhelm
Well, you can do what the movie suggests with a single Druid rooting and another tank bringing them to position. We specifically used this as our 10-man strat as well so with no Druid I don't have an answer other than to suck it up and eat the fire damage in 10-man (hopefully someone else has a better idea and can post it).
One of the other known strats is to kite them using Chains of Ice from a DK. While this does make it a little less reliable and the tank on the constructs might still need to take some fire damage, it greatly reduces the time in which the tank does have to stand in the flame. I have not tested this out, but another alternative stratagey would be to use Hungering Cold which may work as well.
10 man encounter is extremly overtuned though. We wiped 21 times until we realized that the top guild on our server had disposed of Yogg-saron, but not of Ignis.
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Gertiploiss, the tank without a cause or reason.
Last edited by Gertiploiss; 04-20-2009 at 08:28 AM..
What I did tanking this in 25man was placing the scorches in a circle around the raid, much closer and overlapping than in this movie, this helped the DKs handling the adds that there were no gaps so stacks of the debuff didn't fall off the adds. Also the melee never had to move, just turn as the boss shift around them. The only people moving was the tanks.
Source: Ciderhelm
Well, you can do what the movie suggests with a single Druid rooting and another tank bringing them to position. We specifically used this as our 10-man strat as well so with no Druid I don't have an answer other than to suck it up and eat the fire damage in 10-man (hopefully someone else has a better idea and can post it).
One thing that a lot of people don't realize is that if the add tank positions himself correctly, he can tank the adds such that they get scorch and he doesn't, saving the need to root them in place. To do this, you have to be just inside the scorch animation so that it looks like you should be getting hit, but you won't.
Also, on 10-man, if you have a geared enough tank and good dps and healers, it's entirely possible to tank Ignis in the water so there are no scorch debuffs (the scorch will go away instantly if it touches the water) to worry about and just off-tank the adds the whole time (we did that this week). He'll be hitting extremely hard at the end, but it's doable if your raid can handle the damage.
For 10 man we ended up kiting the golems and not bothering to kill them... effectively brute forcing the encounter. This was obviously dependant on having best 25 man naxx gear and I don't recommend it. In 25 man, we found the tank became unhealable a lot earlier (although I think our healing strategy could have been better too) but the process we had for dealing with golems was too slow.
Cider how did you deal with the fact that the Brittle golems when they are killed do 20k damage to anyone within 10 yards? was the person kiting them into the water a tank and you were eating the damage or did you delay killing htem till that person got far enough away or what?
2ndly for ya'll how often were the golems spawning when we tried him on Saturday night it seemed we were getting golems to spawn every 10 to 15 secs and were getting overrun with them.
As mentioned in the video, they used a mage in order to destroy the Brittle Golems. Supposedly the tank that got them into the water was nowhere nearby when this occured.
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Gertiploiss, the tank without a cause or reason.
I used a diferent way yesterday, on 10-man. After a wipe, I realized that, if he uses the flame and you are very near the water (or inside), it would just extinguish. So tried this way:
I moved him near the left water, let him flame close the water, but not enough to extinguish. After that, I would move to the water, until the next he cast the second scorch. This made the ground cleaner, less people getting hit be the flame after leaving slagpot. The add tank (yes, we used a tank since we didn't have a druid) could rely on a specificy spot to burn, healers didn't have to worry about LOS when he run to diferents spots.
You may have a downtime of scorch, but nothing more than 2 seconds if you do it right.
Im not sure how sholo dealt with the aoe damage but I never got hit. When the golem went molten i feral charged and immediately hit with a maul/mangle to break my Natures Grasp. What this also does is put a 50% slowing debuff allowing me to get out of range and into the deep water before he gets to me.
Source: Gnurken
What I did tanking this in 25man was placing the scorches in a circle around the raid, much closer and overlapping than in this movie, this helped the DKs handling the adds that there were no gaps so stacks of the debuff didn't fall off the adds. Also the melee never had to move, just turn as the boss shift around them. The only people moving was the tanks.
We did this too, instead of 2 scorches per side of the raid I got in 3 and it was a solid line of scorches so there was no problems getting the adds molten.
Also, we had prot war & boomkin doing adds, boomkin would use moonfire while standing in the water after add was molten to break the roots, and the moonkin just did a starfall to shatter the add. There is nobody in 10 yard radius of the pools as they are all in the middle of the area.
First off, you have 20 seconds to kill the brittle golem, so the offtank who brought it into the water should have plenty of time to get out before a mage hits it. in fact, our offtanks just called out when it was ok to kill it. Our positioning was essentially the same as your Ciderhelm, though i tried putting the scorches a little closer to the water. The four point path works wonders.
It's is indeed possible to tank the golem in the fire while yourself being out of it, but if Ignis cast Flame Jets while you are doing this, the golem will shift and move out of the flame because of you being launched into the air. And every second counts.
Once we decided to witch to 2 DK offtanks, it was an laughable fight on 25 man. The combination of Chains of Ice and Death Grip meant that the DK's took virtually no damage. We're so busy pushing 25 man that we have not yet got around to trying Ignis on 10 man.
Our guild may have discovered a possible intentional area design that makes the encounter much easier. We positioned our ranged and healers on the raised ledge that exists in all but the very middle on each side of the room around the water. This places the majority of the raid directly behind the innactive constructs but about 1 yard off the floor and roughly 1/2 way down from the large pools. We did this for 2 reasons. This ledge has a sharp edge on the side facing the center of the room and a gradual slope on the side facing the pool behind the raid. We noticed that when constructs become molten, then seem to reset aggro (haven't tested it, possible it's just healer aggro on targets not being actively tanked). Constructs cannot path directly to a ranged dps or healer who is standing on the raised ledge. This works to our advantage.
That leads to the 2nd reason. This forces the constructs to run up the only way they can reach the ledge, through the water as they attempt to come up the gradual slope on the back side of the ledge. The end result is the constructs becoming molten, aggroing onto healers since we root them in scorch, and making themselves brittle. Additionally, if they are 1/2 way across the ledge they will be out of range from the AOE caused both by them being molten and then when they are shattered. This strat allows healers and ranged to be fully in LOS of all melee and tanks at all times. It should be noted that Ignis doesn't fall prey to the need to path around the ledge due to his height so it allows him to grab players without having to cause a massive positioning issue.
In the end we tank him with his back to the ledge (any of the 4 ledges will do). We have melee stand just in front of the ledge. Tank him with his back facing melee and ranged, and then line up scorches from left to right and then back again as they fade. We only have to assign 1 person to kite them into the scorches, 2 people to snare them inside, and no one has to worry about them once they become molten since healer aggro takes care of their pathing straight into the water. A single ranged dps doesn't even have to move as they are in LOS from the point where they become brittle as they shatter them.
I hope this helps and hopefully you won't have to re-shoot your video when you see how trivial this makes the encounter. Great job as always.
Last edited by The Leviathan; 04-20-2009 at 12:49 PM..
Ulduar Ignis the Furnace Master
