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Hertz65
04-04-2011, 04:11 PM
Hello everyone

I have been Warrior tanking sense BC and am currently Main Tanking for our guild's 10 mans. Our other tank is normally a Druid with equivalent gear as myself. (If you would like a link to my gear please let me know and ill do so) I'm currently finding myself in a loosing battle for threat. Most of the time this isn't a big deal such as groups of trash. Yet causes major issues on some bosses. This threat issue seems to also carry over with our DK Tank.

My priority in my rotation goes something like:
Shield Bash>revenge>Shockwave>Dev.>TC then heroic strike when i have excess rage.

I use InnerRage + Heroic Strike to boost my threat when ever it is off CD and I can spare the rage.

This might be to much information for an easier question but Do any other warrior experience threat issues compared to other tanks?

Thank you for any help....if anymore info is need please feel free to ask.

Tengenstein
04-04-2011, 05:19 PM
Initial threat for a warrior can be an issue compared to the other tanks as we don't have as many abilities to use as we run in (and becuase us running is doesn't take as long) and our limited resources while not in combat. However once you get on target things should be pretty smooth sailing.

For single target your roatation is based on a 4 GCD pattern that restarts everytime you get a Sword and board proc (ie if you can shield slam, you should shield slam). so it should look a little like this;

1. Shield slam
2. Revenge (if unavailable, Devastate)
3. Revenge (if unavailable, Devastate)
4. Other abilities

Your other abilities are in approximate descending threat value


Concussion Blow
Shockwave with 3 stacks of Thunderstruck
Thunderclap refreshing a Rend with less than 3 seconds left (if somone is putting up the 30% bleed damage debuff for you
Shockwave with 1 or 2 stacks of Thunderstruck
Thunderclap refreshing a Rend with less than 6 seconds left (if somone is putting up the 30% bleed damage debuff for you
Thunderclap refreshing a Rend with less than 3 seconds left (without the 30% bleed damage debuff for you
Heroic Throw
Shockwave
Rend (with +30%bleed damge fresh application, not clipped)
Thunderclap refreshing a Rend with less than 6 seconds left (without the 30% bleed damage debuff)
Thunderclap refreshing a Rend with less than 9 seconds left (with the 30% bleed damage debuff for you)
Revenge
Thunderclap refreshing a Rend with less than 9 seconds left (without the 30% bleed damage debuff for you)
Devastate
Rend (without +30%bleed damge fresh application, not clipped)
Victory Rush
Thunder Clap
Demo Shout

At the same time you should be using Spell reflect, Shield Bash, Berserker Rage, and Inner Rage as appropriate and using Heroic Strike as often as you can withough stopping you using the above 4GCD cycle through lack of rage, whilst ensuring maximum uptime on the Thunder Clap, Demo Shout, and Shield Block.

the pull should look something like

Commanding/Battle shout > Heroic throw, Charge, Zerker Rage, & Shield Block > Shield Slam > Conc. Blow > Shockwave > Revenge >begin cruising rotation

All assuming you have a pretty standard 8/0/31 type build and have a moderate.

Heroic Strike usage is key for warrior threat, It makes up around 20-24% of my damage with 3/3 Incite, i do wonder how this compares to others.

Hertz65
04-04-2011, 05:40 PM
Thank you very much for taking the time and effort to do this. This was a lot of food for thought and help.

Gregasaurous
04-04-2011, 09:14 PM
All assuming you have a pretty standard 8/0/31 type build and have a moderate.



8/0/31 is a incomplete talent tree. Typo? Anyway, i'm kinda curious to see how you spec'd that out, if you could show me a link to it i'd appreciate it.

klausi
04-04-2011, 09:49 PM
http://www.wowhead.com/talent#LG0cZ0bZIfGzRRozbu:0Voczq0zM

You can drop Blood and Thunder if you really don't need/want it for an allrounder build and pick up either Thunderstruck (especially if you've to apply thunderclap regulary on your own) or Safeguard (utility).


Heroic Strike usage is key for warrior threat, It makes up around 20-24% of my damage with 3/3 Incite, i do wonder how this compares to others.
Peak is over 30% of my damage on very rage heavy fights like Valiona heroic thanks to Inner Rage usage on cooldown. 20%+- seems like a more reasonable value to me on average, too.

Regards battle for threat vs a druid:
If the druid pops berserk right away it's almost like 15 seconds of constantly sword & board proccs for him.. just to give you an idea of his capabilities. Have him start as a cat and dps until he really has to tank anything.

Regards threat in general:
You must use your next global for shield slam if sword & board proccs and shield slam on cooldown at the beginning of a fight to keep aggro against any decent dps without aggro decreasing tools. Try to configure your ui (powerauras if blizzards own won't do it for you or whatever) according to this.

Tengenstein
04-05-2011, 12:29 AM
8/0/31 is a incomplete talent tree. Typo? Anyway, i'm kinda curious to see how you spec'd that out, if you could show me a link to it i'd appreciate it.

It is indeed an incomplete spec, you need deep wounds and you need 31 points in prot, in a threat build. Klausi has already given the basic spec, where you put the last couple of points is enirely personal preference though I drop Cruelty and pick up Thunderstruck, since i'm usauly on add duty for magmaw/maloriak.

MellvarTank
04-05-2011, 08:27 AM
Keep in mind that if you don't spec into improved revenge, you should drop that from your rotation.

Revolver123
04-06-2011, 10:52 AM
Prot warriors are hurting right now. They are currently the worst of the four tanks for single target tanking. They have threat issues and no magic damage mitigation. They're getting a nice buff to mitigate magic damage in patch 4.1 so we'll see how that goes but their threat issues will linger when tanking in a raid full of DPS in 372 gear.

Prot warriors are good add tanks, however. Blood and Thunder, Piercing howl, Shockwave, and mobility make them good at this job. You should probably spec into that if you plan to join a serious raiding guild, as that will be your job.

Kerchunk
04-07-2011, 02:36 PM
They're getting a nice buff to mitigate magic damage in patch 4.1 so we'll see how that goes but their threat issues will linger when tanking in a raid full of DPS in 372 gear.

Again, none of this seems to be corroborated by evidence. Record setting fights with record setting DPS using Warrior tanks are all over World of Logs. I don't know who the Warrior tank is that is making you think this (maybe it's you), but evidence doesn't seem to back up your claims about them.

Bigbad
04-07-2011, 02:48 PM
Starting a fight with recklessness and prepotting a strength pot is some pretty silly tps at the start. Proper use of inner rage also does wonders, with revenge & devastate costing very little rage and with free shieldslam procs its easy to keep hsing.