[tZee]

Source: Satrina Shield Slam Beat up one mob, then move to another and slam it in the face. A melee attack usually slipped in, so we'll account for it. 2618AP - 548 melee damage, 2648 shield slam damage, 822350 threat. Normalised threat is 3966, and removing (548 + 2648) damage leaves 770 innate threat 2408AP - 0 melee damage, 2396 shield slam damage, 656470 threat. Normalised threat is 3166, and removing 2396 damage leaves 770 innate threat 2204AP - 465 melee damage, 2432 shield slam damage, 760352 threat. Normalised threat is 3667, and removing (465 + 2432) damage leaves 770 innate threat 2048AP - 1005 melee damage, 2596 shield slam damage, 906327 threat. Normalised threat is 4371, and removing (1005 + 2596) damage leaves 770 innate threat We conclude that Shield Slam has a flat 770 innate threat, independent of AP.

I apologize if anyone commented on this before in this thread and I didn't see it.
As Shield Slam damage is affected by BV instead of AP, did you do your tests with different BVs as well? (To see if that 770 is still constant.)

[Colbert]

Its a minor question, but:

Is Enchant Gloves - Armsman - Spell - World of Warcraft already included in the 207.35%?

[Satrina]

No.

[Colbert]

So according to the information I researched it is multiplicative which leads to:

207.35*1.02 = 211,497

Just for those who are interested^^

[Dentusk]

I have a question here, in terms of damage and not threat. Is mocking blow better than devastate with the glyph of mocking blow +25% dmg. My calculation may be wrong but what I saw is when you have more than 3 sunder on the target, devaste is more dmg but under that mocking blow + 25% should be higher. I am right?

[OrionAntares]

I would be nice if you could just add Mocking Blow to the list so we know what its multiplier is.

[Arkunsun]

Source: Satrina Glyph of Sunder Armor will apply Sunder to the secondary target whether you use Devastate or Sunder. Threat gain is as follows: Hit Target 1 with Devastate: Target 1: threat = Damage + 5%AP Target 2: threat = 345 + 5%AP Hit Target 1 with Sunder: Target 1: threat = 345 + 5%AP Target 2: threat = 345 + 5%AP That is to say, 1) If a Sunder is used on the first target, a normal Sunder is applied to both targets and the normal Sunder threat is generated on both targets. 2) If a Devastate is used on the first target, the normal Devastate threat is generated on the first target, and normal Sunder threat is generated on the second target.

I Hope this question isn't already asked. Based on the above if I'm using both the glyph of devastate and glyph of sunder armor is it applying the threat from the regular devastate plus the extra sunder armor to the primary target and then a sunder armor to the second target?

If this works it would seem a good way to build and maintain quick threat by tab devastating and using SS when it procs from SaB.

just curious if this is how it's working.

[Nucleus]

A silly question really.

From threat's point of view, would it be better to use Sunder Armor till 5 stacks then only replace it with Devastate?

[Muffin Man]

Nucleus: I'm aware this is a pretty long thread, so here's the relevant post and should answer your question:
WoW 3.0 Threat Values

Arkunsun: I can't find the posts but I believe these are the conclusions:
Glyph of Devastate = devastate threat + bonus 5% ap (so works to damage + 10% ap) on the primary target

If you use both I believe it's the same as if you just sundered the secondary mob twice? I can't remember anymore.

[sap]

What exactly is 'innate threat'? Is it the base threat that an ability causes and then all additional threat is generated from damage?

Why I ask is because currently for my threat set I'm heavy on +8str/+12sta gems for boosting attack power (to buff HS dmg and BV) so I'm wondering if that's optimal.

For reference my armory: The World of Warcraft Armory

Thanks for the great thread Satrina

[Kazeyonoma]

yes, Innate threat = threat that is just automatically associated to the skill and then you add damage to that innate threat.

also, unless you're already at the expertise parry cap, expertise will probably give you more threat gains than str.

[Roguemaster]

I am very new to this site as a poster. I am sure this will be a simple question to answer for the great minds here on this forum.

If a person such as myself (a dps class) is after good "TPS" (Threat per second) values for Uld 25-M trash and boss fights through Yogg. Where might I find these figures?

Pally Tank ?
Warrior Tank ?
DK Tank ?
Feral Tank ?

If i have posted in the wrong area or forum fo rhtis, would you be able to point me int he right direction.

[Petninja]

I'm not sure why it is you're looking for that as a rogue. You should be doing as much damage as you can without pulling agro.

[Roguemaster]

In my guild, we are having a debate about "DPS" classes, and "TPS", they are stating that DPS needs to slow down because we (casters & Melee) are pulling to much threat or agro on the bosses and or trash.

Therefor, I am seeking more information as to what there "TPS" should be. This way i can take straight facts to the table for hte tanks to understand that they might be low TPS for Uld when there top DPS is getting to the 7-20k level (obviously very situational).

I appreciate all the help I can get here.

[jere]

In general? 7-10k probably, but it differs from fight to fight. Some fights you can put out a lot more, but if you just want a general range, that is probably a decent value. If you are at the point where dps is spiking up to 20k tps, then you are in the range where dps should be managing their threat. I think Naxx spoiled us some. In ulduar, there is a bit more threat management to be done, especially as the DPS improve.

[Roguemaster]

Ty, I am going to check those figures as a good rule of thumb and get back to you guys.

[jere]

Just remember, in some fights that might be lower as well. It all just depends on the fight. Those numbers will be lower for trash for example as tanks are more worried about making sure everything is picked up rather than single target threat.

[Kazeyonoma]

Satrina, will you be going over these values now and updating accordingly (or at least change the title to reflect how updated it is?)