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View Full Version : Tanking Need advice, taking way to much damage.



xenodude
09-26-2011, 01:03 PM
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/maelstrom/Hipolito/advanced

Healers have been complaining that i take too much damage. I dont really understand why since ive been following the advice of basically every top tier forum there is.



I'd appreciate the help.

Bigbad
09-26-2011, 03:49 PM
Doesn't look bad but there are a few easy things to improve get mining and BS upto 525 get a belt buckle and headenchant. Your gemming and reforging looks good but 47ish% block is a bit low, 359 jp ring 359 rep boots 365 cloak from the thrall questline will all improve your block, mastery trinket from tol barad wouldn't be bad either, but its all just minor upgrades from what you have now getting a few 378 pieces in there will have a bigger impact. Boe bracers/neck or just some other vp pieces.

You shouldn't be taking "way too much damage". So maybe there are a few things in your playstyle you can improve. Do you use an addon to track demoshout/tc? using auracle myslef for that. Using shieldblock on cd with dodge on use from trinkets between the shieldblocks? Using cds freely? Shieldwall when you know a lot of damage is incoming and last stand to save your ass when you drop low?

xenodude
09-26-2011, 04:32 PM
Thank you for the reply.

You mean i should switch back to 359 items and the 365 cloak ?
what do you consider is a good amount of block and avoidance?

I dont use any addons to track my CD's, so im gonna go ahead and start with that. Also, i usually do use cd's freely since im just starting to get used to cata raiding, will keep in mind from now on.

Gregasaurous
09-26-2011, 04:52 PM
You have several items reforged incorrectly. Ill, list them below, but first i believe you missed a key mechanic for warriors jsut based off of you reforging. PARRY>DODGE Due to Hold the line as a Prot warrior you want you parry 2~3 percentage points higher than dodge. In the following reforge suggestions if i put a ** next to it, you will also get more mastery our of it and therefor is a MUST FIX the rest slowly go down the list until you parry:dodge is where it shoud be.
Head, reforge dodge to mastery
Neck, reforge expertise to parry
**Chest, reforge dodge to mastery
Everything else will probably be ok. Except for your second trinket..... it's digusting, ditch it. Get a mastery trinket if you can. If not reforge the dodge to mastery for the time being.

Bigbad
09-26-2011, 11:41 PM
Yes the cloak with hit and ring with expertise aren't better cause they have an higher itemlevel. Guess with your itemlevel 50-52% block would be good should aim for 60-62% once you reach average itemlevel of 378

swelt
09-27-2011, 02:58 AM
You shouldn't be taking "way too much damage". So maybe there are a few things in your playstyle you can improve. Do you use an addon to track demoshout/tc? using auracle myslef for that. Using shieldblock on cd with dodge on use from trinkets between the shieldblocks? Using cds freely? Shieldwall when you know a lot of damage is incoming and last stand to save your ass when you drop low?

^ this would be my bet. The difference in gearing between good enough and optimal won't make healers start or stop complaining that you 'take way too much damage'. That comes from technique, encounter knowledge, not standing in stuff.

xenodude
09-27-2011, 03:39 PM
Thank you all for your replies, Ive found them most helpful. Already dled Auracle and reforged the above mentioned items. Been practicing a bit with my guild and things seem to go a lo smoother than before due to beter understanding of the encounters and better use of my CD's and trinkets.

Thanks again for the help.

kungfugrip
09-30-2011, 03:53 PM
check out my "STOP! ..... check here first!" thread i made the other day, it has tons of links to great resources that basically take all the guessing out of making the most of your character.

xenodude
11-02-2011, 09:22 AM
I'm back!
A month has gone by and just wanted to see what you all think about my toon now. I do have one more question though, are there any specific numbers i should aim at with mastery, doge and parry by now i.e. 17 parry,14 dodge 60 block?

Tengenstein
11-02-2011, 10:00 AM
97.4% combined Dodge+Block+Parry chance. the exact split of dodge and parry rating is dependant upon how much total avoidance rating and how much mastery you have. THIS (http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/940236-Updated-Parry-Dodge-ratio-graph) is a good explanation of it and a decent visual reference for it. at high mastery you really don't need that much more parry than dodge rating.


Personally I think you're chasing Ilvls. Why the 378 cloak when the 365 quest one is better, why Stay of Execution when Tol barad trinket is still oh so loverly, and i'd take the lylagar horn ring over Theck's Emberseal

xenodude
11-02-2011, 10:55 AM
lets say the 365 quest cloak is no more... stay of execution is just a a temporary trinket, im waiting for the spidersilk one and i equipped the theck's over lylagar because i needed a bit more of hit without sacrficing too much parry or mastery.

Leucifer
11-02-2011, 10:59 AM
Gear is not likely the issue. Take a look at what you're doing in encounters. I see tanks frequently taking unneccesary damage say, on Shannox, because they fail to avoid the traps. I'd say 90% of the time, it's something performance-wise. Take a look at the top players.... are they that good because of gear? Or skill?

Tengenstein
11-02-2011, 11:23 AM
i needed a bit more of hit

You need hit like you need spirit. With the 60%threat buff and the fact interrupts no longer can miss we got no reason to have hit. Protection warriors just don't need it. If you're having aggro problems it's almost certainly to do with your ability usage, and if you're gonna stack a stat for threat it's expertise you want, it's nigh worth double what hit is.

xenodude
11-02-2011, 01:31 PM
Gear is not likely the issue. Take a look at what you're doing in encounters. I see tanks frequently taking unneccesary damage say, on Shannox, because they fail to avoid the traps. I'd say 90% of the time, it's something performance-wise. Take a look at the top players.... are they that good because of gear? Or skill?

Leucifer, i probably should have explained this, but i no longer have issues with the damage im taking. I was just checking in to see if u ppl had any tips on my ctc and items. Then again i probably should have started a new thread. :P


You need hit like you need spirit. With the 60%threat buff and the fact interrupts no longer can miss we got no reason to have hit. Protection warriors just don't need it. If you're having aggro problems it's almost certainly to do with your ability usage, and if you're gonna stack a stat for threat it's expertise you want, it's nigh worth double what hit is.

kk, working on it now. Thanks for the advice.

Leucifer
11-02-2011, 03:34 PM
Leucifer, i probably should have explained this, but i no longer have issues with the damage im taking. I was just checking in to see if u ppl had any tips on my ctc and items. Then again i probably should have started a new thread. :P


No blood. No foul.
So what did you find improved the damage you were taking?

By the way, I wasn't trying to be mean or condescending. Just honestly, most of the times I ran into issues with taking too much damage, I was unaware of a mechanic in effect, or was just flat-out doing something bad.

And yes, expertise > hit. By far. I generally never see misses with even my meh hit rating... but I hear that damn "clank" indicating a parry or block from a boss plenty. And that's even with a healthy amount of expertise. As for threat issues, this is where block really shines for warrior. Block reduces damage, but still ensures you take SOME so that you still generate vengeance. Honestly, until you get vengeance built up solid, you're going to probably see the threat numbers looking a little sketchy. At least that's what I noticed with my warrior. The other posters are on the money though. You want CTC, with block favored over parry and dodge.

One nice little simple trick to help build threat at the start that I picked up was using retaliation on kick off. It can be used in defensive stance nowadays. Helps build aggro lead if I'm having issues.

Tengenstein
11-02-2011, 04:30 PM
One nice little simple trick to help build threat at the start that I picked up was using retaliation on kick off. It can be used in defensive stance nowadays. Helps build aggro lead if I'm having issues.

Try Recklessness. 20% mor damage when your building vengeance is a huge bonus,, oh and the +50% crit helps with burst aggro

Leucifer
11-02-2011, 04:34 PM
Try Recklessness. 20% mor damage when your building vengeance is a huge bonus,, oh and the +50% crit helps with burst aggro
That's a good one too. Didn't think about the additional damage = additional vengeance factor. Good point.
Plus it's easier for a healer to cope with extra damage at the get-go anyway.

Tengenstein
11-02-2011, 05:42 PM
on most pulls unless there's like 10+ mobs i find recklessness hardly get's used., i'll get like 3 exta melee swings worth of damage, which isn't alot of threat really

Leucifer
11-03-2011, 08:53 AM
Fair enough. I'll give that a try myself. On my warrior, just always seems to be a build up needed. Once I get past a certain point, I'm pretty golden, but before I hit that sweet spot with vengeance/threat I don't really get too comfy.

Mystestorm
11-16-2011, 03:51 PM
May I ask for some advice here as well please.

Our group is running with two healers. Disc Priest and myself (Druid Healer). We have not been having an issue until about two weeks ago, when our paladin tank has suddenly started taking such immense spikes of damage, sometimes he is unhealable.

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/shadowsong/Baelkar/simple

(http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/shadowsong/Baelkar/simple)In addition, we have recently started on HC Modes, and are having issues where one of our Alyz interrupters "A warrior" says it is completely unrealistic to expect him to cope alone on interrupts, and even with a hunter using a pet to help him, he is unable to cope at all, 9 of every 10 Fieroblasts go through on his side. Why would this be the case, when other 10-man groups do not seem to have an issue.

Apologies for being a disturbance, but I am at my wit's end now.

Outbackjack
11-16-2011, 05:33 PM
9 out of every 10 casts? So he only successfully interrupts 1 Pyroblast cast per Initiate? He might be trying to interrupt the Brushfire casts which, while interruptible now post-nerf, are not the priority spell to be interrupting. If he is missing any Pyroblast casts the Initiate is buffing himself with Fire It Up! (http://www.wowhead.com/spell=100093) which will increase the cast speed of the Initiate by 10%. So if he starts missing interrupts it will only get harder as he goes along.

Do you have any logs for us to look at?

sifuedition
11-17-2011, 12:36 AM
He logged out in ret spec/gear. All I can look at is his spec. Only a couple of things to notice there. Hallowed Ground is a weak talent. Consecration has never been the threat magnet it has been accused of being. Not only that, he has glyphed for it. Better is to fill out Guarded by the Light. Take the last point over to the ret tree. Personally, I put that point in Pursuit of Justice. I also take one point out of Rule of Law and fill out Pursuit. Run speed is hard to quantify but impossible to replace. It also allows using the 50 mastery boot enchant instead of Lavawalker.

Having said that, those are small things and do not explain taking excessive damage. Without seeing gear, it could definitely be involved with that. However, it could just as likely be mechanics such as turning his back to move instead of strafing, not using cds, not being aware of mechanics, etc.