[Treide]

well its all up to your rotation, if you use HS then keep it there feel free to ignore my post lol.
its what works for you really i tend not to use HS so i only put enough to points into deflection to move into the next part of the tree (3 out of 5 points) from what i remember reading theres no point putting more points into deflection but im not sure.. im quite nub when it comes to talent trees, tend to change it alot so yea.

here is my wow armory wowarmory feel free to browse at the talents but i wouldnt copy for your sake lol, might ruin things

p.s yes i know my hit rating is 100 above >.> new chest took me way over the cap, have to lose some and get more crit which is way to low.

[Rak]

I have 25% passive ArP + 10% from stance + 15% from mace spec, bringing me right to 50% passive ArP. I have Grim Toll, so everything I read on EJ says I should not get any ArP past what I have right now.

I fiddle around with Rawr just to plan some gear upgrades and see where my hit/expertise etc will be, and I noticed it says I have 60% ArP. It's saying I have 35% from gear alone. My in-game sheet says 25%, but I know the in-game sheet often misses things... is this a case of Rawr being off by a huge amount of am I missing something?

Also, even with Rawr showing 60% ArP + Grim Toll, it still is saying ArP is more dps than str. It prioritizes things like ArP gems over str gems, and Gloves of the Fiery Behemoth - Item - World of Warcraft over Gauntlets of Ruthless Reprisal - Item - World of Warcraft I can't link my armory as I always log out in tanking gear, but I can say I'm right on the hit cap at 8.08% and as far as in-game shows I'm right at 50% ArP and 3900 AP unbuffed.

Is Rawr just wrong, is EJ wrong, am I out of my mind or reading something incorrectly?!

[Lizana]

Neither is 100% wrong (but not sure why it says you have 60% arp instead of 50%, that is wrong), but neither is telling you the full story at the same time.

Once you are at the 100% arp with a trinket, more arp will give zero befit while the trinket is proced.
More arp will give more dps than str when the trinket is not proced.
Str will give you increased dps both when the trinket is proced and when the trinket is not proced.

Basically since the trinket doesnt have 100% uptime you have a choice, you can either continue to gem for arp to have a larger dps boost when the trinket is not proced, or you can stop stacking arp and go back to str gems to increase your total damage done, both durring proc times and non proc times.

From my own experience, i like stacking Arp even after i hit enough to cap with trinket proc, and work towards 100% passive arp, so you can drop the trinket.

If you do not think you will be able to do that quickly, going back to STR gems as you upgrade to more arp and keeping your trinket is a viable option.

[Rak]

I don't have any ArP gems in my gear. I originally thought the same thing - the proc is only up 10 out of every 45 seconds, so more ArP is good. But EJ seems very vehement in that going over 50% passive is a waste. It's unlikely I'll ever be able to outgear the trinket, since it is offspec gear, so I guess I'm sticking with str gemming!

[Brugga]

Hi guys

I was just wondering if, using the priority system I should be definately using every gcd, as opposed to waiting a 0.5 second until mortal strike comes off cd.
For instance, should I:
Mortal strike-slam-slam-(wait 0.5secs)Mortalstrike
or
Mortal strike-slam-slam-slam -(mortalstrike has been off cd for 1sec) mortal strike
At the moment i usually go with the first option, unless i can execute, in which case i do it right after the second slam.
And how about with the tastefor blood proc? it seems probably better to try 2 abilities and one overpower in the mortal strike window, only losing 0.5 seconds of cd.

Thanks in advance

[Lizana]

You will never have time for 3 slams in a row as long as you have rend up on the boss. By the time you will get to that point you will have a OP proc. Also this is assuming you do not get any SD execute procs, as those would be a better use of a GCD than slam.

OP
MS
Slam
Slam
OP
MS
Slam
Slam

Also when you consider what is reasonably possible to do as a player, 100% correct GCD usage for 100% of a raid is very difficult to do, even for the best players due to latency and other factors. If you were able to keep up 100% GCD usage for 100% of the fight then i would be worth it to use every gcd, it would increase your dps but not by a huge factor.

[Pupp]

Source: Treide well its all up to your rotation, if you use HS then keep it there feel free to ignore my post lol. its what works for you really i tend not to use HS so i only put enough to points into deflection to move into the next part of the tree (3 out of 5 points) from what i remember reading theres no point putting more points into deflection but im not sure.. im quite nub when it comes to talent trees, tend to change it alot so yea. here is my wow armory wowarmory feel free to browse at the talents but i wouldnt copy for your sake lol, might ruin things p.s yes i know my hit rating is 100 above >.> new chest took me way over the cap, have to lose some and get more crit which is way to low.

Thanks. I'll take a look and maybe switch some things around. I don't use HS at all, so I'm wasting a few points. Just a matter of sitting down and changing it.

Did want to say that with a few simple changes, that were suggested here, I upped my DPS to more in the 2K range (Partial naxx 10 run), which I'm proud of and wanted to say thanks for the direction. I've dropped almost all of my Haste gear (got one more piece to rid of) and then I'll be on my way to bigger and greater things...I hope!

So thanks again for the help!

[Lizana]

Source: Pupp Thanks. I'll take a look and maybe switch some things around. I don't use HS at all, so I'm wasting a few points. Just a matter of sitting down and changing it.

You still should use HS in any high rage situations. Imp HS will still be a dps increase for those few times in 10 man naxx content when you do have massive amounts of rage, where as deflection will never be a dps increase. As you gear up you will start finding yourself having more and more rage, and able to use more and more HS. I would keep the points where they are at.

[Evelaula]

Just thought I'd pop in and say thanks for the Arms guide. Switched my offspec from fury to arms. And not only do I do more dps, but its a hell of a lot more fun to play.

[Ship]

Hi Pupp,
Looked on your armor. Think you need some better Expertise. Currently 14 is not enough. You need 18. Your hit is high, you can lower without any difficulties.
To get the expertise you need get the Wristbands of the Sentinel Huntress. This will increase expertise so you have more than enough. These wristbands BoE, so you can fairly easily get them from someone with a lot of Emblems of Valor or if you have 60 Valor yourself this is a very good way spending them for a DPS increase.
You can lower your hit and haste some more. Try to get more strenght and crit.
Grats, to your pants. Very good choice.

[Zartanchi]

Is there a specific reason Arm's cannot utilize pummel for the interupt? Is it a PVP issue? I apologize if that's been covered somewhere, but I'm just curious if there was a real reason why they can't make pummel useable in battle stance.

[Ship]

Pummel is a Fury abillity. If you want to use it you will have to change stance to fury and then back to arms. This is refered to as stance dance. If you look in the arms talent tree you will see that you can reduce your rage loss when changing stance. Personally I believe this to be a loss of talent points. Its better to create a macro and equip a shield, cast spell reflect and then equip your 2-hand again. Thereby avoiding changing stance and loosing rage.
Look back some pages and you will find the macro. You can find good introductions to writing macros in wowhead and WoWWiki.

As a DPS I use one macro very much:
/assist XXX (write the tank name)
By clicking on this macro I automatically attack the same target as the tank. Can be useful when everything is a blur and the tank has not marked the target (scull, cross...)

[Muffin Man]

Source: Ship Pummel is a Fury abillity. If you want to use it you will have to change stance to fury and then back to arms. This is refered to as stance dance.

This isn't his question...

There probably isn't a real reason other than legacy. Not having played during Vanilla I heard that warriors back then actually tanked out of battle stance, throwing sunders and thunderclap (which was unusable in d-stance ).

Since then, the trees have been redone a bit and now we have Arms which focuses on 2-handed combat but still can't pummel. Considering that shield bash and pummel trigger each other's cooldown (which for some reason are not the same length) there's really no good reason that you can't pummel out of Arms, unless it's for balance reasons since Arms used to be the PvP spec (which seems like a dumb reason since we can macro weapon swap/shield bash or stance dance/pummel to interrupt).

[Lizana]

Source: Zartanchi Is there a specific reason Arm's cannot utilize pummel for the interupt? Is it a PVP issue? I apologize if that's been covered somewhere, but I'm just curious if there was a real reason why they can't make pummel useable in battle stance.

Unrelenting Assault - Spell - World of Warcraft

Causing a healer or dps to do 50% less over 6 seconds plus MS effect as well means that they do not see the need to give an interrupt. A good example is say the mage is going to throw fireballs at you. Any fire mage is going to be casting them with no slower than a 3 second cast time. So they are casting the first fireball at you, you OP them. Now their next 2 fireballs do 50% less damage, so your preventing the same amount of damage as you would if you had interrupted once every 6 seconds.

This is a even bigger difference when figuring in DOT's or spells with a faster cast time.

[Zartanchi]

Thank you, I knew there was an answer I just wasn't seeing. I like arms as my 2nd spec, but when I was on General last night it was annoying to stance dance and I just ended up going with my sword and shield and bashing. I'll try some of the macro's I've seen to see how those work, or just go fury so I have the damn interupt for fights like that.

[Ayne]

Today I went out and downloaded Lansoul's most recent version of the dps spread sheet, logged out in my dps gear and in my Arms build. I used the armory input feature on the spreadsheet.

My "raid buffed" dps, I didn't change any of the buff values, with the gear I have on, shows 5846. I have 32.82% ArP from gear and the Grim Toll trinket.

When I do the SEP calc, it shows that ArP is at 1.02 and STR is at 1.0. So I take that to mean that ArP is a higher priority stat. If I switch all of my STR gems to ARP gems, even the two blues I have in place to activate my Meta gem, I go to ~5900 dps on the spreadsheet.

Now I have been known to Min/Max but I was expecting more if a jump than 50 dps.

I have a BoH at the moment, but got Ironsoul the other night, and when I change to Ironsoul and pick up Mace Spec, I lose about 150dps on the sheet. What I am confused about is why gem for all ArP at 30% from gear if its a gain of 50 dps?

I am really confused about benefit of Armor Penetration. I mean is that what people are doing? Min/Maxing?

[Muffin Man]

I'm guessing it's only 50 dps because you lost the Meta bonus which is very good (assuming you're using the +3% crit dmg).

FYI Axe Spec > Mace spec for similar quality weapons. General consensus is that BoH > Ironsoul in quality. So you took two drops in swapping weapons.

[Ayne]

I think I might not have been clear. I was late to a meeting at work

Straight Armory import the sheet showed my dps as right around 5850. Changing every 16 str gem to 16 ArP gem and my 8 STR/12 Stam blues to 8ArP/12 Stam Blues, no other changes, I gained ~50 dps.

My ArP from gear is right around 32% before those changes. I am using a Betrayer currently, and got the Ironsoul only for possible Fury use at some point.

Armory Link:
The World of Warcraft Armory

That just doesn't seem right.

[Muffin Man]

What exactly is your ArP rating? I tried exporting your armory profile and it gave me 321 ArP which is roughly 26% arp?

Anyways one thing to consider, 30% is a rule of thumb of the break even point where ArP will outweigh Str. This was validated by your 50dps gain ont he spreadsheet. Since ArP has increasing returns you will just see more and more dps as you stack more and more ArP. But initially it might not be much to write home about. But you've achieved a dps increase and well, you gotta start somewhere if that makes sense.

[Treide]

ok a quick noob question
totally forgot what the expertise cap for arms warrior was
(just got afew new pieces that had alot more expertise so just trying not to go over the limit.

With Weapon Mastery
and
without Weapon Mastery

Thanks
Treide