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View Full Version : The Weekly Marmot -- Thinking Like A Designer



Ciderhelm
09-21-2010, 10:01 PM
S0f64yqdWqE

Halandir
09-21-2010, 10:31 PM
woot! now I just have to download it so I can put it on my phone and watch it while driving tomorrow... any eta on the download being available?

Kazeyonoma
09-21-2010, 10:32 PM
holy crap the freeze frame on this one is amazing... you literally look like O_-

Lore
09-22-2010, 12:42 AM
rofl

hey guuuuuuuys

Pers3us
09-22-2010, 02:41 AM
Holy crap is that minecraft? LOL at the SQUARE comment... I like it.

This video should be a requirement to watch before you post on the class forums and what not. It would help reduce the amount of time GC and other developers take to go through QQ posts and have to lock them. Sometimes there's an awesome "owned" comment that the developer says as well.

Hades
09-22-2010, 02:58 AM
ZOMGQQNONERFSPL0X! The next time I read something to that extent on the wow forums, I'm totally linking this video. Thanks Lore, for the interesting perspective.

Barracuda
09-22-2010, 04:37 AM
After leveling severrrrul chars... there is no such thing as overpower / underpower characters... but overskilled / underskilled players.
This i just said is my experience and opinion and i do only talk refering the end game content and level. i do understand and recognize that a protection warrior, as any kind of dk and pally dps (at certains levels) are indeed overpowered (even hunters at low levels) but that can be easily explained by math and common sense.

I do not condole QQ in terms Lore just xplained on the video, but i do get irritated when at level 45 a protection pally in a gp goes like "u all suck, my recount says i am doin like the 75% of damage" (seriosuly dude? didnt u get the memo from blizz? this shows to me the same kind of ignorance that all those players QQ'ing because they feel they are underpowered by design)

Cheers

Rennadrel
09-22-2010, 05:47 AM
My understanding that the class changes I will have to deal with as a Paladin are not as bad when you get to level 85 and are gearing for raids. I have been reading a lot of other opinions on the changes, which seem to be by and large the biggest of any class aside from Death Knights getting an exclusive tanking tree. There are some problems with changing the talents early though from a players aspect, we are going to do crap all for threat generation due to the overall threat output being lowered and the amount of Mastery required to DPS at a constant rate will be a big requirement for Retribution, making leveling pretty difficult and raiding until you get into Cataclysm content since none of the previous gear will have Mastery unless Blizzard decides to add it to at least the current raid Tier which would be really nice.

I love some of the development changes overall and the expansion is looking to be shaping up really well from what I gather. My initial impressions on the PTR have not been good but after doing a lot of research, it seems like the changes to classes will be fine until we get Cataclysm gear.

I see a lot of complaining on the class forums and was not very happy with what they have done to Paladins on the PTR, but from a design standpoint it will make sense later. People should think about everything being for the greater good of the game.

Horacio
09-22-2010, 07:20 AM
holy crap the freeze frame on this one is amazing... you literally look like O_-

...littering and....littering and....littering and.....

SneekyB
09-22-2010, 08:19 AM
I loved the vid. I've been trying to explain your exact point to people. Just last night a resto druid was complaining about being bored healing us is icc 25. That just confirms the direction blizz is trying to take. By making healing more of a challenge, players should find healing a lot more enjoyable by letting them take a more active roll than just sitting there spamming heals all night long.
A point I would like to make is even though class changes may seem like nerfing but really it gives us as players the opertunity to learn a new way of playing a class. right now everything is pretty much muscle memory. When the exspansion comes out our class will be new and fresh and it will engage us to learn it all over again.
I for one am excited and ready for something new :)

Horacio
09-22-2010, 11:51 AM
...littering and....littering and....littering and.....

Context:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=87X1LMfdMns

Petninja
09-22-2010, 11:59 AM
ZOMG Lore ninja introduced himself to me! I was so not prepared. Illidan would be mad at me.

I like the message this video brings, but I suspect most of the QQ is coming from people who won't listen to reason anyway. I think the rest of the QQ is coming from people mimicking the QQ they read on forums and rephrasing it to make them feel relevant and "in". They may not fully believe it themselves, they just propagate it because it's a topic that will always create discussion.

Harroth
09-22-2010, 07:18 PM
Great points except sometimes designers do make a game suck on purpose: http://www.geekosystem.com/xkcd-tetris-hell-game/

Rennadrel
09-22-2010, 09:27 PM
ZOMG Lore ninja introduced himself to me! I was so not prepared. Illidan would be mad at me.

I like the message this video brings, but I suspect most of the QQ is coming from people who won't listen to reason anyway. I think the rest of the QQ is coming from people mimicking the QQ they read on forums and rephrasing it to make them feel relevant and "in". They may not fully believe it themselves, they just propagate it because it's a topic that will always create discussion.

Well I look at it this way. Most classes are getting changed in some form, some lesser then others. Death Knights, Paladins and Restoration Druids seem to be facing the largest changes all around, with the Paladin class seeing a massive overhaul much like the pre-Wrath content patch added many new things to our spell book and what we were capable of doing. I am not sure if as a whole Paladins go back to being considered the "lol class" of the game at this point, I will wait and see after I have prepared my Paladin for Cataclysm raids to determine whether it truly has been hit with the nerf bat too heavily or not.

I think the biggest downside is that these changes as a whole for all classes are going to be very tough on players who are currently geared up in their current setups since there are no items currently in game to compliment these changes, especially the Mastery system which seems to be making up the core of all class and spec functionality. I think Blizzard should have considered a way of making Mastery complimentary to the upcoming content patch in order to help players get a feel for what they should expect in Cataclysm. I know that Reforging will be available with 4.0, however I don't think changing stats on gear will help players continue to raid the current expansion content before Cataclysm. For instance, I know with Retribution Paladins, our Mastery determines how fast we generate Holy Power with melee swings, which will make it harder for players to succeed in their roles until they reach whatever the minimum level is to pick up gear from quests in Cataclysm.

jvitelli3
09-23-2010, 09:35 AM
Actually when I see the things Lore talks about, I don't think of it from a designer point of view at all. Especially when I think of changing gems, re-doing stats and new talent trees. I start thinking of how many lines of code would I need to make those changes and then how many subroutines are involved and if I change this where else is something going to stop working. What a pain

Alamire
09-23-2010, 03:22 PM
I'm tempted to suggest you link to this on Team Liquid. Seems it applies even more to all the balance QQ going on over SC2.

Speaking of SC2, nice Day9 reference with the 'Drink some water....delicious!' thang. Intentional, or have you simply been watching too much of him (as have I?)

Krenian
09-23-2010, 09:33 PM
You look like someone messed you right up.

Love these snapshots that it takes! LOL