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fony
11-11-2010, 10:29 AM
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Following up on last week's episode on the Alliance (http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?71788-BFF-Report-Cataclysm-Starting-Zones). I am back with the second part of our coverage of the HORDE starting zones... none of that is really important though, you should really just watch for Darnell.

Click here for more episodes of the BFF Report! (http://www.zam.com/bffreport)
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Sensai
11-11-2010, 10:44 AM
Darnell is so masculine!

Garrosh seems like a bit of a jerk and the Undead starting zone looks the best. :)

Epicbeef
11-11-2010, 12:58 PM
Would be so awsome if you dident have to turn in the quest, just see him running round with the lich king on his back or something :P
p.s excuse the title i submitted without realising and dunno how to change

Chamenas
11-11-2010, 01:09 PM
Not sure what to say about the Forsaken raising others as undead. Really doesn't fit...

Thamiorr
11-11-2010, 01:14 PM
Doesn't seem like they changed a lot for the horde, orcs are the same, taruens look very similar as well, undead is the big change, the trolls look like the most different one outta them all. i think they changed more for the alliance then they did for the horde in my opinion but then again its starter quests so it doesn't matter that much

Chamenas
11-11-2010, 01:18 PM
They didn't really change much for Alliance either. Night Elves don't really change until you leave the starter zone, and that's only to see everything destroyed. Humans are about as different as the Orcs and Draenei don't change at all. Gnomes, like Trolls, have very different starting experiences. Dwarves look like they've changed a little, similar to the Undead. I'd say it's a fairly even comparison on the whole, though, to me, the Undead changes look like the most interesting lorewise. Might have to roll an undead just to see the experience.

Thamiorr
11-11-2010, 01:24 PM
yeah that is true, might make some horde alt to see about it but i'm just going to focus lvling my 80s to 85 and then make my worgen but after that who knows what i'll do next haha

Reev
11-11-2010, 01:27 PM
Yeah, seems a little off for the Forsaken to want to raise others. I could see them trying to "free" existing scourge in order to replenish their numbers, but I don't see them raising more undead.

Chamenas
11-11-2010, 01:41 PM
Yeah, seems a little off for the Forsaken to want to raise others. I could see them trying to "free" existing scourge in order to replenish their numbers, but I don't see them raising more undead.

That could actually feel somewhat heroic. Of course, some would still need convincing that they want to remain after all the awful stuff they did under the control of the scourge, but you could have some truly interesting lore tales woven in there. Sadly, I think the Undead motif is more about being the sort of "anti-hero" and a lot of Undead players are probably rolling their eyes as the thought of "touching" and "heroic" stuff. :P

Reev
11-11-2010, 02:00 PM
That could actually feel somewhat heroic. Of course, some would still need convincing that they want to remain after all the awful stuff they did under the control of the scourge, but you could have some truly interesting lore tales woven in there. Sadly, I think the Undead motif is more about being the sort of "anti-hero" and a lot of Undead players are probably rolling their eyes as the thought of "touching" and "heroic" stuff. :P

Well, I don't think the Forsaken would view it as a heroic task, but more like a chore they have to carry out. It could even be a part of the opening zone quests, and would explain where your character comes from. I just don't see the Forsaken as intentionally wanting to raise the dead ("what joy is there in this curse?"). You never see a necromancer among the Forsaken, after all. The only time I can remember seeing the dead raised by the Forsaken is the Abomination Hacksaw Jenny has you create to take out the Vrykul in Howling Fjord, and that Abom isn't meant to live long.

Obviously, that's not the direction Blizzard wants to take it, though, so this is really moot.

saajet
11-11-2010, 02:14 PM
Looks like the next expansion will be "The Horde Civil War". No surprise Sylvanas is getting as many able bodies and she can

Scottpoet
11-11-2010, 02:22 PM
Forcing Scarlett Crusaders and other former enemies to obey the will of the Banshee Queen seems kind of right in it's own way.
"Join us or die...... again"

Kurtosis
11-15-2010, 07:37 PM
Forcing Scarlett Crusaders and other former enemies to obey the will of the Banshee Queen seems kind of right in it's own way.
"Join us or die...... again"
This. The Forsaken are very much about raising new undead in Cata. The problem is they'll go extinct as they get killed off by the Alliance and other enemies, since they can't have babies like all the other races do.






-------------------SPOILER-------------------

Sylvanis has even recruited the Lich King's newly 'unemployed' Valkyrs to join the Forsaken for exactly that reason - they're able to mass raise new undead from corpses. There's a quest in Silverpine showing this. Garrosh shows up, Sylvanis demonstrates it, Garrosh calls it an 'abomination' but allows it anyway after hearing Sylvanis's reasoning. Then he orders her not to deploy the Plague against Gilneas, which she promises not to, but does anyway after he leaves.

-------------------/SPOILER-------------------

Chamenas
11-15-2010, 07:57 PM
@ Kurtosis - This isn't new information to the thread, though it's certainly relevant. I think a lot of us know why the Undead are doing what they're doing. The question isn't so much about the why as it is about the "does this fit in with their lore?" Of course, in the end, Blizzard will make it fit in with the lore and some posters have already offered up reasonable suggestions for how it can. In the end, I think fitting this "new" aspect of the Forsaken will require a bit of "retconning" of previous statements made, but it's not really a major issue and the lore will push forward.

Chosen
11-16-2010, 05:17 AM
Darnell for Warchief!

dacoolist
11-17-2010, 05:12 AM
Darnell for Warchief!

HAHHAHAH, I just love the ending with Darnell and the Zep, then he just pops up out of thin air on the deck. /agree with Darnell for Warchief! (bc Garrosh FAILS) Keep up the great work FONY!!!

Bloodtainted
11-17-2010, 02:02 PM
@ Kurtosis - This isn't new information to the thread, though it's certainly relevant. I think a lot of us know why the Undead are doing what they're doing. The question isn't so much about the why as it is about the "does this fit in with their lore?" Of course, in the end, Blizzard will make it fit in with the lore and some posters have already offered up reasonable suggestions for how it can. In the end, I think fitting this "new" aspect of the Forsaken will require a bit of "retconning" of previous statements made, but it's not really a major issue and the lore will push forward.

Not at all trying to flame here but I'm interpreting from what you're saying is progressing the forsakens story requires blizzard to go back and change their past ? Changing the forsakens position on an issue (in this case raising the dead) doesnt require changing their past. Because events have transpired and the forsaken need to raise the dead to survive even though they have stated they are against it in the past. Its a new forsaken they have changed. This static way of thinking makes boring storytelling imo.

Things change the world has changed. We have changed. Cataclysm.

Chamenas
11-17-2010, 02:23 PM
@ Bloodtainted - If it were progressing the story, that would make sense. But what they're changing is a fundamental core tenet of being the forsaken, of what the forsaken has been. It would be roughly equivalent to America kicking out the Congress and the Supreme Court and making the President an Emperor. We wouldn't be America anymore, we'd be something new. Except, strictly speaking, our founding fathers wouldn't have done that.

The founders of the forsaken are still kicking around, and they HATED the fact that they were brought back. They despised that fact. That was still clear in WotLK. Because of that, it was utterly against their purposes to bring back anyone, only to possibly free those who were still under scourge control or to gather in those who had broken free from the scourge.

Thus such a move in the lore is either an extreme shift in the storyline of Sylvannas, which, imo, is enough change in her character to warrant its own story, of which I haven't seen anything of. Or its a retcon of where she's previously stood.

If Sylvannas says, in game, "yeah, I used to say we wouldn't want others to suffer this same fate, but now I say fuck it because I want to persevere" that would at least be the start of some interesting lore to earn their current position (earn as in the literary sense of earn, which, yes, I know it's a game, but for a game that cares about its lore...). Right now I haven't seen anything like that, but I also haven't had a chance to do it.

It should be known that I'm not arguing that this shift shouldn't exist. I actually find it highly intriguing. I just hope that the shift is earned or justified, and not sort of simply thrown in there and forgotten. There's a lot of potential lore behind such a change.

Bloodtainted
11-19-2010, 12:00 AM
@Lulia I'm not in beta so i dont have first hand knowledge on the subject but the wowinsider show had a bit about the forsaken awhile ago. They talked about a huge massive shift within the forsaken if i recall correctly on the level of making the president an emperor to follow your example. If its truly justified I guess we will find out after launch day :D

/cheers

Chamenas
11-19-2010, 05:52 AM
Well, the biggest question is if they recognize it or make note of it. If everything has simply changed and there's no admission on the part of the Forsaken of the change then it's an opportunity lost. We'll find out, it should certainly be interesting.

Maverickroll
11-21-2010, 01:26 AM
I want to now reroll as a Undead Warrior

named Darnell