Dagger is not necessarily a dirty word
Posted 03-01-2008 at 02:19 PM by Satrina
I see this all the time. Someone using [item]Crystalline Kopesh[/item] or [item]Grom'tor's Charge[/item] grabs up [item]Blade of the Unrequited[/item] and is wondering if they should use it. Inevitably, you get this:
Let's have a look at Devastates with Grom'tor's Charge vs. Blade of the Unrequited, shall we?
Say you have 700AP buffed up, that works out to +50DPS
Say the boss has 7700 armour, which becomes 5100 after 5 Sunders, or 32.57% mitigation (67.42% taken)
Grom'tor's Charge
75-140 damage (average 107), speed 1.6. Your 50DPS turns into +120 damage per hit normalised to 2.4 on Devastate. Your Devastate will land for 1/2 weapon damage + 175, which is (120+107)/2 + 175 = 288. That 288 gets mitigated to 288 x 0.6742 = 195 damage average.
So, your threat per devastate is 195 + 176 = 371. With defensive stance and defiance, that's 555 threat.
Blade of the Unrequited
112-168 damage (average 140), speed 1.6. Your 50DPS turns into 51.28DPS because the blade has 18AP, and that translates to +87 damage per hit normalised to 1.7 on Devastate. Your Devastate will land for 1/2 weapon damage + 175, which is (140+87)/2 + 175 = 288. That 288 gets mitigated to 288 x 0.6742 = 195 damage average.
So, your threat per devastate is 195 + 176 = 371. With defensive stance and defiance, that's 555 threat.
Neat, huh? Now consider that [item]Blade of the Unrequited[/item] is TWENTY DPS better than [item]Grom'tor's Charge[/item], and that you can socket 36 stamina into it. There is no reason not to use this.
That said, [item]King's Defender[/item] is the natural upgrade to this since you do get higher normalised Devastates at the same base DPS. [item]The Sun Eater[/item] and [item]Fireguard[/item] will often be considered upgrades because of the combination of "better tanking stats" and better Devastate threat through normalisation (that's an argument for another day)
Yes, daggers are generally suboptimal tanking weapons - when comparing against other weapons of the same general item level. When comparing against lower item levels or even the quality below (green vs. blue, blue vs. purple), dagger isn't necessarily a dirty word for tanks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Some random retard on the WoW Warrior Forums
Daggers are bad tanking weapons because your special attacks are normalized at 1.7 instead of 2.4 which is big reduction in damage and therefore is a big reduction in threat.
Say you have 700AP buffed up, that works out to +50DPS
Say the boss has 7700 armour, which becomes 5100 after 5 Sunders, or 32.57% mitigation (67.42% taken)
Grom'tor's Charge
75-140 damage (average 107), speed 1.6. Your 50DPS turns into +120 damage per hit normalised to 2.4 on Devastate. Your Devastate will land for 1/2 weapon damage + 175, which is (120+107)/2 + 175 = 288. That 288 gets mitigated to 288 x 0.6742 = 195 damage average.
So, your threat per devastate is 195 + 176 = 371. With defensive stance and defiance, that's 555 threat.
Blade of the Unrequited
112-168 damage (average 140), speed 1.6. Your 50DPS turns into 51.28DPS because the blade has 18AP, and that translates to +87 damage per hit normalised to 1.7 on Devastate. Your Devastate will land for 1/2 weapon damage + 175, which is (140+87)/2 + 175 = 288. That 288 gets mitigated to 288 x 0.6742 = 195 damage average.
So, your threat per devastate is 195 + 176 = 371. With defensive stance and defiance, that's 555 threat.
Neat, huh? Now consider that [item]Blade of the Unrequited[/item] is TWENTY DPS better than [item]Grom'tor's Charge[/item], and that you can socket 36 stamina into it. There is no reason not to use this.
That said, [item]King's Defender[/item] is the natural upgrade to this since you do get higher normalised Devastates at the same base DPS. [item]The Sun Eater[/item] and [item]Fireguard[/item] will often be considered upgrades because of the combination of "better tanking stats" and better Devastate threat through normalisation (that's an argument for another day)
Yes, daggers are generally suboptimal tanking weapons - when comparing against other weapons of the same general item level. When comparing against lower item levels or even the quality below (green vs. blue, blue vs. purple), dagger isn't necessarily a dirty word for tanks.
Total Comments 8
Comments
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Good post Satrina!Posted 03-01-2008 at 02:27 PM by Taowlie 
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Yes, yes, yes.
Posted 03-01-2008 at 07:11 PM by Ciderhelm - I remember when [item]Alcor's Sunrazor[/item] was an ungodly tank weapon.
Posted 03-02-2008 at 03:19 AM by Kaganda - Mud, that's a dirty word :P
Posted 03-02-2008 at 05:47 AM by Valdemar -
This blog post makes me happy.Posted 03-03-2008 at 07:29 AM by Ariedan - Two thumbs up!
Posted 03-04-2008 at 12:39 PM by Dansodai - I knew a tank who used that dagger for tanking and lost their MT spot for it, leaders said it was dumb. Needless to say, the leader was a huntard who had never done any research, or played a warrior past level 4. Good post, sir, good post.
Posted 09-15-2008 at 08:12 PM by thedrawrf -
I used a [item]Julie's dagger[/item] (a long time ago) and that got me some flak, but then there was this dungeon called BWL and some dragon in it required that you have as high of a threat ceiling as possible and suddenly there were people asking me where they could get one.
Speed, dps, stats - everything matters (including normalization) and the worst you can do is assume that something is some way without at least trying it out for a while.Posted 09-15-2008 at 08:39 PM by Smaken
