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Shaiso
07-30-2011, 04:42 AM
Right, first time posting!

Last night for the first time ever I went into a dungeon with a PUG, now to give a bit of back story I have only ever really done PVE and only lightly dipped my toes in PvP for some awesome shoulder pads in the past!

Like I said, so I was in my first dungeon and I don't think I was a good enough tank for the group, I tried my best to keep aggro and keep the enemies off the squsihy's in back but failed a couple of times which resulted in us wiping once and me dieing twice.

They were all mostly nice about this, although I could understand their frustration and gave me some tips on how essentially to get better, Stack Mana and Strength along with Dodge.

So I just wondered if the community had any Advice for how I could get better at tanking properly?..It's a role I love and would love to get better at!

Anyway, this is my character and my gear. Any advice would be immense!
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/nordrassil/Shaiso/simple

Grindleguts
07-30-2011, 05:54 AM
Hello Shaiso. Looking at your gear you would be better off healing than tanking with the setup on armory... because intellect and spirit is for Holy. Sometime back in TBC intellect and spell power was needed to tank as pala but this is Cataclysm. Only your Relic, shoulders and bracers are tank-oriented.

Stats

Your stats as a paladin tank to aim for is

Strength, Expertise, Hit (for threat)
Mastery >> Dodge >= Parry (to reduce/avoid damage taken) and Stamina

Strength will be on all your tanking gear except trinkets. Do not gem or enchant for it.
Enchant your gear with mastery when possible, and stamina or dodge when needed (bracers/chest/legs/shoulder)

Spec

Your spec is tankable but a bit more PvP than PvE oriented. I will suggest http://www.wowhead.com/talent#sZGMhcRkdRRucbG for an all around tank spec with utility and survivability.
Explanation of the choices:

Eternal Glory: with 4.1 there was a cooldown added to word of glory, making this talent worth a lot less.
Seals of the pure are better spent points
Judgements of the just: slowing the enemy's attack speed is less damage on you and 20% is a big deal. Get this.
Hallowed ground: Consecration is in a poor place now with its long cooldown and quite low damage. While this has some utility in 5-mans I don't consider it worth go for. If you need to use consecration you can still do it occasionally and mana will get returned with judgement/blocks. Guarded by the light could be swapped for this if you really want the extra AoE (which paladins already are good at).
Divine Guardian: -20% damage to all party and raid members in range with 2 min cooldown is huge. Your healers will love you and it can prevent a wipe. Well worth 1 talent.
Eye for an eye: as you are going to spend your time getting hit in the face rather than being the target of spells, at least while tanking, this talent loses much value. More PvP than PvE.
Pursuit of Justice: You pull and one mob gets loose. 15% increased runspeed is a lot, and it helps you move out of fires a lot faster too. You want this.

Glyphs
Prime: When tanking mostly 5-mans, Shield of the Righteous and Hammer of the Righteous are good choices. Seal of Truth grants 10 Expertise which makes it probably the best threat glyph in game. (5% crit to crusader strike is "meh" IMO)
Major: Rebuke. If you happen to be out of mana or very low, this glyph will save your life. Really. Interrupt free of cost is awesome in Cata. Dazing Shield: slowing mobs on the loose can be very valuable. Focused shield are more for progressing raids where you absolutely want the, post-nerf quite low, extra threat. Avenger's Shield is a smart spell that does not break CC. You can use it to pull one target with two CC'd nearby safely. Holy Wrath: an extra stun versus dragons and elementals? Yes.
Minor: Nothing that really helps out with tanking, choose what you prefer.

Tanking and generating threat

Always use righteous fury and Seal of Truth.

Single target: Crusader Strike > Shield of the righteous(3 holy power) > Avenger's shield > Judgement > Holy Wrath
(mind though that Holy Wrath breaks CC, don't use if there are any crowd controlled mobs)
More targets: Hammer of the Righteous > Inquisition(best with 3 holy power) > Avenger's shield > Holy Wrath > Judgement

For extra initial aggro, let's say when you get to the boss, use Divine Plea and Avenging Wrath just before pull and you can open with a 20% stronger Avenger's shield and Shield of the rightous with 3 HoPo which gives you a good threat lead.

To survive the general nature of LFD PuGs: tell the group you are new to tanking and ask that people use CC and use Misdirects/Tricks of the trade and not all-out dps right away when pulling.

That's quite a read I know, but ask if you wonder about anything.

Shaiso
07-30-2011, 06:34 AM
My word that's a lot to take in at first! >.<

Everything I have on my paladin is purely from me playing nothing but PVE...It's only since supreme boredom set in at 85 I wanted to try out some dungeons and be a better tank!

So, look for new gear, re-arrange my talents and learn a better rotation?..Because essentially all I was doing in the dungeon was leading with crusader shield and then spamming AOE's hopping to keep the aggro of every enemy around me

Tengenstein
07-30-2011, 01:24 PM
IT's a slight threat increase on single target to only dump HP with ShotR if you have inquisition or Sacred Duty up, otherwise dumping iwith inquistion instead. Reckoning is more threat per talent point than Rule of Law so i'd finish that off over Rule of Law (actually i'd drop the second point of GbtL but that just becuase using the absorb right is finnicky)

You threat stat priority is

Exp(to26)>hit(to 8%)>expertise(to 53)>strength

As said above you shouldn't need to gem/reforge for any of them

Lumines
07-31-2011, 01:34 AM
As has been said above, you're going to struggle with tanking just now because you're basically not wearing tanking gear. As such, your survivability is going to be extremely low in that setup, and your threat output will be similarly poor because almost none of your gear has strength on it.

The gear you're looking for will have Strength and Stamina as the primary (white) stats. For secondary stats, you want Mastery > Dodge ~ Parry > Expertise > Hit.

So for example, a piece may have Stamina, Strength, Mastery and Dodge on it. If it has Intellect on it: you don't want it. If it has Spirit on it: you don't want it. Crit and Haste are secondary stats for DPS classes (like your Retribution spec), but are sub-optimal for tanking (although still better than most of the stuff you're currently wearing, purely for the Strength).

The spec suggestion above is spot-on, so follow that and - more importantly - try and get some actual tanking gear from Reputation vendors and the Auction House and you'll have a much easier time of it.

sifuedition
07-31-2011, 12:11 PM
This is not meant in any mean way...I had to do it myself when I was a fresh 80. You will probably be best served to dps or heal while you collect gear. Make sure you are not doing this blindly, however. Tanks have to be more aware than anyone else in the group with healers close behind. Also, pay close attention to everything a tank does if you feel he's doing well. How does henposition? Does he face them away? Do you see any visual indications of cooldowns? Who did he cc? What kind of cc? Tons of info can be gathered that way.