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Hintonita
04-26-2011, 12:07 AM
Hi all,

I'm a first time Bear tanker though I have experience on Paladin and Warrior. I was wondering if I could get some 85 pre raid advice please?

1. From the research I've done it seems that Agility is king and haste is the reforge pauper but I was wondering (if you're at hit cap through agility on gear) if Stamina stacking on gems and enchants is still viable in cata? Is it better to know you can take a hit rather than have a chance to dodge etc

2. I'm intending (I say intending as I'll be starting my dungeon runs in guild at 85, up to now I've been a questaholic) to pull with faerie fire or feral charge followed by laceratex3, get pulverise/demoralizing shout up and then thrash/swipe/mangle as my fillers. Sound like a good plan?

3. Is there a BiS list available? I don't mind buying the craftables but I'm a little hesitant to go for just anything with agility/stamina in case I blow my load on something much better suited to rogues. I have an Assasins Chestplate in the bank and was looking to get Tsangas Helm and Unheeded warning next with legs and feet from valor points. Again, sound like a good plan?

4. The Ramakhan exalted head enchant looks only 50% useful due to the haste, is there anything 'better'?

Thanks in advance, I won't go on as I'm sure I could write a tonne and this stuff must be available elsewhere on the web :)

EDIT: I'm really surprised by lack of info I can find on the web so what are the magic numbers I should aim for? i.e. Hit at 8% or not necessary?Is this attained through gear or gems? Same thing for dodge etc. I don't mind trying things out-it helps me understand the role better and play more confidently-but if I can get some idea of an achievable goal that'd be awesome.

Thanks again :)

Dobraine
04-27-2011, 12:01 AM
hit and expertise prior to 4.1 was uneeded unless you were an dedicated interrupter, now with our skull bash not missing with 4.1 hit and expertise are something you dont want, unless you are aggro starved but you shouldn't be ever

always go for stuff with mastery + a second stat you can reforge to dodge. generally you want crit as it helps us with Savage defense.

http://dkkitty.blogspot.com/2010/12/gearing-your-pre-raid-beear-pt-2-items.html for you pre raid bis

will include a raid bis

http://dkkitty.blogspot.com/2010/12/gearing-your-pre-raid-bear-pt-3-post.html

That assasians chestplate is crap for a feral tank get the heroic chest from deadmines alot better then that, just sell it off and get the Tsanga's Helm considered bis till you get to herioc raids

generally you gems you want to go

red: 40 agil
yellow: 20 agil 20 dodge
blue: 20 agil 30 stam

best bet is to go to inc bear at http://theincbear.com/feral-tanking-guide/

shows gems enchants specs etc etc and rotation, also not sure if reesi has updated the specs yet with 4.1 as it great now to puck up 3/3 kotj

also teh head enchant you want from the earthen ring as its 90 stam and 35 dodge


also your hit as i said no magic numbers

your dodge the sky is the limit as you wont hit the dodge cap with the current gear available

generally 30% is good for a raid tho.....easy to get and don't worry about your health we aren't stam stacker :)

Hintonita
04-27-2011, 12:17 AM
cheers buddy, thats perfect.

I found the incbear site this morning :)

I heard the Assasins Chestplate was decent enough but I guess if we no longer need hit thats a bit of a pain. I may just reforge the hit to dodge as the chest only cost me 3k, will give me a little boost.

Glad you mentioned Tsungas Helm too, I thought that looked ace but hadn't seen guides mention it :(

Thanks again for the reply :D

Dobraine
04-27-2011, 12:39 AM
np I noticed the lack of information around the web but i hang out in the druid forums way to much....about as much as i was in the warrior forums back when I was tanking in wotlk

Hintonita
04-27-2011, 12:47 AM
just a quick one....I'm puzzled as to why hit isn't a priority?Surely we need it to 'hit' things tanking? no hit=no damage=no threat surely?

Or is it a case of you don't need to actively seek it out as you'll get hit capped through the gear naturally?

Dobraine
04-27-2011, 01:17 AM
you wont get hit capped through gear but hit only affect your threat output, you will miss less, but generally you would have to lose mastery/dodge to get said hit on the gear, you are attacking alot + vengence out threat output is heaps even with missing about 20% of the time (for me against a raid boss) we still will pull ahead on threat, yes hit will help (and expertise for that matter generally expertise is better then hit cause of parry/dodge chance) especially with getting several misses etc on the intial pull, but once you get into raiding i find it doesnt matter as everyone generally doesn't have a hair trigger

Hintonita
04-27-2011, 01:28 AM
cool, thanks for your time *gives cookie* :D

Dobraine
04-27-2011, 01:48 AM
don't no if I explained it right tho

Hintonita
04-27-2011, 02:02 AM
well its a learning curve buddy, I'll be a better tank if I see these things in action rather than just 'copy' other people and the advice you've given will put me on the right path at least. Whats the worst that can happen? :D

Tengenstein
04-28-2011, 05:05 AM
Essentially the difference between being Hit and expertise capped is about 27% of your attacks will fail to connect. Venegence is going to Increase your AP by about 300%. On average it doesn't matter if a quarter of your attacks don't connect if the ones that do hit twice as hard.

Hintonita
04-28-2011, 05:46 AM
Thank you, I'm off to do my first guild Cata dungeons tonight so hopefully I'll hold the aggro well enough!

Insahnity
04-28-2011, 03:33 PM
1. From the research I've done it seems that Agility is king and haste is the reforge pauper but I was wondering (if you're at hit cap through agility on gear)

Just to clarify, agi does not give hit. Not that hit is important anyways.


if Stamina stacking on gems and enchants is still viable in cata? Is it better to know you can take a hit rather than have a chance to dodge etc

Stamina affects 2 things: How big of a hit you can take (which you already knew), and the amount of health you get back from LotP. Therefore stacking stam affects your self healing.



4. The Ramakhan exalted head enchant looks only 50% useful due to the haste, is there anything 'better'?


You should be using arcanum of earthen ring (90 stam/35 dodge). No downside whatsover.

What is more difficult to decide is shoulder enchant. The standard tank stam/dodge is nice, but the DPS agi/mastery is also really good, since agi and mastery are both tanks stats for bears. I personally recommend agi/mastery, but a hardmode tank would probably go for the stam/dodge in certain fights.

Hintonita
04-29-2011, 02:34 AM
blimey, lots of very helpful advice! I'm gearing nicely but still haven't done any dungeons :/

Too put off by nerdrage to noob tank in LFD and guild is only small. I have a feeling I'm going to need to dive in at the deep end!

Thanks all :D