View Full Version : Tanking giving up on tanking.
01-10-2011, 11:35 AM
I have been on this site for a year or two. I have been tanking for two years and I really enjoy it a lot. But I am getting very discouraged. I have been trying to break my clicking habit for quite awhile. I have been getting away with it, until I hit heroics in cata. I am more than geared enough, I level 340 or so.
It is frustrating because I love tanking. I have saught advice from people on TS to learn to keybind and it hasn't worked out. The most I have been able to do is get HS keybound as my rage dump. And my leveling guild is looking to start raiding in ernest for the first time. They are asking me to MT, but I think it would be best to turn it down based on my experience in heroics. If I run one over and over again I do well. I can run HHoO flawlessly but that is a result of practice. And I don't see raiding offering me that same luxury. Anyway no real question here just venting. Thanks
01-10-2011, 11:52 AM
Have you tried doing dailies with you bars disabled so you can't look at them and click them? I know it's hard to relearn the stuff, because every time I get a new ability I have to use I have to shift my keybinds around a bit and for awhile it just feels wrong. After a few days it starts to sink in though.
01-10-2011, 02:45 PM
I'd been a part-time clicker (I had a couple of keybinds but nothing significant) up until a few months ago when I bought a Razer Naga. Now the only time I click the action bar is for those abilities that are used very rarely. It's made a big difference. Took a few days to get a feel for it though.
01-10-2011, 03:47 PM
I have heard about that mouse being beneficial. But I haven't tried it out myself, I will give that a shot and see how it goes.
01-10-2011, 06:30 PM
Well you don't need to have everything bound to anything. You should be able to do your rotation and important or often needed abilities to reach easily and instantly. But if it's easier to have some less often used stuff placed on buttons which are easily reachable for you with your mouse, that should be ok. I at least struggle with alternative keys and stuff. Especially since I never could teach me to use something else but alt for my push-to-talk. And if you press it together with for example shift and a key, windows may intervene and switch your keyset around. (So I get an english keyset instead of a german one.) Or stuff likethat. That's not only annyoing but can screw you up more than klicking a button now and again.
For example I dont have my shouts on keybinds. Sure I use them often, but I never have to use them in a hurry. If it's dangerous I don't need the rage from them, when I'm rage starved I probably cannot do anything else so have time to klick it and the duration is long enough so that I can refresh them easily enough.
As long as one can use everything in time, it does not really matter if you use keys or are klicking stuff. The core problem with "klickers" is that if you klick your basic rotation you cannot use other stuff while klicking this rotation.
01-10-2011, 07:35 PM
My left hand does ASDW movements plus hits my " rotation " buttons which are 1 thru 5 on the keyboard ..... I have a g500 mouse with buttons as well, but I only have my target marks assigned to them so I can in fight mark easily.
Point is my hand never leaves a position it knows ( muscle memory from all those years of HL and quake )
Also dumb question, but do you have auto run on a key/mouse bind ? Clicking my mouse center wheel enables running, which helps me move if I'm not ASDW ing.
01-10-2011, 08:20 PM
Everyone has their own set up.
I actually just use the two button press to run. It also helps keep me from keyboard turning although I still do that sometimes (I really should rebind the q/e keys to totally break the habit).
I use the mouse wheel to scroll between targets, a lot of people here favored using it for heroics strike/cleave pre-Cata. Then I use center press for backup, although i use it very rarely these days.
I actually don't keybind everything either. Like nserafini I put my heavy rotation abilities in the top left (`, 1 - 6 for me). Lesser used things go on alternate action bars, like shift-2 pulls up heroic throw, taunt, spell reflect, ect.
But, like Katzazi I click my shouts. I'm also bad and click my cooldowns.
But that's fine for timed damage bursts. Like clicking through them for Sindragosa breaths or chaining them one after the other on 3 stack Festergut. It's not as fine for "oh crap I'm at 1000 hp, time to last stand, whoops."
Despite my bad habits, it hasn't prevented me from tanking through the end of LK although I'll admit to not doing much for Cata yet (no heroics / raids yet).
01-10-2011, 11:57 PM
I was exactly where you are now two years ago. A prospect of starting raiding on my tank, but a clicker which harmed my awareness a ton.
First I cleaned up my UI of unnecessary clutter. (you can decide yourself if that's needed)
Then I removed all the abilities I thought I didn't need from my action bars. In my (warrior) case I was left with shieldslam (2), devastate (3) and revenge (4). I simply went out and did dailies, stuff and so on while running around with WASD for moving keys and with my hand of the mouse as much as possible.
Once I had those three keys nailed I added stuff like thunderclap (5 button). Etc.
Basically, the point is to break it up into sections to build muscle memory. You're also going to screw up your keybinds completely, a ton of times, and it is normal. Build your practice routine by doing single player stuff, then when you're ready help some people in a normal dungeon for really training your instancing abilities in a low stress environment.
There's some add ons that can help you build your muscle memory, but I found I didn't need them. I just needed to consciously focus on training specific things first. From those initial 3 keybinds I worked up till I had most of the abilities I use bound to keys.
Hope that helps you somewhat!
01-11-2011, 04:27 AM
You really can't be a clicker as DPS either, perhaps you can get away with it a little more but eventually you're going to need to mouse turn while DPSing.
Now many healers use mouse-based addons like Clique, Healbot, or VuhDo, but that's a big difference from playing a Warrior tank and is probably a bigger leap than jumping from clicking to keybinds.
I would start small. Bind your most-used abilities and focus on those. It's ok if you use your mouse for some stuff - like one of the previous posters, I'm bad and click my cooldowns (really need to get one of those mice with buttons on the side...).
01-11-2011, 08:46 AM
Thanks for all the advice. Just a little background, I don't keyboard turn, I do have two moves keybound. I have tried more keybindings but I'm an older guy who worked with his hands for years. Arthritis and dexterity is a real problem, my hands dont work that well any more. I'm also 6'5" with rather large hands which doesn't help the situation.
I think I'm going to try the fixing the problem via a new mouse. I went out and bought the new WoW cataclysm " steel series" mouse. I didn't buy it for the name or perks I bought it for its size. It freakin huge and I looked at a bunch including the razers. I set my hand on it and it fits like a glove. I had 14 buttons at my finger tips with very little movement. Its a little overwelming but I'm going to give it a honest try and force my self to use it. I bound my rotation plus more via the shift key.
No heroics for awhile I'm just going to farm, do daily's, and run normals till its second nature.
01-11-2011, 10:00 AM
Play how you're comfortable and how you have fun. This subject has been hashed out ad nausaum and there is no right answer.
Personally, I use a combination of things, I do click, I have some keybinds and I keyboard turn when I need precision but use the mouse for quick movements (especially when I dps; think jump - turn - runout in Sindy) - in fact at this point I don't even make conscious decisions on how I'll turn, it's just reflex based on the situation. Also, I'm constantly using the mouse to change my camera angle during fights and use Dominos to arrange my bars in a way that's useful to me. I also use healbot when I tank on my pally for Lay on Hands, HoP, HoS, etc. and I use decursive to cleanse and help the healers conserve mana. Maybe it's adult ADD, but if there's not a lot going on, I'm bored to tears.
If you want to learn to keybind, I suggest to first quest using nothing but the mouse to move, and nothing but keybinds for actions while killing mobs. Do that for a few weeks until you're comfortable with it, then try it in a dungeon. You can eventually add back some keyboard moving and mouse clicking on certain abilities, but you just need to switch your habits first, and it's less frustrating on a quest mob than when there are other people depending on you.
01-11-2011, 03:12 PM
I have tried more keybindings but I'm an older guy who worked with his hands for years. Arthritis and dexterity is a real problem, my hands dont work that well any more. I'm also 6'5" with rather large hands which doesn't help the situation.
I sympathize with this, I have pretty big hands that seem to consume most mouses, plus I'm double jointed which I spent a lot of time learning to get around.
Things like this are why setting vary so much between people and why what works for one won't work for another, so good luck figuring out something that works well.
Executing a rotation is mostly about rhythm so I wouldn't worry too much about actual hand speed. And of course a big part of tanking is about understanding the encounter and positioning the boss properly; not making split second decisions (although if you're ever responsible for picking up adds then it could come down to having a fast target/taunt trigger finger). So I hope you stick with it and find something that's comfortable for you.
01-11-2011, 04:00 PM
Muscle Memory is key. Just bind those buttons where you like, and soon enough the brain hits the button the same second it thinks it.
01-11-2011, 09:06 PM
Also, practice.....not on training dummies. Go do dailies and quest with new keybinds and tank things to practice. Some mobs do little raid style stuff on top of regular attacks. So go pretend it's a raid or something and practice. You will get the hang of it soon enough.
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01-12-2011, 10:29 AM
What really helped me (because I started getting carried away with my keybinds) was to move my movement keys from WASD to ESF.
I no longer have backwards keybound as a result (and this freed up WAD for additional keybinds.)
But how to get started, set Charge to a key that is near your left index finger (mine is G.) Then bind Taunt to 1, Dev to 2 and SS to 3. Then, when you're doing your dailies, force yourself not to click those abilities. target click, G, 3, then whatever your rotation is. But when SS or Dev come up in your rotation use the hot keys instead of clicking. Do this forever until you're comfortable.
When you get comfortable with that you can branch out binding the rest of your rotation. Then branch out further with situational abilities like Conc Blow, Shockwave, Last Stand, etc.
Eventually you will be like me and have all of the following keys bound
F1, F2, F3
SHIFT + Q,W,R,T,A,D,G,Z,X
SHIFT + 1,2,3,4,5
MOUSE 1, MOUSE 2
SHIFT + MOUSE 1, SHIFT MOUSE 2
CTRL + MOUSE 1
But i have everything from popping open my enchanting list to building a basic camp fire bound.
WARNING! Changing key binds will throw you off for at least a day!
01-13-2011, 05:07 PM
I don't really have any additional advice to offer but I wish you the best of luck.
01-13-2011, 06:40 PM
Another thing to consider is whether you are using the right keyboard. I had been having similar problems and was using a Logitech G15 keyboard, excellent keyboard and well loved but I was having problems getting used to my keybinds on it.
I did a bit of research and bought myself a Razer Lycosa keyboard, much lower profile keys especially the F ones and it's made a huge difference. Much more comfortable to use for me personally and I'm feeling more confident with it. Also I can't use my little finger to hit any buttons due to a permanent injury so I got a simple buttoned mouse, a Logitech MX518, created a shift button on it and added a few other abilities to it.
01-13-2011, 06:41 PM
It is better to have binds and try to memoriae what's where but that will come with practice i personnaly bind everything I might need in a fight and I have some crazy binds my craziest would have to be alt+v I always fumble and hit other shit with my thumb unless I look down briefly lol
01-14-2011, 07:30 AM
Things are going well so far with the new mouse. I have only been farming mobs to get used to it. I have all my main moves bound to the mouse. And have them memorized which seems to be working well. Now its just practice. I need to fix my standard UI to get my cooldowns front and center so I can see them better. I'm forcing myself to not look down. So I'm not tempted to click, at the moment.