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View Full Version : Death Knight Why is DPS so bad now?



Rennadrel
02-13-2011, 08:25 AM
I went from doing 18k in raids prior to the patch to 14k post patch in raids on standing still fights. Like, what the hell happened that has made Unholy so bad? I can't seem to get my numbers any higher now and it's starting to frustrate me. Not to mention I need hit rating like mad, something that seems to be impossible to gather when you aren't raiding on a consistent basis right now and can't get enough valor points for gear. Am I still supposed to just shoot for haste as the primary reforge stat and get rid of crit for now? I have 29% haste but it doesn't seem to be enough, I am getting out DPS'ed by other Unholy DK's by about 2k and they have similar gear as me. Granted I need a new weapon but still, my DPS shouldn't be that bad, and my damage overall isn't that far behind.

squats
02-13-2011, 08:32 AM
http://www.simulationcraft.org/406-2/Raid_T11_372.html#Warrior_Fury_1h_T11_372

simcraft will help!

Rennadrel
02-13-2011, 08:45 AM
Why is Unholy DW still listed? It got nerfed into the ground. This is also implying heroic BIS gear, not a 354 item level average.

squats
02-13-2011, 09:02 AM
Why is Unholy DW still listed? It got nerfed into the ground. This is also implying heroic BIS gear, not a 354 item level average.

It lists every spec...

And isnt that what we all are aiming for. BiS or close to that.

also. the BiS list for 354 should be the same but on their non heroic counterparts theoretically. so the rankings would also be similar.

Netheras
02-13-2011, 09:15 AM
Not to mention mastery is a better stat than crit now. Ghoul still doesn't scale with crit, and mastery increases the shadow damage portion of Scourge Strike. Maybe it is just because your stats aren't all there? Personally I have both hit and expertise dodge cap, about 28% haste and very low crit with a fair amount of mastery and I'm getting up to 20k+ in less gear than you (350 avg item level). So it could also be how you're prioritizing abilities or how well/fast you're reacting.

How far are you away from 8% hit? It isn't that hard to get to it and you've always needed that much, pretty sure it hasn't changed.

Unholy DW is probably still listed because it can still do a fair amount of dps, but it is just loads behind all the other specs.

More information on Unholy changes are all at the EJ thread for Unholy if you want to compare or check up on any of that.

Rennadrel
02-13-2011, 09:51 AM
I have read through everything available and it still doesn't explain how Unholy is so god damn bad. I am 3% hit from being capped without reforging as well, so I need like 350 hit rating in order to cap, and I have the dungeon hit trinket from heroics.

Netheras
02-13-2011, 06:58 PM
You're 3% away from the 8% hit cap? That is... awful for your dps. Get to cap and you should see an increase. Cause it means you're missing with spells too (especially since Outbreak is on the spell hit table).

I was assuming you were less than 1% away. That is probably your entire problem right there.

Prexie
02-13-2011, 07:23 PM
It would be a lot easier to tell you why your dps is suffering if you provided a WoL parse of a relevant raid fight.

Rennadrel
02-13-2011, 07:41 PM
You're 3% away from the 8% hit cap? That is... awful for your dps. Get to cap and you should see an increase. Cause it means you're missing with spells too (especially since Outbreak is on the spell hit table).

I was assuming you were less than 1% away. That is probably your entire problem right there.

It's pretty hard when you don't raid every night of the week and can't get the gear and valor points you need to buy upgrades.

Netheras
02-13-2011, 09:28 PM
Reforge for it. It is higher on your stat priority list until it is at cap.

I don't raid every night of the week either. I've only gotten one upgrade (from the heroic dungeon gear), and my only advantage is being an enchanter (so I have at least one +hit enchant). I'm not saying it isn't tricky to get to 8%, just that it isn't difficult either. I'm sorry if I came off as disgusted earlier - that was my attempt at surprised emphasis (in the worst way), but not as an attack, more of a laughing aside. That being said, it is still probably your issue in a nutshell.

Prexie
02-13-2011, 11:42 PM
You can get hit cap if you reforge for it. A lack of raid gear is not an excuse for not having hit cap considering it's extremely easy for dps DKs to achieve.

Muffin Man
02-14-2011, 12:22 AM
Beyond the lack of hit you seem to have missed some of the general Unholy DPS nerfs:
namely DC took a big hit, as did unholy might.
Our pet took another giant hit (about 20%).
Mastery got buffed sure.
Virulence looks like a buff until you consider that it only replace the bonus to disease damage our old mastery gave us.

So 3 huge nerfs and one small buff.

Unholy dps was just considered to be too OP in both specs as 18k dps while 3% under hit cap would indicate (not to beat that dead horse but that'll really help you get the dps back up since > 20% nerf was not what they intended by any means).

Netheras
02-14-2011, 01:13 AM
DC was only 10%. Not terrible.

Unholy Might, yeah our strength bonus went down but it was by half of 10% so not HUGE.

Pet took a hit from the Shadow Infusion, but only by 10%, and the DT wasn't bad considering they changed the use of Claw to be a bit more aggressive so it doesn't need to be macro'd to Scourge Strike.

Mastery increases all of our Shadow Damage, so thats one disease, part of our main strike, Death Coil (which would have been crazier without the 10% nerf) Blood Boil, DnD and whatever I might have missed/left out. And considering the fact that Virulence was given to us after they took away our old mastery means they actually gave us more..

I say that they made a bunch of choices that worked out a lot better than the previous model, honestly. I don't think we really took a hit, as much as they cut down the lead we had over the other dps specs. Now everyone else has a chance to catch up. Doesn't mean we'll let em, we have that 15% increased speed after all.

klor
02-14-2011, 09:03 AM
I went from doing 18k in raids prior to the patch to 14k post patch in raids on standing still fights. Like, what the hell happened that has made Unholy so bad? I can't seem to get my numbers any higher now and it's starting to frustrate me. Not to mention I need hit rating like mad, something that seems to be impossible to gather when you aren't raiding on a consistent basis right now and can't get enough valor points for gear. Am I still supposed to just shoot for haste as the primary reforge stat and get rid of crit for now? I have 29% haste but it doesn't seem to be enough, I am getting out DPS'ed by other Unholy DK's by about 2k and they have similar gear as me. Granted I need a new weapon but still, my DPS shouldn't be that bad, and my damage overall isn't that far behind.

You have not picked up all the heroic gear if you can't even hit the hit cap. You only need eight percent. With the latest changes, mastery has surpassed crit for damage stats.

Str > hit cap > haste > mastery > crit > expertise

That is your priority for stats now since the patch. We took a hefty need on our pet and diseases and death coil (15% not 10% like some are saying. They hot fixed it again to nerf it and the ghoul yet again) and a few other things and now our scourge strike is an even higher part of our damage

This means you need to scourge strike even more than before but also remember that you always want to.use death and decay on cd. I don't know about you but on most bosses my initial pull goes like.this.

Pre pot golemblood. Use bloodfury/outbreak. Dnd. Scourge strike. Festering festering. By then I can use unholy frenzy and gargoyle. Then I use scourge strike until I.use up all the unholy and death runes filtering In death.coil when I can. Then I festering again to get rid.of.blood.frost runes. Using this rotation about.the.time my diseases finally fade, outbreak is up again. And thus the rotation starts over.

I noticed alot of dks don't use their death runes effectively. Ninety percent of.the time.my top 3 damage is ss, ss shadow, and death coil on single target. Anything else and your rotation is off except fights with alot of down time on bosses where dc is the only way to.hit it.

You can look up my dk on armory. Krahgan on us laughing skull. I pull a consistent 17k atleast on boss fights.