View Full Version : Tanking Dodge/Parry/Mastery Caps

04-05-2011, 09:29 PM
So I started out Cata raiding with the mindset and knowledge that Mastery was your Sex Stat and I saw that it was nerfed a bit. That being said, I'm now confused about the amount of Mastery vs Parry/Dodge rating. I know that parry/mastery are avoidance stats and that mastery just reduces damage taken, with my current build I'm around 52% Block Chance which going over the number seems about as high as I should worry about it being so that half the hits coming in are being reduced by 30%. If those stats look good then I'm a little worried heading into heroic modes if my parry/dodge are high enough or if I need to increase either. Anyone with suggestions or opinions feel free to lend a hand.

04-06-2011, 01:34 AM
mastery is king.

every piece should have mastery dodge or mastery parry. anythign else reforge one stat to mastery.

gems: yellow: mastery
blue: mastery stamina
red: mastery parry

in heroic modes stamina becomes more important as bosses can hit ridiculously.

also : valiona and theralion helm > tier 11

04-06-2011, 02:15 AM
Sure, it's nice to parry or dodge something. But your parry and dodge will be comparable low even if you try to push them. So you will not dodge/parry most of the time. You will not see multiple dodge/parrys in a row, often. You and your healers will not be able to rely on dodge and parry. Yes, it's good, but you just cannot get "enough" for it to set everything on this card.

Mastery on the other hand is able to cover a big part of the hit-table with blocks. So if you go for mastery, you can more or less rely on getting the reduced dmg, if you have a high amount of block. The important part is, that it helps your healers to switch to less expensive heals often enough. Sure they have to heal with more expensive heals when the big hits land, but all the time you block they can answer that with sneaking less expensive stuff into the rotation (or just not using the expensive heal).

If you fear the dangerous high dmg hits of heroic modes dmg reduction is much more worth than dmg avoidance, again. Block gives you a high chance to get the dmg reduction, parry/dodge give you low chances to avoid stuff.

04-06-2011, 02:30 AM
Im just trying to understand why you're reducing your avoidance to increase the hit. Please tell me!

04-06-2011, 02:47 AM

Say you have 10% dodge and parry chance. You also have a 5% miss chance. So you have a 25% chance for the boss to not hit you and a 75% chance for him to hit you for, let us say, 100k. If you can block, you have a chance to reduce the damage the boss does by a flat 30% (talents/abilities can change this value, but we don't need to take this into consideration right now). Say you have 30% block chance.

Now you have a 25% chance to take zero damage and a 30% chance to take 70000 damage. A 45% chance remains that the boss will hit you for 100000.

Dodge and Parry chance are granted by ratings, whose efficacy is reduced when you increase the chance to dodge or parry. Block is granted by mastery rating which does not have a diminishing return. So we can reduce our avoidance by a few percent to increase the chance to block by a much higher amount. Say we convert some dodge and parry rating to mastery rating, enough to reduce our total avoidance by 3%. This frees up mastery to increase the block chance by 10%.

Now we have a 22% chance to take zero damage, a 40% chance to take 70000 damage and a 38% chance to take 100000 damage. This smooths out the incoming damage and makes it easier to heal the tank. It is easier to heal a tank that is taking a higher amount of damage that is consistent than a tank that is sometimes taking zero damage and sometimes taking extremely heavy damage.

04-06-2011, 03:46 AM
that half the hits coming in are being reduced by 30%. With holy shield this will be up to 40 % damage reduced. Assuming holy shield has a 100~99 % uptime on boss fights this will smooth out the damage taken over the entire fight.

04-06-2011, 08:02 AM
Since no Protection Paladin is unhittable yet, Mastery is still king. You won't see a shift in this priority much until you become unhittable. Mastery will continue to be your highest priority stat until you reach the unhittable threshold and additional block is wasted. Beyond the unhittable mark your priorities will shift very heavily towards Dodge and Parry in regards to gear and reforging while only maintaining enough Mastery to remain unhittable. Your gemming priorities would also shift after the unhittable threshold, most likely heavily favoring effective health (Stamina).

Heroic modes break all rules regarding priorities when preparing for extremes. Effective health becomes more important because you have to be able to survive larger hits. In the same regard, healers healing heroics should be able to heal more.

If you are just starting the transition into heroics, don't go overboard immediately. Keep your standard priorities and adjust them as needed, don't go and regem everything for Stamina and think you're ready for heroics. Test the waters a bit and adjust as needed.

04-06-2011, 08:47 AM
I haven't really seen the answer to why you go mastery over avoid and it is really simple.

Mastery makes damage smoother, and more predictable. This is easier to heal. Mastery also has no DR's currently, so you get the best 'bang for buck' out of it.

That is why shield tanks stack it for block.

04-06-2011, 11:00 AM
As a warrior tank I stack mastery because of what Mellvar said...It makes the damage easier to predict. In addition, you literally can never have too much mastery as a warrior tank. Even if you reach a point where true hits fall off the table you don't loose that, and instead get extra critical block %, and that my friends...is bomb.

04-06-2011, 11:25 AM
Thanks for all the input guys, this really helps me try to work on my stats. To answer the question about the hit vs avoidance that I changed I've been also working on Threat output b/c on some fights on 25 mans our Rogues have been trying to tricks each other and even with opening agrro they were pulling off me due to misses/parry's so I was playing around with hit a bit, but when we head back into Heroic Magmaw I'll have that switched back.

04-06-2011, 12:30 PM
I haven't really seen the answer to why you go mastery over avoid and it is really simple.

Mastery makes damage smoother, and more predictable. This is easier to heal. Mastery also has no DR's currently, so you get the best 'bang for buck' out of it.

That is why shield tanks stack it for block.

Can't say it better. Love you Mel, short, sweet, and to the point.

04-07-2011, 11:05 PM
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...olidous/simple (http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/icecrown/solidous/simple)

tonight I was running Heroic Blackrock Caverns and I noticed that my character was super "squishy." even the trash mobs were hitting me hard.
i have my mastery at 50+ i believe, my dodge is at 12+ and my parry is at 14+. my health is 149k unbuffed. I need a little insight as to what I may be doing wrong. I've tried checking out the elitist jerks website, but i am unaware of some of the jargen they speak of. so any advice would be appreciative.

thank you in advance and happy gaming.

04-07-2011, 11:38 PM
what mobs, certain mobs are "tank killers" in there?

04-07-2011, 11:55 PM
untainted check out "ask mr robot"
theck approved for tankadins.

for .8% hit and 7k health you could gain .5% avoidance and nearly 2% block ...