Status Quo
Posted 06-24-2009 at 08:55 AM by Horacio
I listened to Cider and Lore's latest podcast last night while running around and leveling my shaman. Among the things they discussed was the pace at which content is released and they touched on some of the available news on 3.2.
I got to thinking and it carried on for a while and kept me from going to sleep for a bit.
Wow is a constantly evolving game and maybe its because I'm older but I don't really like that. I need to explain more. Yes, I enjoy seeing new content and the story unfolding. new beasts and villians to defeat, more powerful spells and abilities and new 'things' like gear and vanity items.
But to me it feels like Wow is a dynamic laboratory of trial and error. So many large macro mechanics change rather quickly and systemic alteration of the game its self makes for a lot to keep up with.
Granted, this is coming from a warrior tank who has played that way for 4+ years.
Classes are revamped and rethought frequently and the FotM effect is prevalent. The nerf/buff pendulum swings wildly at times.
We are getting ready to engage the new raid zone coming with 3.2 that is a departure from previous raid content. Its a suped up Ring of Blood with raid bosses and I'm not quite sure what to make of it. It doesn't fit the story very well to me and in a way feels like a cheap cop out, introducing new loots, and new stuff without much of the filler.
More specifically thinking of the Ulduar nerfs that began with the release of 3.1, they trouble me. No, I need them, to be honest, or I wouldn't be where I am in progression. I am not changing guilds and I can only go as far as the raid is capable. What bothers me was the way they were handled and how it fits into to the larger issue I have with the way Blizzard changes the game over time...seemingly with a chainsaw and duct tape.
The nerfs didn't roll out after a specific period of time that left players with a definite boundry between hard and less hard. they were immediate and constant and unbalanced. Some bosses became trivial(XT-002). Some actually got a little tougher(Ignis, though it was more a fix of an unintended strategy).
In some ways I think its a double edged sword. It keeps news sites popping, it keeps people thinking about it and it pushes player to play more to keep up with changes. On the other hand it creates a rat race mentality as you reach out to grab the carrot and it 'blinks' away and outlines a new standard.
I need to max out >this< stat and acquire this item. Without the release of any new items, it changes due to a mechanical change and now that stat isn't so hot and that item is really not BiS anymore.
Eh, its all a little frustrating. I didn't see the badge change coming and I spent a ton on runed orbs to make boots to improve my gear. Now....pfft, I feel a little foolish. I stockpiled a ton of flasks for 3.1 and they radically changed that and it took a huge outcry to get thrown a bone.
So now raiding changes and end game is PvE arena in about a month. I dunno about this.
I got to thinking and it carried on for a while and kept me from going to sleep for a bit.
Wow is a constantly evolving game and maybe its because I'm older but I don't really like that. I need to explain more. Yes, I enjoy seeing new content and the story unfolding. new beasts and villians to defeat, more powerful spells and abilities and new 'things' like gear and vanity items.
But to me it feels like Wow is a dynamic laboratory of trial and error. So many large macro mechanics change rather quickly and systemic alteration of the game its self makes for a lot to keep up with.
Granted, this is coming from a warrior tank who has played that way for 4+ years.
Classes are revamped and rethought frequently and the FotM effect is prevalent. The nerf/buff pendulum swings wildly at times.
We are getting ready to engage the new raid zone coming with 3.2 that is a departure from previous raid content. Its a suped up Ring of Blood with raid bosses and I'm not quite sure what to make of it. It doesn't fit the story very well to me and in a way feels like a cheap cop out, introducing new loots, and new stuff without much of the filler.
More specifically thinking of the Ulduar nerfs that began with the release of 3.1, they trouble me. No, I need them, to be honest, or I wouldn't be where I am in progression. I am not changing guilds and I can only go as far as the raid is capable. What bothers me was the way they were handled and how it fits into to the larger issue I have with the way Blizzard changes the game over time...seemingly with a chainsaw and duct tape.
The nerfs didn't roll out after a specific period of time that left players with a definite boundry between hard and less hard. they were immediate and constant and unbalanced. Some bosses became trivial(XT-002). Some actually got a little tougher(Ignis, though it was more a fix of an unintended strategy).
In some ways I think its a double edged sword. It keeps news sites popping, it keeps people thinking about it and it pushes player to play more to keep up with changes. On the other hand it creates a rat race mentality as you reach out to grab the carrot and it 'blinks' away and outlines a new standard.
I need to max out >this< stat and acquire this item. Without the release of any new items, it changes due to a mechanical change and now that stat isn't so hot and that item is really not BiS anymore.
Eh, its all a little frustrating. I didn't see the badge change coming and I spent a ton on runed orbs to make boots to improve my gear. Now....pfft, I feel a little foolish. I stockpiled a ton of flasks for 3.1 and they radically changed that and it took a huge outcry to get thrown a bone.
So now raiding changes and end game is PvE arena in about a month. I dunno about this.
Total Comments 15
Comments
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The idea of PVE arena for 3-4 hours a night 3-4 days a week does not sound exciting - its the next tier but it sure feels more like Worlf of World of Warcraftn than content to get excited about.
It's probably the Dev' answer to "Well guys what can you roll out fast?"Posted 06-24-2009 at 09:28 AM by loquatious 
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I to am disapointed that they are releasing this new change in a chainsaw matter like you said. I thought this was going to close the ashbringer story line. I havn't heard any mention of it. I really wonder what is going on on other realms when the push some of these nerfs. Some really dont make since. My bestfriend is a pally tank in all Naxx 25 gear. NO ONE can pull threat off of him and he rarely gets touched by bosses, but i hear alot of pallys complain. Maybe other realms have problems with pallys. But on topic I agree H. Well put.(I to am old)Posted 06-24-2009 at 10:12 AM by Sylvaneart -
I know what you're saying Horacio. My guild is just now working on Yogg for the past few weeks and already I can see the attrition setting in from this new news of 3.2 'soon.'
I think we're two of the longer standing warrior tanks out there, 4+ years and all, many people never got to see warriors being the only tanks, or how bad ass it was to have QS and the Car Door shield from chromag.
I'm with ya, I hope things don't continue to speed up and make the perception of a rat race even more prevalent.Posted 06-24-2009 at 11:55 AM by Wars -
I too can relate, here we were doing Naxx 25, OS sarth with a drake up and suddenly our guild had seen the end game content. Mind you we never stepped into Sunwell, did some BT after the nerf. Now tonite we are making our Ulduar 25 attempt for the first time...I can just imagine how far we will be in before 3.2 comes...Posted 06-24-2009 at 12:49 PM by Enok -
Much of my trepidation comes from the nature of the content about to be released. By the descriptions, it can't possibly be as compelling as Ulduar and yet, there are some people who will say "I dun wanna story, I want moar phat lootz!"
And given the structure of this game, its hard to say "no, we are on Mimiron now and we are going to finish strong before going to the arena"?
Its going to be tough to fight that urge because, even in the 25 man 'regular' the loot is better than Ulduar 25 drops outside of hard mode (and even then, I'm not sure)
But this is less about the logistics of the time they release but what this is, exactly.
Part of the appeal of PvP is that you can get online, que for a BG or have a set meeting time for 2,3, or 5 people to go get it done. Its pretty easy.
This....just doesn't feel like a 'raid'. Its not something to look forward to. Are we going to pull it all together and see what happens after we down this next boss?
Really, what do we remember about raiding? The holy crap moments when Rags emerges and one shots Domo and towers over the raid......when Nef lands on the balcony, hoses the raid and yells "BURN!" Vashj's bridge rising up out of the depths, Sapphiron's opening sequence.....
This just doesn't feel right. I'm not 100% sour on the concept but THIS should have been entry level raiding for an expansion or an alternative route to acquire gear....not the next tier of progression.
If we could swap this and Naxx in the progression chain....Posted 06-24-2009 at 02:08 PM by Horacio - It is way too fast for me too.
I understand they had to unleash stuff, but with the summer and all? by the time I'm back from my summer holliday and want to finish up ulduar instead I'm off to... a become a gladiator?
*confuzzled*Posted 06-24-2009 at 02:12 PM by Aethelas 
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If you look at the screenshots of the "tournament" instance, I think you'll find it surprisingly nerubian.
I think there's more to this tourney than meets the eye.Posted 06-24-2009 at 03:47 PM by Alent - I don't like the Collosium being a new tier. If anything, it should be on par with Ulduar, with sidegrade items and alternative choices.
I don't want to feel that the Argent Crusade are handing out better loot in a tournament then a bloody OLD GOD!
Remember BC? Gruul and Mag were the same tier. Tempest Keep and Serpentshrine were the same tier. Black Temple and Mount Hyjal were the same tier.
I miss that. And I miss the attunement, the massive backstory...sigh.
I don't want a Collosium as the next main raid. I'd be fine with it as a sideshow, but as the next big thing? No thanks. Give us an Azjol Nerub raid! Give us more Dragonflight instances! Give us more Caverns of Time! I don't want to see Icecrown by the end of the year - I want more filler!Posted 06-24-2009 at 04:07 PM by Durandro - Is it fair to guess that the nerubian part will be the 5-man dungeon? From the descriptions I've seen over at MMO-Champion the raid does seem to be an arena/ring of blood type thingy, up in the Coliseum. If there are additional dungeon bits down below, and I know there's a 5-man about which there's hardly any talk in the patch, I'm putting two and two together.
On topic, I am really sceptical whether I should consider this 'raiding tier' at all. My (very casual) 10-man raiding community just managed to defeat Hodir and is probably going to hibernate the next few weeks due to summer kicking in. I'm not taking bets on ever seeing us march past Mimiron, much less beat any hard modes, but I'm rather sure we'll stay at it until the next 'story mode' raid hits the servers. Which, by our schedule, means abandoning any serious thoughts about the Coliseum.Posted 06-24-2009 at 04:17 PM by Khordam - yeh, i was sad that they didnt give us any lore apart from someone at the argent turny thinking "HEY, ive got all these epics, lets make people fight things for them"
Ah well.Posted 06-24-2009 at 04:26 PM by Gordonoth - Well, they took 5 months to release 3.1, and there was HUGE QQ to accompany that, with tons screaming that they took too long, and now, I figure it'll have been 4 or 5 months since 3.1 before they put out the Coliseum. It's all perception.
Posted 06-24-2009 at 05:12 PM by mavfin - Well the content getting pushed out so quickly makes me think that Blizzard isn't putting a lot of thought into new material and that Lich King will be the end of WoW as we know it for the main storyline, there isn't much else left for us to experience. The Ulduar nerfs straight out of the gate were unnecessary and there were loads of bugs the first couple of weeks. I recall two encounters where Deconstructor bugged on us and didn't enrage, allowing my raid group to kill him before they wound up nerfing him. The first few bosses are pretty easy, never got past that though because people refused to pull their heads out of their asses and pay attention to what was going on during the raid or they were not comitted enough to be able to run 3 hours a night and get stuff done. I felt sorry for my guild leader too because every night it was the same nonsense and we had so many people in the guild who were geared to raid Ulduar 25 man and at least kill the first 4 bosses no problem but we never had raid balance. I quit because I felt that I was being rushed and that I needed a change for a while before returning to the game. I dislike a lot of what Blizzard is doing with the nerfs (my poor Pally is going to be shit for DPS now I think) and their nerf + band aid philosophy is complete nonsense. I got no issue with them making fights a little less complex so that people can complete them in a more casual environment, but only after the hardcore players have done it like they did in BC when T5 content got nerfed. But the way I see it is that Blizz wants to make raiding something for casual players to enjoy which means that those of us who like the end game difficulty are getting the shaft.
Posted 06-24-2009 at 07:27 PM by Rennadrel - One of the achievements mentions the traitor king...
I also think the tournament has more to it than simply killing giant worms and elephants. I am expecting the "organisers" to be doing the "service for the lich king" thing, infiltrating the argent crusade and destroying the only real opponents to the lich king and his generals in ice crownPosted 06-25-2009 at 06:20 AM by Pyrea - No less than Bornakk said that is was 'like Ring of Blood' but I'm too lazy to dig up the quote.
For me, its less about timing than the actual content its self. I don't expect the game to conform to my progression track and I actually miss the days of working on something to complete it like when we were still pounding away at AQ40 when Naxx came out and determined to finish BWL before moving to AQ40.
I suppose part of that was being a little naive and thinking we had to finish to have a chance but part of it was the lore behind Nefarian and thinking of him as a big bad ass that must die.
We'll see how it pans out. I asked our RL last night what his thoughts were and he just shrugged. We're set up nicely to take more shots at Mimiron tonight after dealing with Freya and my 10 man just killed Hodir and Thorim for the first time this last week. But like I said, I don't peg the appropriate release schedule to my guild's progression though I would guess we are smack dab middle of the road for casual raiding guilds in that regard.Posted 06-25-2009 at 08:12 AM by Horacio - As I've said often, Blizzard seems to have changed gears sometime in BC. Before, WoW content was static and new content was simply added at the high end. After about T6, WoW content comes in seasons. One ends, the next starts, everyone moves along whether they've finished the previous season or not.
I prefer to think of WoW as "place" so I prefer the old design. I guess the market thinks of WoW as "feed" so we have the new design.Posted 06-25-2009 at 10:14 AM by Machus
