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Aliena
07-01-2011, 11:56 AM
Cc0kfS8-KB0



Hello and welcome to the Firelands Raid Guide! My name is Aliena, and in this video I'll show you all you have to know about Ragnaros, the last boss in this new raid instance. We defeated this fight with 2 tanks, 6 healers and 17 DPS, but similar raid configurations may work just as well. Since tank damage is significant, at least 3 of your healers should be dedicated to the tanks.

The Ragnaros encounter consists of three phases and two transitions, making it the longest encounter in this instance and also the one with the steepest learning curve. In his 25-man version, Ragnaros has 201 million health, and in his 10-man version he sports 52 million.

Phase 1 lasts from 100 to 70% of his health, then the first transition happens where Ragnaros himself submerges and you're faced with 8 adds. Phase 2 lasts from 70 to 40% of his health, then the second transition happens where you're again faced with adds (although more this time); and Phase 3 starts at 40% and ends when Ragnaros hits 10% health, at which point you won the game. For now, at least.

When you engage Ragnaros, your tanks should be positioned at the far right side of the room, whereas melee should be on the left, and ranged DPS as well as healers should spread out over the rest of the room. The reason you need to bring two tanks to this is an ability called Burning Wound, which is a stacking dot debuff placed on Ragnaros' current target that starts out dealing about 6k damage every 2 seconds but grows quickly. When the stacks grow too large - after about 20-30 seconds - your tanks should taunt off each other so the first tank can reset his debuff. This ability persists throughout the whole fight.

Ragnaros has several abilities in this phase, all of which are fairly easy to deal with. The first is Hand of Ragnaros, which will deal some damage to everyone in melee range and knock them back several yards. His second ability is Wrath of Ragnaros, which will randomly pick 3 targets, deal some damage and knock them back.

Minding the knockback is important for two reasons: For one, if you're too far at the back of the room and get knocked back by Wrath of Ragnaros, there's a chance you'll drop off the platform and will not be able to receive a res. Secondly, phase 1 has a mechanic called Magma Trap. This is a slow missile that will be launched at a random raid member, and when it hits, it'll leave a Magma Trap on the ground that will persist until someone steps on it and detonates it.

You do want to detonate these Magma Traps since otherwise they'll just keep piling up and someone's eventually gonna run over one accidentally, but you want to do this in a controlled fashion. Stepping on a Magma Trap will launch the player doing it up into the air, so the designated detonators should have a form of slowfall available. Also, detonating one will inflict 80k damage to everyone in the raid, so don't step on a trap unless everyone is healed up. We found a few seconds after Hand of Ragnaros to be a good time for trap detonations.

The last phase 1 ability is called Sulfuras Smash and will actually persist throughout the whole fight, so you'd better get used to it quickly. Ragnaros will prepare to smash his hammer on the location of a random raid member which is illustrated by 3 small firepools on the ground. Obviously, you don't want to stand in this. When his hammer hits the ground, 3 lava waves will spawn - one from each little pool - and will move over the whole platform.

Standing in a lava wave will not outright kill anyone, but will inflict a very damaging dot that can and should be dispelled by healers. Ideally though, no one should get hit by the lava waves at all. They're not hard to avoid once you realize how to handle them. The lava waves will always originate from one of the little pools and move straight outwards, so you can pretty accurately predict where not to stand ahead of time.

After a little while of this, Ragnaros should hit 70% health and trigger the first intermission. He'll pick a spot to throw his hammer on the ground and he himself will submerge in the lava for 45 seconds. Again, you NEVER ever want to stand in the hammer. Once it hits the ground, 8 sparks will fly from it that illuminate the spots where the 8 Sons of Flame adds will spawn. Each of them will have 830k health on 25-man difficulty.

Once spawned, they'll slowly move towards the hammer. Should ANY of them reach it, you wipe, simple as that. It's absolutely necessary that you assign stuns, slows and DPS to each Son of Flame ahead of time. They can also be death gripped, but try to reserve that for an emergency. Any Son of Flame that has more than 50% health will move incredibly fast, so an immediate stun will be required on pretty much all of them. There's some raid damage going out in this phase, but it's pretty trivial.

After 45 seconds or when all Sons of Flame have been defeated, Ragnaros will re-emerge and trigger phase 2. Again you'll have to contend with Sulfuras Smash, but Ragnaros has also learned some new tricks.

At the start of the phase, your entire raid should spread out 6 yards apart from each other - even melee. However, the entire middle area of the room should be completely left empty without anyone standing in it. This is because shortly into the phase Ragnaros will use an ability called Molten Seed and Fire Bubbles will spawn on 20 random players. Being within 6 yards of a fire bubble will hurt, so you absolutely want to mind your distance.

Once they spawn, everyone has 10 seconds before they explode to get to a designated stack-spot which should be the front middle of the room, still in range for Ragnaros to melee your tank. Put a raid marker for good measure. The further away you are from the seeds, the less damage you'll take when they explode - and that's exactly the reason why no one should be anywhere near the stack spot when the seeds spawn.

Once they explode, a Molten Inferno add will spawn from every seed. They have 250k health each and need to be defeated quickly, so assign all your AoE DPS to the task. Once defeated, everyone needs to spread back out to be 6 yards apart from each other for the next wave of Seeds.

The last ability Ragnaros uses is called Engulfing Flame, and that's kinda exactly what it does. Periodically, Ragnaros will cover a third of the room in Flames and you shouldn't stand in it.

It's worth noting that stacking up for the Seeds will always coincide with either Engulfing Flame or Sulfurus Smash. If it's Engulfing Flame and affecting the stack spot, everyone needs to move slightly to ensure they're out of it. If it's Sulfuras Smash, everyone should move up a tad to the edge of the lava, since the Smash will never send a lava wave into that direction.

You should only have to deal with about three Seeds before Ragnaros drops to 40% health and triggers the second Intermission. This works much like the last intermission and again you'll have to contend with 8 Sons of Flame, but this time you'll also have to deal with two adds called Lava Scions that have 6 million health each. One will spawn on each side of the platform.

One of your tanks should pick up both and hold them while the rest of the raid disposes of all 8 Sons of Flame. The Scions will randomly debuff a raid member with Blazing Heat, which will make him pop out lava puddles wherever he goes for a few seconds. If any add touches those lava puddles, they regen 10% of their health, so try to kite Blazing Heat away from the adds.

Once all 8 Sons of Flame are dead, your DPS should work on taking out both Lava Scions while your other tank gets ready to pick Ragnaros up when he re-emerges from the lava. The scions can't be alive for too long as your tank needs to be available to taunt Ragnaros off the other tank when his debuff gets too high.

No matter how much health the adds have left though, phase 3 triggers as soon as Ragnaros re-emerges. He'll still use Sulfuras Smash and Engulfing Flames, so mind your feet at all times. His new trick is called Summon Living Meteor. He'll start out by spawning just one, but over the course of the phase more meteors will spawn at an increasing rate, making the phase harder the longer it lasts.

The impending impact point of a meteor will be shown by fire on the ground, and once landed they'll start chasing a random raid member. This is indicated by a faint line going from meteor to target. If anyone at all touches a meteor - whether it be the meteor's targeted person or any other raid member - the meteor will explode and kill anyone within 8 yards of it.

Attacking a meteor will knock it into the opposite direction of the attacking player, and when a Meteor gets close to its target, either the target or another raid member should attack it to trigger the knockback, always minding not to knock it into another raid member. Once knocked back, the meteor will pick a different target and start chasing it. It's worth noting that meteors can only be knocked back once every 5 seconds.

Everyone should keep their distance to meteors at all times as best as they can. Ranged raid members should keep an eye out and help attack a meteor if it gets too close to the person it chases. Ideally, you'll want to defeat Ragnaros before the amount of meteors becomes overwhelming, so any kind of Bloodlust effect is useful in this phase.

When you get Ragnaros to 10% health, he'll fall to the ground and a loot chest will spawn. That's all the tips I have for Ragnaros. I've attached footage of the whole encounter, so if you want to see how we dealt with the various mechanics in detail, have a look at that. Good luck and have fun as always!

Pug
07-01-2011, 12:16 PM
So... Ragnaros doesn't die... Well that's a shocker. See you in the next expansion Ragnaros. :/

Didi
07-01-2011, 12:24 PM
so, 7 bosses down already? GG blizz...

Yoakie
07-01-2011, 02:29 PM
In 10man we all stood on one side before Molten Seeds came and then all moved to the other side and stacked up. Easy to heal, just stun the adds that spawned. The last phase is definately the hardest phase. Edit: There is also a good picture on where to move and stand in 10man/25man at http://25man.com/firelands/ragnaros . I hope this helps out for people that do this boss on 10man!

Aliena
07-01-2011, 04:01 PM
In 10man we all stood on one side before Molten Seeds came and then all moved to the other side and stacked up. Easy to heal, just stun the adds that spawned. The last phase is definately the hardest phase.

We tried that, but in 25-man moving from side to side is not such a good idea, as people far away will likely need the full 10 seconds to make it to the other side.

krilz
07-02-2011, 03:34 PM
Aliena, you sound so chirpy and happy nowadays! Me like ^__^

Hnetto
07-15-2011, 05:08 AM
Despite the fact that we managed to deal with the Sons of Flame during the intermission yesterday i felt that 8 sons in 10 man is a bit too much. If you don't have the right comp i can see it being very hard. Anyone else had the same feeling? IMO it should have been 6 Sons for 10 man instead of 8.

Savante
07-19-2011, 05:21 PM
Despite the fact that we managed to deal with the Sons of Flame during the intermission yesterday i felt that 8 sons in 10 man is a bit too much. If you don't have the right comp i can see it being very hard. Anyone else had the same feeling? IMO it should have been 6 Sons for 10 man instead of 8.

At first few tries, we were frustrated too. We really thought transitions needed a nerf.. but once we got used to it, it became much much more easier. We stopped trying to use slowing abilites. Instead we nuked them directly which really slows their movement speed. Now we have absolutely no problem with those
The closest two adds needs attention. Any melee class can take these down easily (sometimes when we have only 1 melee, we make our druid tank handle one with berserk :) Rest is pretty easy..

Kemanorel
08-01-2011, 02:44 PM
Anyone else reminded of another Platform based 3 phase 2 transition fight in the last expansion?

Zellviren
08-02-2011, 05:12 AM
We tried that, but in 25-man moving from side to side is not such a good idea, as people far away will likely need the full 10 seconds to make it to the other side.
Paragon did it this way in their heroic kill, but I'm not sure if that was for other reasons that are only extant on heroic.

Grombrindal
08-05-2011, 01:24 PM
So... Ragnaros doesn't die... Well that's a shocker. See you in the next expansion Ragnaros. :/

He dies on heroic... which I actually think is kind of cool that they set it up that way...

Daimon
08-06-2011, 10:54 AM
A moonkin makes this fight much easier in 10m since the hardest parts require adds control; and don't ever try it w/o a mage if you're learning it.

Aeshmae
08-07-2011, 09:54 AM
A moonkin makes this fight much easier in 10m since the hardest parts require adds control; and don't ever try it w/o a mage if you're learning it.
I dont like posts like this tbh.
Could you perhaps explain the part about not trying without a mage?

Daimon
08-07-2011, 01:28 PM
If you try the fight you'd realize why, a mage makes trivial the activation of the magma trap, even a full health player would die by the fall dmg and levitate won't work preactivation, and sending up a healer priest would make healing a bit harder, and the traps come too often to use a different class, like locks with portals or hunters with deterrence, having 1 player dealing with that makes the learning easier. Another choice is a SP.

Aeshmae
08-07-2011, 04:09 PM
If you try the fight you'd realize why, a mage makes trivial the activation of the magma trap, even a full health player would die by the fall dmg and levitate won't work preactivation, and sending up a healer priest would make healing a bit harder, and the traps come too often to use a different class, like locks with portals or hunters with deterrence, having 1 player dealing with that makes the learning easier. Another choice is a SP.

Well we are working on the fight, and we have a lock doing it with no problems at all.
And as you said, a SP can also do it with no issues at all.

And if you have 3 healers in the fight you can easily send a holy/disc priest flying without it causing any healing issues at all.

Baba
08-07-2011, 07:43 PM
Where can melee stand in 10 man to not get parried but still be in range of healing?

Daimon
08-07-2011, 11:00 PM
Well if you manage with a lock is fine, but we tried and sometimes the traps come too fast to have the portal CD up, and as i said, if you're learning it you don't want to send a healer, a mage makes it much easier. But the real deal is with a moonkin or an ele sham, it makes the adds part a joke over any other setup. Paragon ideal 10m config is with 2 moonkins.

As for melee, they just stand in the middle, the dps lost is not that much and the room is a little big for 10m as to place them out of reach of healers in the opposite side of the tanks, 25m is another story.

hotshot100
08-11-2011, 04:19 PM
I dont understand why a moomkin is very usefull for the transition ?

Outbackjack
08-12-2011, 06:39 AM
I dont understand why a moomkin is very usefull for the transition ?

The Sons of Flame (the adds running towards the hammer) can be stunned, pushed back with Typhoon and Thunderstorm, as well as pulled with Death Grip. It isn't NEEDED, but its nice to have if you're having trouble bursting down the Sons. Just don't push them TOWARDS the hammer :cool:

kasanagi
08-15-2011, 05:21 PM
If you try the fight you'd realize why, a mage makes trivial the activation of the magma trap, even a full health player would die by the fall dmg and levitate won't work preactivation, and sending up a healer priest would make healing a bit harder, and the traps come too often to use a different class, like locks with portals or hunters with deterrence, having 1 player dealing with that makes the learning easier. Another choice is a SP.

I've detonated all the traps on my hunter using disengage during our guild's attempt last night. Only downside to this (I suspect this affect's mages as well) is the dependancy on your ping - at 250+ms I had trouble timing it consistently to 'jump out' during the blast off, so I had to disengage during the fall and take roughly 15 - 30k fall damage while losing serious dps time.

Bemxuu
08-16-2011, 03:48 PM
Surprisingly disappointing encounter for a tank. The biggest challenge Ragnaros provides on top of tanking 1 add and controlling 1-2 other ones is ... resisting sleep. Seriously. 1 minute of actually doing something is not enough for a ~10 minutes long fight. GG Blizz.

Ion
08-16-2011, 03:50 PM
Surprisingly disappointing encounter for a tank. The biggest challenge Ragnaros provides on top of tanking 1 add and controlling 1-2 other ones is ... resisting sleep. Seriously. 1 minute of actually doing something is not enough for a ~10 minutes long fight. GG Blizz.

Well at least you won't have to worry about threat now!

Wait...

Daimon
08-22-2011, 09:21 AM
Surprisingly disappointing encounter for a tank. The biggest challenge Ragnaros provides on top of tanking 1 add and controlling 1-2 other ones is ... resisting sleep. Seriously. 1 minute of actually doing something is not enough for a ~10 minutes long fight. GG Blizz.
Very true, Baleroc, the bird, even Ryolith are much better fights for tanks. But remade is remade, don't expect much from it. Does the tank in phase 2 gets an egg? I was trying to move outside the melee bunch when not tanking to realize the egg was not spamming in my spot, that or the spell triggers at some early point and it locks the spot were you where seconds before, does anybody noticed this?

Outbackjack
08-22-2011, 09:29 AM
The Molten Seed (I assume thats what you mean when you're saying "egg") does seem to have a travel time to it. I've noticed that it picks the spot you were standing in when it was "cast" from the lava to your current spot. Kinda disconcerting when you're trying to get away from the healer that suddenly moved forward at the last second for some odd reason..

klausi
08-22-2011, 09:36 AM
Baleroc? Not moving at all, hitting your TB trinket once in a while and hoping for some dodges on the Decimating Blade is not really more fun for me. I could play Alysrazor with a G15 macro from start to finish without the firestorm/meteor intermezzo every other minute.. I've a lot of fun on Shannox while kiting Riplimp but that's it for this tier.

Ragnaros has some tankswaps every 20ish seconds and thanks to vengeance and lucky hits/crits i'll have to watch Omen (at least if you care for damage done). On heroic you can dance the Heigan Dance while not dying to his hammer and optimise your offensive and defensive cooldowns for the 3-4 seed phases. Actually it's one of the fights where i've to watch out for the most things at any time. It's a quite demanding fight with not a lot of margin for errors (from anyone), 15 minutes+ of full concentration and awareness .. we're at a few hundred tries on heroic it's still entertaining :)

edit: Seeds hit your intitial position about 1.5-2 seconds after their spawn, thus it's a common tactic to clump up on heroic and move as one. On normalmode i'd advise trying this: stay spread out and soak the damage from the initial hit before moving, this way you don't risk getting oneshotted from multiple seeds or running into another ones egg.

Shambells
08-26-2011, 07:13 PM
So we got to Rag a couple nights ago; our biggest problem is clearly the transition phase. Any tips for those adds on 10 man? We never even came close to getting them down in time. Maybe like got three of them down before the other five explode. Maybe. Eight adds for five dps is fucking brutal. I have absolutely no idea how you do this without knockbacks; we don't have any. Ideas?Edit : our dps is around 21k avg, all five of us. Just keep farming th first six til we get up to 30k? Edit : die in fire blizz. 15 attempts later, got four adds down. Impossible.

frostystare
08-26-2011, 09:15 PM
We have our tanks split up and get the last one on each side. We have a hunter put up a trap. We also have our heals stick close to the hammer and use any stuns (i.e switching to bear form, hammer, etc) if needed. The closest add on each side is handled by a warrior who can stun to help out.

Maven
08-28-2011, 04:51 PM
So we got to Rag a couple nights ago; our biggest problem is clearly the transition phase. Any tips for those adds on 10 man? We never even came close to getting them down in time. Maybe like got three of them down before the other five explode. Maybe. Eight adds for five dps is fucking brutal. I have absolutely no idea how you do this without knockbacks; we don't have any. Ideas?Edit : our dps is around 21k avg, all five of us. Just keep farming th first six til we get up to 30k? Edit : die in fire blizz. 15 attempts later, got four adds down. Impossible.

I think there is something flawed with your methodology. We have had pug nights where we were down to 18k average and we smoothly went through those phases.

Tanks on the ones furthest (obviously on the "tank side"). Closest ones the melee get, but in general each person just takes one and downs it. There is no excuse for healers to not be helping, same with tanks. It is pretty darn obvious, but the key to the phase is front-loading damage. No one should ever open up with anything but an instant. While nuking is key, also remember to get early damage on all of them. Even if your healers only give 2 or 3 global cooldowns (which they should easily be able to spare) thats a big difference. The goal is to apply damage to each son as FAST as possible - keep that in sight. Also, remember that their speed gets cut a lot for each 8250 damage done, thus why you are trying to spread damage early.

If that isn't working, try bringing more melee to your raids? I don't know the rogue/warrior classes that well, but DKs, enh Shamans and feral druids have it easy on this fight.

Daimon
08-28-2011, 10:53 PM
The Molten Seed (I assume thats what you mean when you're saying "egg") does seem to have a travel time to it. I've noticed that it picks the spot you were standing in when it was "cast" from the lava to your current spot. Kinda disconcerting when you're trying to get away from the healer that suddenly moved forward at the last second for some odd reason..
I know this, still sometimes I don't get any seed, at all, I'm not sure if was the exact time I'm tanking but I look around and there is only the ones from the only 2 ppl by my zone, that's it. The worst part of the fight is actually the 2nd phase, when you get Engulfing Flame, Hammer, and Seeds overlapping 2 at a time sometimes.

Shambells
08-29-2011, 12:10 PM
I think there is something flawed with your methodology. We have had pug nights where we were down to 18k average and we smoothly went through those phases.Tanks on the ones furthest (obviously on the "tank side"). Closest ones the melee get, but in general each person just takes one and downs it. There is no excuse for healers to not be helping, same with tanks. It is pretty darn obvious, but the key to the phase is front-loading damage. No one should ever open up with anything but an instant. While nuking is key, also remember to get early damage on all of them. Even if your healers only give 2 or 3 global cooldowns (which they should easily be able to spare) thats a big difference. The goal is to apply damage to each son as FAST as possible - keep that in sight. Also, remember that their speed gets cut a lot for each 8250 damage done, thus why you are trying to spread damage early. If that isn't working, try bringing more melee to your raids? I don't know the rogue/warrior classes that well, but DKs, enh Shamans and feral druids have it easy on this fight. So a strat like this then?Frequently we run into this:Hammer on melee side, 2 adds on left 6 on right of hammer. So I'd respond with rogue on far left, then hance sham on first left. Dk tank DG first right. Ret pally on 2nd right. Bear healer bash + hunter on 3rd right. Holy pally HoJ + fire Mage on 4th right. Prot war and same dk tank do 5 & 6 right and first right. But somehow the coordination always gets screwed and one gets away. It's incredibly irritating. And we haven't made it to 2nd transition yet where I lose a tank. And I have a holy priest that idk what to do with. Holy fire and smite?Any help for this dumb RL would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Gregorian
08-29-2011, 03:26 PM
We have just recently gotten to Rag putting in about 6 hours on him over two nights and we wasted prolly two hours of that on that add phase until we discovered that if you take the time to set up everyone with a certain add, you will find that it isnt bad at all. We defined the add phase as a 4-4, 2,6, 6-2 split numbered the add spawn points as 1 thru 8 and assigned everyone to thier own add. Our raid make-up consists of me a prot warrior, prot paladin, enh shaman, Dk, ret pally, mage, hunter. holy pally, rest sham, resto druid. We use our three melee closest to the hammer with me being in the fourth closest spot, after that if your healers can do any damage at all really they will slow thier add and the melee will destroy it as it gets to them. We havent downed him yet but we are at the last phase hopefully this week we will. I think the biggest hump in this fight is not tunneling and missing something and everyone getting used to the pattern with which everything happens.

Shambells
08-30-2011, 12:22 PM
So assigning spots worked out really well thanks. The adds went down with no problem once we did that, though our holy priest now hates me for making her smite. She went disc off spec for that fight so it doesn't suck as much for her. The 2nd phase we are working on now seems like LK p2 with stack and spread and conflicting requirements so that it's just a nightmare for the RL. Just wanted to say thanks for the tips.

Tengenstein
09-12-2011, 02:26 PM
How are people handling the living meteors in 10 man? we're lusting, nuking the scions and then kiting them, we get rag down to 24% by the time we get our 4th meteor and then slowely wipe.

klausi
09-12-2011, 02:52 PM
Kill 6-7 sons and the other 1-2 low, kill at least one scion without lust before the last phase even begun. Kill the last son(s) before here emerges and then then LUST!, clump together next to him and pop your potions. He'll hammer once (can't hit any of you if positioned properly) and only 30s later he'll set the world in flames. With the second hammer he'll spawn a meteor, now you should take your positions for the rest of the fight on both ends of the plateau.

Assuming you three heal it when you're talking about 4 meteors? Split into two groups: both tanks, a ranged and two healers on one side while melees, the remaining healer and the rest of your dps on the other (= no parry for your melees).

Assign ONE player per side who's responsible for kicking the meteors, this job can be done by healers especially that on on the side with no tanks (other then that he should deal pseudo dps to the boss, only incoming damage is from world in flames or failures like Lava wave). You can only kick the meteors when they glow (~ 5-6 seconds after the last kick), they also get a buff called "Combustion (http://www.wowhead.com/spell=100250)" you can track. Only one player per side is important so the rest of your raid can work even harder on the boss, with everyone wasting globals on the (inactive) meteors you're going to lose a ton of dps.

It's important to split up both groups evenly so it's more likely that the meteor change the side after a knockback. If you get unlucky and the meteor is heading 3-4 times to the same direction the fixated player (every bossmod should warn you about that) will have to kite the meteor away from the camp so you don't get overwhelmed.

With lust worn off and your two groups settled the last scion should be dead from multidotting/cleaving and Ragnaros about 30ish percent when the first meteor spawns. Don't panic, watch your timers for world in flames and hammers and get in proper positions to avoid both. Some boss-percent later the second meteor will spawn. Check timer and your feet for the glowing circle before the impact. Your kicker will have to work harder now, if things gets messy he should call out for an assigned backup and Ragnaros should be somewhere around 20ish percent by then. Handling the meteors while avoiding WiF and Lavawaves is now most important, when the third meteor spawn get ready to kite them while the other 7 players slowly wrestle the Firelord down.

Tengenstein
09-12-2011, 03:52 PM
Thank you.

Kangoshi
09-23-2011, 09:46 AM
I haven't seen this addressed, but would it be possible or even worth it for a pally to use their bubble and explode a meteor to get it out of the way?

Takethecake
09-23-2011, 11:33 AM
they don't go away after they explode... they just kill everyone in 8 yards then pick a new target.

Kangoshi
09-23-2011, 11:44 AM
Ah, ok.. thanks

Pacans
09-29-2011, 12:33 PM
Quick ones
1) Hungering cold
2) Fear
3) Root
4) Ring Of Frost
Do they work on adds?

Outbackjack
09-29-2011, 01:30 PM
Unless something drastic changed with the nerfs you can not immobilize the adds (the exception to this is Stun effects like Shockwave or Shadowfury), only slow them.

Takethecake
09-29-2011, 01:49 PM
Aye the only thing that works is a stun... if your not sure if an ability will work on them, the answer is more than likely no.

SpyTurtle
10-11-2011, 03:17 PM
We have been running normal 10 man for a while now and we do fine with P1 and 2 and the first transition, the problem is in the second transition we seam to be severely lacking in DPS. We have had a tank pick up the big ads, (can't remember what they're called) but there just isn't enough dps to stop all the little adds. When we ignore the big they invariably go for healers and wipe the group. did anyone else find this problem and how did you get around it? thanks in advance guys :)

Quinafoi
10-12-2011, 01:17 PM
Is it your DPS simply can't keep up because tanks and healers may not be helping like they did in the first transition? You can't ignore the Scions but you don't particularly need to do much with them other than pick them up. Since the Scion tanks themselves can't be targeted by the fire debuff they are still free to DPS/Stun the Sons while tanking the Scions. In fact, the tanks should definately still be helping with the Sons in this transition, they just have the additional responsibility of picking up an add that is tanked and maintaining sufficient threat on that add. The killing priority is still on the Sons. Both Scions should end up on one tank so that the other is free to pick up Ragnaros when the transition is over. Ideally you would like to have one of the sons slowed significantly (below 50% and left alive) so you can widdle down or even kill one of the Scions before entering phase three however it isn't absolutely critical. Once phase three starts you clean up the Scions so that tank is freed up to taunt the boss before the active tank has too many stacks of the debuff.

You don't ignore the Scions... you tank them.
You don't ignore the Sons... you kill/stun/knockback/deathgrip them.

Having threat on one mob while killing another shouldn't be an issue for a tank at this point. If you're tanks can't handle holding threat on one mob while helping with others I think that would be a larger concern.

While more of the burden in the second transition is shifted to the DPS because the tanks have additional responsibilities and the healers have more damage to heal, this does not mean that healers and tanks can't help at all.

uglie
10-12-2011, 07:55 PM
Is it your DPS simply can't keep up because tanks and healers may not be helping like they did in the first transition? You can't ignore the Scions but you don't particularly need to do much with them other than pick them up. Since the Scion tanks themselves can't be targeted by the fire debuff they are still free to DPS/Stun the Sons while tanking the Scions. In fact, the tanks should definately still be helping with the Sons in this transition, they just have the additional responsibility of picking up an add that is tanked and maintaining sufficient threat on that add. The killing priority is still on the Sons. Both Scions should end up on one tank so that the other is free to pick up Ragnaros when the transition is over. Ideally you would like to have one of the sons slowed significantly (below 50% and left alive) so you can widdle down or even kill one of the Scions before entering phase three however it isn't absolutely critical. Once phase three starts you clean up the Scions so that tank is freed up to taunt the boss before the active tank has too many stacks of the debuff.

You don't ignore the Scions... you tank them.
You don't ignore the Sons... you kill/stun/knockback/deathgrip them.

Having threat on one mob while killing another shouldn't be an issue for a tank at this point. If you're tanks can't handle holding threat on one mob while helping with others I think that would be a larger concern.

While more of the burden in the second transition is shifted to the DPS because the tanks have additional responsibilities and the healers have more damage to heal, this does not mean that healers and tanks can't help at all.

I would also add that each tank should kill the son that comes out near the scion. So a tank on each side, the scion will come out in time for each tank to get a hit or 2 in on the scion before the son comes out, dps the scion down like normal than both tanks go to the middle, 1 tank picks up the other tank and the tank without a scion picks up rag. Dps should have their adds down at this time and be able to help with the scions. We lust during this time to get the scions down faster and the tank tanking both scions in the middle should quickly skull one to kill first. If you are 3 healing this fight consider 2 healing but just be warned that ppl will have to be on the ball about avoiding as much dmg as possible.

klausi
10-14-2011, 07:49 AM
- tanks should kill at least one add on their own (pop offensive cooldowns like wings/berserk + rep trinket) while "tanking" the scion (one attack from ranged for snap aggro and an occassional cleave is regulary enough) and assist with stun(s)/deathgrip on more (it can be more important to grab the opportunity to stun 3-4 adds if clumbed up instead of nuking one)
- if you run with 3 healer have one of them nuke a son (priest with spike, spike, spike, mindblast oder shaman with flameshock/lavaburst)
- position your dps wisely, maybe the most important point. Any physiscal dps should be capable of instagib a son in the first seconds and kill a second one afterwards while some caster may struggle (eg an arcane mage w/o his stacks). So if you got two or more physiscal dps spread them out, as well as your stuns/knockbacks/deathgribs. Have 1-2 assigned players per side and 2 jumper if it's uneven
- use your full arsenal of abilites (all paladin can hammer of justice/holy wrath - glyph for it on this fight!, all druids can use bash, all warrior can stun in some way etc)
- communicate, 10 people without voice and a perfect disposition/plan pre pull will have a hard time

Chizune
10-24-2011, 06:20 AM
Heroic Version please :cool:

Evesath
11-02-2011, 01:35 AM
We've been killing Raggy for a while now, but the strategy guide for phase 3 presented here, and i couple other guides wasnt really good for us, in out 10-man setup.

What we've came up with, is not to spread on both, left and right side of the room, but just one one side. Every one on one side. Starting on right (as we keep tanks there), we were spread out (not to much, as its not THAT important as in ph1) and running asap to the other side of the zone (raggy's right hand), stacking up upon the boss (right at the edge of lava pool) and AoE nuking adds. That way, we are way far away from molten seeds that you do when you just stack up in the middle. Also its easy to avoid hammer smash (you wont get hit when you hug the boss). Only prolblem is when there's engulfing flame placed there, but you cant do anything about it, same as the other strategy.
You can take a peek here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgyRhuikoyw

Icebreaker
11-02-2011, 02:00 AM
@Evesath - phase 2, not phase 3. But the strategy is quite good and healers like it.

Fetzie
11-02-2011, 02:06 AM
@Evesath - phase 2, not phase 3. But the strategy is quite good and healers like it.

Some people call the transitions "phases" too, resulting in Phase 2 becoming Phase 3, and Phase 3 becoming Phase 4.

Hinenuitepo
11-02-2011, 09:01 AM
Heroic Version please :cool:
This.

Evesath
11-02-2011, 03:31 PM
Some people call the transitions "phases" too, resulting in Phase 2 becoming Phase 3, and Phase 3 becoming Phase 4.
Exactly. We count it as a 5 phases encounter, so for us that's 3rd phase, for others usually 2nd.

ino145
12-03-2011, 12:59 AM
I love you Aliena, always a pleasure listening! <3