PDA

View Full Version : Tanking Bear Tanking Heroic Raid Modes.



Dectavin
03-10-2011, 11:57 AM
Hello all, I want to start off saying I posted here back when I had just started tanking heroic dungeons and the advice I recieved was very excellent and want to thank everyone who checks these forums and gives us nubs halp ;p. To the point I now tank raids and am about to start heroic Halfus tonight. Now will I need to stam stack for HM's instead of Agility, because i heard HM Halfus hits like a truck. And also at what point do I start stacking hit/expertise(if needed at all). I check alot of forums and some people say Bears need expertise, and some say we dont. Im currently gemmed for Agility except for Agility socket bonuses have 20agi-30stam My current stats in Bear form self buffed are:
Atk power:10751
Hit Rating : 111 (0.92%)
Crit Rating 993 (31.60%)
Expertise Rating: 0
Mastery rating: 2177 (20.14)
Stamina: 7979
Dodge rating :1091 for a total of 34.71% in bear form

Armory Link:http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/kelthuzad/m%C3%A2ngled/simple

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks a ton. - Māngled//85 Druid//Kel'Thuzad// Archaic
(p.s. im not sure if im geared enough for HM's but our guilds MT's both left and the rest of the guild is itching to get back to HM's)

Katarn
03-10-2011, 03:29 PM
I think you need around ~175-180khp for Heroic Halfus.

Hit and Expertise are not needed at this tier of content.

klausi
03-10-2011, 05:36 PM
Your gear is fine, it's more important for a druid to be placed on the right target. You either want to tank Halfus or one drake, leave those whelps and multiple drakes to block-tanks.

But if both of your MTs left whose gonna tank with you, it's a three (10s) or four/five (25s) man job? Working on a boss with less tanks and/or gear requirements like Atramedes or Chimaeron might suits your guild better in this position.

Dectavin
03-10-2011, 07:49 PM
They promoted a Warrior , who is about 355-356 ilvl so he will be the block tank we need i suppose. other than that, your right I dont think we have a third tank.(doing 10m)

Habba
03-11-2011, 11:02 AM
I've never used more than 2 tanks on Heroic halfus 10. I honestly don't see a point to that. Your gear looks fairly similar to where I was at when I was tanking heroic Halfus for the first time. I did have some better trinkets (alchemy + vial) and I routinely tank halfus + 1 drake or 2 drakes if my MS stacks get high since we started killing him.

- Hit/Expertise aren't needed. Once vengence kicks in you shouldn't have any trouble holding threat although your weapon is a bit behind. MD, Tol'vir pot and, zerk on the pull should be more than enough especially since Halfus isn't the primary target until way later in the fight when you should have way more threat than needed. MD should probably be on the whelps to the block tank.
- Remember you can bop off the MS debuff, if you raid with pallies you can use that to your advantage
- The fight is lengthy & the scary part is the up front damage, use your cooldowns to help you get through the rough parts.
- Also, pvp gear isn't a bad sub in for 346 gear. Remember the rule with bears, higher ilvl = better even if it's not well itemized simply because of the higher stam/agi/armor.

Is there anything specific that you're having trouble with on the fight?

For reference
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/dark-iron/habbakkukk/simple

Katarn
03-11-2011, 12:38 PM
- Also, pvp gear isn't a bad sub in for 346 gear. Remember the rule with bears, higher ilvl = better even if it's not well itemized simply because of the higher stam/agi/armor.
Piece for Piece, 352 gear is worse than 346, and 365 is worse than 359.

365 is better than 346 though.

Habba
03-11-2011, 01:03 PM
Piece for Piece, 352 gear is worse than 346, and 365 is worse than 359.

365 is better than 346 though.

Compare my neck to the 359 Necklace of Strife.

11 stam 15 agi and 7 mastery over 77 Haste & 50 dodge

So ~ 187 HP, .07% dodge (leaving out crit & ap from the agi) and, depending on your current mastery possibly a bigger bubble. Over 50 dodge which is ~.2% dodge. If you're hurting for health taking the pvp neck is the smarter option and it's an even more dramatic jump from the 346 pieces available. It's definitely not bad by any means.

You will definitely need to inspect the gear pieces to ensure they are upgrades for the tanking situation you're in I didn't mean to insinuate that you shouldn't still make sure that the pieces fit with what you need.

Katarn
03-11-2011, 04:57 PM
Compare my neck to the 359 Necklace of Strife.

11 stam 15 agi and 7 mastery over 77 Haste & 50 dodge

So ~ 187 HP, .07% dodge (leaving out crit & ap from the agi) and, depending on your current mastery possibly a bigger bubble. Over 50 dodge which is ~.2% dodge. If you're hurting for health taking the pvp neck is the smarter option and it's an even more dramatic jump from the 346 pieces available. It's definitely not bad by any means.

You will definitely need to inspect the gear pieces to ensure they are upgrades for the tanking situation you're in I didn't mean to insinuate that you shouldn't still make sure that the pieces fit with what you need.

The 50 Dodge Rating that you lose > 11 Agility and 7 Mastery.

Stamina provides hardly any mitigation value, and 187 HP is pretty worthless unless you can find a situation where the overkill was < 187.

Destruyen
03-11-2011, 05:44 PM
i tanked heroic halfus with alot less gear on my druid than you have. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/korgath/tzuki/simple

i had maybe 165k hp buffed and before i had my t11 helm and legs (had justice point pieces before those),some random ilvl 333 gloves, the rep neck you have and the stam trinket from the twilight highlands quest instead of leaden dispair.

however i only tanked halfus and had a warrior tank two drakes and whelps. i got bop'd after the debuff stacked to 10 the first time and the second time it stacked to 10 healers stopped healing me and i used a soulstone. by that point 2nd drake had just died and whelps were done with. we never released the slate and just started tank swaps on halfus after time was released.

just chain your cooldowns for the first minute or so along with a bop for the first 10 stack of debuff if you do tank halfus if you have a pally in your raid and you should be fine.

edit: and you only need 2 tanks on 10man for heroic halfus.

Dectavin
03-21-2011, 12:34 PM
Thanks for all the advice. We did it and my ''a bit behind'' weapon got upgraded to Heroic Mal :D. I started out on Halfus and Nether Scion while a pally tank took Storm rider and the whelps, We used a BoP when i was around 9-10 stacks of MS and then rotated the next few rotations of MS stacks. We wiped pretty early our first few attempts but on the 4th or 5th we got him down. Thank you again for all the tips. I am using the PvP neck now over my 346 one for the stam/agi but only until I can get Necklace of strife. Should I use the PvP relic over the 346 one I'm using as well? seeing as its crit/haste and haste is pointless.. I'm not sure , I really dont like resorting to pvp gear but if it helps my mitigation/survivability then I'm down until I get something better. - Mangled http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/kelthuzad/m%C3%A2ngled/simple

MellvarTank
03-21-2011, 02:45 PM
I think you need around ~175-180khp for Heroic Halfus.

Nope.


Stamina provides hardly any mitigation value

Stamina provides 0 mitigation.

klausi
03-21-2011, 09:16 PM
I'd buy the relic the next days, there's nothing elese left you could upgrade via valor points.


Stamina provides 0 mitigation.
Not trying to be a nitpicker but stamina increases attackpower via vengeance -> increases your absorb shields -> and they count for migitation :)

Destruyen
03-21-2011, 09:40 PM
i would go for the pvp relic over the vendor one. as you said haste is pointless for a bear just like the resil on the pvp one is. however you get more agi and stam from the pvp one so just reforge the crit to dodge and call it a day.

MellvarTank
03-28-2011, 07:54 AM
Not trying to be a nitpicker but stamina increases attackpower via vengeance -> increases your absorb shields -> and they count for migitation :)

No, Stamina provides 0 mitigation. Being that vengeance can only be a fraction of your total health, and as it is I have NEVER capped vengeance, Stamina provides 0 mitigation. It is your health pool, that is all. Your absorb shield isn't even reliable mitigation. Don't you have to crit to proc it? I would think Crit > stamina for mitigation if that were the case.

Illidra
03-28-2011, 08:04 AM
im not 100% in the know on druids, but i do vaguely rememebr that after a certain dodge thresh hold, raw stamina is actualyl the best optin for the increased size of the shields.

bears, the one tank class that gets mitigation from stam. ( however minor it is)

vengeance is actualyl absed on a % of max health + total stamina or some crazy shit like that.

Destruyen
03-28-2011, 08:13 AM
No, Stamina provides 0 mitigation. Being that vengeance can only be a fraction of your total health, and as it is I have NEVER capped vengeance, Stamina provides 0 mitigation. It is your health pool, that is all. Your absorb shield isn't even reliable mitigation. Don't you have to crit to proc it? I would think Crit > stamina for mitigation if that were the case.

for bears 1 stam = 1.5304 AP (1.607 AP with mark) (1.768 AP with full raid buffs) so in a way bears get mitigation via stam since savage defense (bear block) is based off a percentage of AP and stam gets transferred to AP via vengeance....

but honestly you would be better to get higher sd uptimes if you added more expertise than trying to abosrb more with converting stam -> AP....