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View Full Version : Warrior Themios the Darkbringer > Crossfire Carbine?



Takethecake
04-28-2011, 05:41 PM
Recently I went to comparing the tanking ranged choices because of the new bow being available in 4.1. I threw in the normal and heroic version of Themios the Darkbringer for giggles because I knew I would be switching to the heroic version once our hunters all got them. But after comparing them numbers on the normal version I'm curious why more people aren't using it over Crossfire Carbine.

If both are reforged for parry... the two weapons come down to a comparison of:

44 expertise and 107 (112 w/mark) strength vs. 44 crit and 107 (112 w/mark) agility.

The expertise vs crit comparison is purely threat and doesn't affect survival... but just to give some numbers, it equates to ~1.47 expertise vs .7% crit (when you factor in agility w/mark)

But the agility vs str comparison equates to 28 parry rating vs 46 dodge rating. I know parry is better than dodge to a large degree, and while 18 avoidance rating isn't significant you could always look at it this way... If we were given the choice of enchant bracer exceptional parry +50 parry, or enchant bracer exceptional dodge +68... which would you take?

For those that want a comparison to heroic bow vs the crossfire, it comes down to 24 parry vs 52 dodge. The bow gains 4 parry from higher crit rating reforged to parry, and 6 dodge rating equivalent from agility.

Kazeyonoma
04-28-2011, 10:39 PM
it's less about the avoidance ratings you gain, but the fact that the expertise/str are just better as stats for a warrior in terms of threat than agi/crit are and are therefore more universally accepted as a ranged weapon (since no other str based class uses ranged weapons). the dodge/parry rating difference is pretty trivial actually.

Takethecake
04-29-2011, 12:24 PM
That's fare enough... but at what point does pure threat gain outweigh a small avoidance boost? With vengeance mechanics the way they currently are, threat is widely spouted as a non issue once you get hit 2-3 times by the boss.

Bigbad
04-29-2011, 01:15 PM
I'm aiming for the hc bow to replace my crossfire carbin just waiting till the hunters have it. For the normal mode version i would take the carbin but its a decent option.

Booi
04-29-2011, 02:05 PM
That's fare enough... but at what point does pure threat gain outweigh a small avoidance boost? With vengeance mechanics the way they currently are, threat is widely spouted as a non issue once you get hit 2-3 times by the boss.

Look at the encounter. If you find your deaths are the reason for wipes, then try the bow/cloak etc. If it's a fight where you need to pick up adds or tank lives are not threatened, then push out some more damage. Neither item is going to make or break a fight, but your mentality when approaching an encounter might.

Loganisis
04-29-2011, 02:46 PM
It's probably a toss-up in normal modes. In hardcore where the quicker you can let DPS go all out, the extra ~1.47 exp (~.36% chance to not be parried and ~.36% chance to not be dodged) would win out over the .7% chance to crit for the sole reason it make makes it more likely your hits land in those first few seconds.

But given the compartively low itemization budget of the range slot, meh?

Kemanorel
04-30-2011, 06:50 AM
http://www.wowhead.com/compare?items=60210.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.37.14;65058.0.0. 0.0.0.0.0.32.14 is using wowhead's item compare of 359 crossfire carbine v 372 themios. This is of course for those who, like myself, are too lazy to open a new tab and/or do math. The 359/359 comparison is as mentioned so marginal as to not worth noting. Yet to be mentioned of course, is a slight gain of 9 mastery/20 stamina since as a boe trash drop, I don't believe the carbine exists in 372 form at present? I've yet to see a non-datamined one in any case.

Loganisis
04-30-2011, 01:31 PM
http://www.wowhead.com/profiles?filter=cr=21;crs=0;crv=65098

Seems to support it. Doesn't look like anyone has it equipped. Unless Wowhead's profiler search isn't working?

Dragaan
05-03-2011, 03:58 PM
I use it, and so do many other tanks in top guilds. Of course I don't use it all the time, only on fights that can still kick my butt (sinestra, cho'gall). I also used the cape off heroic maloriak (same with many other tanks) in those same situations. Got me a 372 cape off Al'Akir last week tho, so I don't need to wear the agi cape anymore. : )