[Morthengel]

Today I stopped being lazy and worked on the fury dps spreadsheet i got from elitistjerks for an hour.
First I corrected it for windfury nerf. I assumed raid buffs, with feral druid and non-ench shaman in group. Used ssc/tk level gear.
First i kept hit rating constant, and changed crit rating, then changed AP accordingly to keep dps constant, between 35%-45% crit.
Then I kept AP constant, and done similar with hit rating again between 35-45% crit.

The result I found was roughly 1strength=1crit rating=2hit rating between 38-42% crit.
Outside this, hit either goes extremely low or gets high to the cap, unable to meet the dps.
At high crits AP starts to gain more importance, due to the diminishing returns in flurry uptime. but at reasonale crit rates (between 30-35 unbuffed) the above equation is valid.

I am going to use it when gearing up in MH/BT. I hope it helps to you also.

[Rothion]

Your spreadsheet estimation gives 42 AP to crit evaluation which seems to be fairly well in line with my model since you assumed slightly higher level of gear.

As to what comes to Flurry, I don't feel it really merits consideration since it would add a layer of complexity which has an effect on the outcome that I wouldn't call drastic. Comparing 0% crit and 100% (ie. 0% Flurry uptime and 100% Flurry uptime) you only end up with 12.5% increase in total dps assuming 50% of your damage is white. That's only 0.125% per crit % (if we simplify things a bit by assuming Flurry uptime is a linear function of crit %) and the effect on AP/crit equivalence can't be higher than that either.

[Morthengel]

Yes, your estimation is quite a good one.

12.5% I believe is a big number. It is the difference being 6th or 2nd on a damage table most of the time. And faster rage generation added to the rage from crits will make you use heroic strike a lot, hence reducing MH misses, with some increased damage. (Yes, I am one of those who find the innate threat of heroic strike trivial compared to it's damage in a fury setting.)

I believe flurry is a key element of the dps of a fury warrior.

The spreadsheet I use considers all the above (including rage burning HS).

The relationship between flurry uptime and crit% is not linear, but it is a 3rd degree function:

flurry uptime=1-(1-crit)^3. So at some point, you get affected badly from diminishing returns. I found that to be around 44%raidbuffed crit. There, hit and AP becomes more important.

[Finelle]

Hmm, a question, since heroic strike adds constant damage regardless of AP, the only other effects are the removal of a glance chance, why does it cause such a drastic increase in DPS?

[Meeks]

Source: Finelle Hmm, a question, since heroic strike adds constant damage regardless of AP, the only other effects are the removal of a glance chance, why does it cause such a drastic increase in DPS?

It is not a drastic increase in dps but it is noticeable. It removes glancing, removes chance to miss, adds damage, and is effected by impale.

[Rothion]

12.5% is the difference between 0% and 100% flurry uptime; those are not very realistic things to compare directly. It just gives a rough idea as to what the difference a single crit % gives.

Flurry uptime as a function of crit % would seem to be a third degree curve but that's really only when not considering instant attacks at all. 1-(1-crit)^3 is the chance of Flurry running out which isn't necessarily the same thing even when ignoring instants (though both being third degree curves one could be considered an estimate of the other); but instants can and do alter the scenario quite a bit. For example for 2h Slam dps rotation the chance of Flurry running out is more like (1-crit)^9 since you're doing 2 instants (counting Slam) for every 1 auto attack).

In short, the effective Flurry uptime isn't an easy problem and it's too sensitive to different circumstances that I don't think it's really worth trying to solve accurately. I did write a short matlab script a while back to model it (which didn't include instants either) but I didn't plot a curve for different crit % values; I might do that some day and compare it to the chance of losing flurry curve (1-(1-crit)^3).

[Morthengel]

@ Heroic strike: It is really nice to see 2k+ heroic strike crit and 3k+ bloodthirst crit at the same time..Impale bonus and no glancing/miss makes the difference significant.

@Flurry: Yes, 1-(1-crit)^3 is a rough formula and does not include the instants. But I dont think instans will make a significant difference, as you are using 2 of them, 1 on 6 other on 8 secs cooldown. Very less attacks compared to your flurried swings. The spreadsheet I used simulates everything tho.

[talonkylor]

Meeks a question i ask you about your talent build... COuld u make a version that isn't Linked to your character?

For the reason that when u respec or something like that it is hard to look ar your fury spec then.

[Meeks]

Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

[Meeks]

Was recently updated with some minor fixes/additions.

[Daylanor]

I approve of the 3rd edition . Much better read and inputting the info where needed .

[Rhaeti]

I thought I'd add this here for any interested dps warriors.

WoW-Europe.com Forums -> Wooot! Blizzard listened to the community ZOM

The planned 10% threat reduction will be in addition to the current 10% AP for improved berserker stance.

Also, Meeks, can you go into a bit more detail about what is wrong with the latest version of the EJ DPS spreadsheet?

[Meeks]

Source: Rhaeti I thought I'd add this here for any interested dps warriors. WoW-Europe.com Forums -> Wooot! Blizzard listened to the community ZOM The planned 10% threat reduction will be in addition to the current 10% AP for improved berserker stance. Also, Meeks, can you go into a bit more detail about what is wrong with the latest version of the EJ DPS spreadsheet?

Have not seen if they updated it in the past 2-3 weeks but before that it was flat broken and calcualted some thigns oddly and did not factor things like the windfurry nerf and things like that.

[Rhaeti]

Check out the latest update. A different person took over the spreadsheet, and he updates it pretty frequently. You just have to keep up with the thread for the latest updates. Here's the latest version: http://elitistjerks.com/502508-post1853.html

[Khormid]

Amazing guide!!

[nird]

Meeks, I have a question. A lot of people in my guild keep saying subtlety is better then agi enchant on my cloak as fury warrior. I can honestly say I've never seen a fury warrior with anything else than 12 agility. Will the -2 % threat do more dps then the -0,36% crit loss?

[Meeks]

If you are consistently threat capped the threat enchant is better. If not the agi enchant is better.

A lot also do not have it because very very few people could do the enchant until recently.

Which to do is a decision you will have to make for yourself.

[Ksala]

Assuming the 2.3 changes (whirlwind hitting with both weapons) make it onto live in their current state do you think that slow offhands will become the norm for fury warriors?

[Meeks]

After the Midol kicks in and my tears dry up I will start to reconsider some things.

[Morthengel]

So whirlwind will attack with both weapons...Does this mean the mainhand part of whirlwind can now miss even if you are above 9% hit?