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05-11-2011, 07:19 AM
On today's LEGENDARY:


WoW is DYING!!!11?
4.2 PTR Patch Notes
2011 Arena Tournament
And more!


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Legendary on Gamebreaker.tv (http://www.gamebreaker.tv/category/legendary/?utm_source=Tankspot&utm_medium=News_Site&utm_term=GBTV&utm_content=Episode22&utm_campaign=Legendary) | Follow Gamebreaker on Twitter (http://twitter.com/gamebreakertv)

Rowdy
05-11-2011, 09:27 AM
1-2 months into WotLK there was a drop-off from a game that grew and grew constantly up until that point and it was booming in asia. A drop-off from arguably the peek is not really that noteworthy imo.

Now we have a drop-off from the numbers at the end of one year without new content after ICC - I doubt they were as high as they were at the end of TBC (compare Quel'danas/SWP/30%-everyone-gets-to-see-everything phase to the ICC-for-12plus-months ending of WotLK). So it is, in my opinion, a drop-off from a much lower starting point which makes it more relevant.

To the point of "4.2 comes faster than we expected": did anyone expect the next raid-tier to come out after 8 months? Or even later?

Rennadrel
05-11-2011, 12:59 PM
Well Blizzard brought it on themselves. Poor raid content design making the current tier impossible to be enjoyed by certain players, making the content seem gated until they nerfed it which they did to a lot of bosses and now guilds that were struggling at 5/13 on hard modes are 10/13 which is really quite a joke. Some of the best players have quit, I quit as well and there are a lot of reasons for it. The game has become a grind and when you do it for 4 years, sometimes you feel like you need to do something else or don't have the same enthusiasm for the game anymore, which is how I personally feel. That plus Blizzard's constant game breaking design, class nerfs and putting people at the bottom of the meters for their roles as healers and DPS makes players feel annoyed that they can't compete. I got fed up with how poorly they have treated my characters and the horrible design that is PvP play and the fact that there is no counter to certain classes or specs, makes the game really frustrating and hard to enjoy.

When the Diablo 3 beta starts, I will be quite happy though :)

Kahmal
05-11-2011, 01:09 PM
I wasn't a core raider in TBC and I became casual in Cata as well. I got bored of Cata way quicker for multiple reasons. Leveling to 70 was an actual adventure for one thing as opposed to it taking only 2 days. Then 5 man content and Heroics being as difficult and unforgiving as they were could actually hold you over for a very long time in my opinion, on top of that gearing up took much longer also, Heroics aside craftable gear could actually take sometime to farm up, unlike just abusing the auction house as we started doing in WoTLK.

Then there was Karazhan, where the first 4 bosses were fairly puggable, Moroes might screw you if anything. Eventually it was nerfed to the point that it was easily puggable to a full clear. Meanwhile i still had Gruul, Mag, SSC and TK to look forward to (something I actually did need a guild to do.)
There was the opening content in WoTLK also, sure most of it was a joke, but at least most of it was easily puggable, so people that couldn't maintain a raid schedule could still get access to the content and even gear up alts.

Cata shifted back to what I would say Karazhan difficulty in their opening content give or take. The difference is there just isn't enough to do when your not raiding, first of all the content isn't easily puggable yet. I was hoping Firelands would come out soon so the Tier 11 content would become more pug friendly.
But along with that there is almost no reason to leave your capital city, the tabard system makes grinding rep easy, you dont do dailies for gold like in TBC.

I'll admit TBC had tedious elements to it but that made it the MMO that WoW was and kept people occupied, I never maxed out an alt or even PvP'd back then.

Gilitemara
05-11-2011, 08:30 PM
OK, I have asked it before and I will ask it again. How long until we see a lvl 25 Guild up for sale on E-Bay, and how much do you think it will go for?

swills
05-12-2011, 08:10 PM
For me the main issue with Cataclysm is that there isn't anything *new*. And by that I mean:

In TBC we had Heroic 5-mans! 10 / 25 man raiding! And Arena! And Flying Mounts! Jewelcrafting & sockets! All great upgrades to the game.

WotLK brought Heroic raiding! An entire new class! Inscription & glyphs! The whole Achievement system which (like it or loathe it) increased the lifetime of 5-man and raiding content by adding extra challenges that never existed before. It gave people things to do.

With Cata we got:
- Rated BGs. Nice, but they are just the same old BGs we've been doing for years.
- Rejuvenated old world. Nice, but most semi-serious players have levelled one or more alts already. New quests are nice and all, but it's still just levelling another alt.
- Guild levelling. Yay, more levelling... I mean the perks are cool and stuff, but it's not 'content'. It's not something to do, it's just something that happens.
- Archaeology. Massive grind for no real benefit really. I am sure this is fun for some, but it is not 'content'. Digging up your 500th artifact is no different to digging up the first one.

Cata is good. Everything is extremely polished. The raiding is great, the levelling is more fun, the 5-mans are (were) challenging, but ultimately it is just *more of the same*. No new class, no new gameplay, no new crafting profession, no real 'hook'. There is nothing new for max level players *to do* like there was in the other expansions.

Meshuggah
05-13-2011, 10:17 AM
Do accounts that are being banned get lumped into this category? I know of lots of accounts being banned for the selling of gold, and using the Pirox Arch Bot.

Griff
05-13-2011, 12:38 PM
@swills

You're forgetting the fact that they added two entire new races, with some of the best starting areas in the game to date.

I do think that it would have been nice to see more five mans though.

joshYA
05-13-2011, 05:51 PM
Hey guys love the show,

Anyway I play in a korean server because my wife is korean and prefers to play there. In response to your culture topic on this video, I belive the reason they raid that way is because of a few reasons. Alot of koreans and even myself have 2 - 3 characters that we try to keep best in slot items. The reason they love to play more characters is there love of raiding and the ability to be able to play more than one class to prevent boredom. Instead of joining guilds for raiding they choose to join or start PUGS so that they can raid whenever they want throughout the week and not be restricted to a certain time. How ever alot of korean create regular raid teams which are basically random people that always turn up to a raid without being all in the same guild. Another main reason is gold. In PUGS you dont purchase items with raid points you purchase the items with gold. So lets say you are best in slot items for your 3 characters and do all the raids with some heroic boss's each week. On my server people make around 80 000 gold a week just from going to the raids and taking there share of the gold. Like lore mentioned most korean people know all the fights when joining a PUG, and when joining a pug the raid leader will always have the requirement of knowing the story for each fight. Its something ive come to love myself raiding this style. However my main character is in a guilded raid group so that i also have faster progression through heroics, as the PUGS are a little bit behind.

Rawer
05-15-2011, 03:41 AM
Why did you guys choose that title ?

Ofcourse WoW is not dying ... yet ... but it's in decline. Those numbers just confirm it's so.
The people that still play the game don't need Blizzard official numbers to see that ... the empty cities, bgs queue times, guild rooster where you see friends ain't logged in months, vent chat boredom and GMs headaches trying to keep people motivated, problems in recruiting or puging raids etc all tell WoW is missing something atm.

Why wasn't the news something like : "World of Warcraft has reached 13 millions subscribers up by 8% since last expansion" ? Cataclysm was a great success.

One more thing I was thinking about: what if the re-hash of 1-60 actually worked and they got like 400k new players, could that be that they lost 1 million of old ones ?

Krenian
05-15-2011, 05:54 AM
Why did you guys choose that title ?

...Probably because they're making fun of the fact that, as the show talked about, the subscriptions of the game went down 600k to 11.5 million and people are starting to speculate that it's the 'end of WoW'. The title is a 'not-so-subtle' way of laughing at the people who say this as the game is far form dying.

Fetzie
05-15-2011, 08:10 AM
Any time a new game comes out that is over-hyped beyond belief (Warhammer, LotrO, Aion, RIFT et al) the end of WoW is declared. Every time blizzard loses not even 5% of their total player base, the end of WoW is declared. Every time a class is nerfed, or an expansion is announced, the end of WoW is declared. The only people that can kill WoW are the executives at Blizzard Entertainment, and that is a long time off.

Even with 600k less active subs, world of warcraft is still going strong. Now if the number was 6 000 000 less subscriptions, then yeah, it might be dying off, but 600 000 is hardly a dent. i'd bet that their subscriptions fluctuate by that amount over an annual period - don't read too much into that number.