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View Full Version : Tanking Gear, where to go from here?



pinnacle2009
08-13-2010, 01:41 AM
So based on my groups last few attempts on ICC10 HM, I am needing some more threat rather than survivability. One or two of the top dps in our group is having to hold back some.. we'd rather that not be the case.

Soooo, I am PROBABLY going to get the T10 helm this week unless I can find a better "+threat" tanking upgrade. Any suggestions as to where to go with this?

note: the +dodge trinket isnt the one im using. I will be using UO from putri.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Blackwater+Raiders&cn=Logikal

I am using the 969 rotation and I generally do 11-14k TPS, atleast, that what I saw on heroic fester last night. I can post a log of the run if that would help.

Timberton
08-13-2010, 02:27 AM
Post the following:

1. armory link
2. raid composition: you have rogues, hunters?
3. Your average TPS as reported by Omen

Passive
08-13-2010, 04:39 AM
4. The class you're playing.
5. Your rotation.

pinnacle2009
08-13-2010, 10:22 AM
edited first post. Sorry, was really tired when I made the post lol

pinnacle2009
08-13-2010, 10:27 AM
and no rogues or hunters.

Timberton
08-15-2010, 10:58 PM
I generally do 11-14k TPS, atleast, that what I saw on heroic fester last night

Bolded the iffy bit. Fester has sqewed threat due tothe mechanics.
A better benchmark would be LK P1 on boss tanking, other candidates: Blood princess on boss tanking, saurfang, rotface, blood council-non keleseth.


If you are puting out 9-11k TPS on those bosses, you are at about the upper limit on TPS, beyound this you need rogues/hunters to trix/misdirect you.
Since you don't have rogues/hunters, your dps should think about investing into threat reducing talents or getting hands of salvations.

Also you can think of switching the 18 stamina enchant from gloves into armsman enchant for +2% threat.

PatrikL
08-16-2010, 05:35 AM
I'd saw review your rotation rather than your gear. Unless you are massively outgeared threat shouldnt be an issue except the start of fights. I play a DK myself so I can't say anything about paladins but I regularly raid with both a warrior and a paladin and our threat production are roughly the same and way higher than our dps (which are good btw).
If we are talking about one or two dps getting too close to you it might also be a problem on their behalf?

11-14k TPS is more than enough but Fester isnt a good boss to measure it on as the above poster said because of the debuff.

pinnacle2009
08-16-2010, 02:20 PM
http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-g654cdab1rmihoyg/

That should be log I'm thinking of. I am Logikal by the way.

edit:

Here's one from a Ruby Sanctum

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/

Insahnity
08-16-2010, 02:38 PM
Blizzard expects either a rogue or a hunter to be present at all times, and you can't even vigilence. As mentioned before, unless you have that, your options are limited.

But from what I can see, I'd agree with PatrikL, you aren't producing nearly enough DPS for your given setup. Also, consider using avenging wrath on the pull, it knocks out your Diving Prot for a few minutes, but it will help your threat, which is what you need more at the beginning. I think you can squeeze in a few in the fights.

If it's a slow loss instead of snap aggro, you have at least 2 hand of salvations and a pain supression to work with, 2 of the 3 are in the hands of your healers who might not be GCD constrained at the start. You can pull right off the bat with wings and have both healers hand + PS the top 2 dps. I just can't see you having aggro issues if you do this.

pinnacle2009
08-16-2010, 08:42 PM
What should it be closer to? (DPS)

I asked when I was first getting into ICC about the rotation and thought I had it. I'll look at it again. Hopefully I'll find the problem and be doing more threat lol

Harmacy
08-16-2010, 08:54 PM
Blizzard expects either a rogue or a hunter to be present at all times, and you can't even vigilence. As mentioned before, unless you have that, your options are limited.

But from what I can see, I'd agree with PatrikL, you aren't producing nearly enough DPS for your given setup. Also, consider using avenging wrath on the pull, it knocks out your Diving Prot for a few minutes, but it will help your threat, which is what you need more at the beginning. I think you can squeeze in a few in the fights.

If it's a slow loss instead of snap aggro, you have at least 2 hand of salvations and a pain supression to work with, 2 of the 3 are in the hands of your healers who might not be GCD constrained at the start. You can pull right off the bat with wings and have both healers hand + PS the top 2 dps. I just can't see you having aggro issues if you do this.

Wings has nothing to do with the Divine Protection/Shield debuff. Popping Wings the moment you get a 5-stack on the boss is a very good way to maximize your early threat. Popping it before this point will increase the initial threat from your Frisbee and stuff, but will in the end generate much less aggro (that 33% weapon damage adds up quickly).

Also, PS is a really weak aggro reduction, only 5% - compared to the enormous defensive potential. I'd only use it as an aggro reducer on farm content or silly weak stuff like Rotface.

pinnacle2009
08-18-2010, 07:14 PM
Well I dont see anything wrong with my rotation. Any chance it could be my hit rating? 147 hit rating and 34 expertise (with glyph). I have 1769 strength and I have heard that 2,000 should be my goal?

What should I look for that could determine why my dps is lower than it should be?

Lumines
08-19-2010, 01:49 AM
Well I dont see anything wrong with my rotation.

Then I suggest you re-read the threads on the 969 rotation, because you're miles away from it. Why are you even wasting GCDs on Holy Wrath on a single target boss fight? On Marrowgar, you're only casting HotR every 9-11 seconds in most cases (one 7 second gap is your best). ShoR is similar. Even accounting for Marrowgar whirling all over the room, that's very poor.

Baltharus the Warborn - HotR every 8-11 seconds, ShoR every 8-13 (?!) seconds.

Halion (your final attempt) - HotR every 8-11 seconds, ShoR every 8-15 seconds. Sections like:

[23:32:52.230] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/53595/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:32:58.588] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/53595/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:33:01.089] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Judgement of Light (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/20271/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:33:03.608] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/61411/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:33:05.627] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/53595/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:33:08.079] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Consecration (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/48819/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:33:09.447] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Holy Shield (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/48952/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:33:10.935] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Judgement of Light (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/20271/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:33:12.451] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/61411/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392)
[23:33:15.854] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/53595/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392)

Does that look like a tight, correct rotation?

The problem is the same as pretty much everyone else who complains of threat issues: your threat stats are inconsequential, because you're doing your rotation incorrectly and inefficiently. Ignore threat stats, work on your rotation.

pinnacle2009
08-19-2010, 05:05 AM
The order is correct atleast isnt it?

If so, I am really not sure how to get it any tighter. I am a clicker which may have something to do with it? I dunno. Guess I just need to read more and try to get out of the habit of clicking.

Harmacy
08-19-2010, 05:22 AM
The order is incorrect. You should be doing 96969 - see how you're putting Shield of Righteousness and Hammer of the Righteous (your two 6-second abilities) back-to-back, that's a no-no.

And yeah, clicking is going to be a problem.

Lumines
08-19-2010, 05:25 AM
The order is correct atleast isnt it?

No.

[23:32:52.230] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/53595/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392) 6
[23:32:58.588] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/53595/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392) 6
[23:33:01.089] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Judgement of Light (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/20271/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392) 9
[23:33:03.608] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/61411/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392) 6
[23:33:05.627] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/53595/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392) 6
[23:33:08.079] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Consecration (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/48819/?s=6023&e=6392) 9
[23:33:09.447] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Holy Shield (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/48952/?s=6023&e=6392) 9
[23:33:10.935] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Judgement of Light (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/20271/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392) 9
[23:33:12.451] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/61411/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392) 6
[23:33:15.854] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/18/?s=6023&e=6392) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/spell/53595/?s=6023&e=6392) on Halion (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-w1qwglkqgijpzpqd/details/51/?s=6023&e=6392) 6

Summary: 6696699966

You want 96969 indefinitely. Hence "the 969 rotation". It's not called that because the abilities have 6 and 9 second effective cooldowns; it's called that because that's the order you want to use them in. ShoR and HotR are 6s; Judgement, HS and Consecration are the 9s. Alternate those. Don't use Holy Wrath on single targets.

Once you've got that sorted out (i.e. you're doing the rotation correctly), you work on doing it efficiently. Efficiency is using every GCD, and using the 6 second cooldowns as close as possible to every 6 seconds, i.e. minimising the gaps between abilities by pre-casting/hammering the button before it's up. Key bindings will help here.

pinnacle2009
08-19-2010, 05:39 AM
Hmmm I'll look at that. Not sure how I managed to mess it up that badly. SoR and HotR are't even next to each other on my action bars lol Guess I never had to pay attention until now. I've always held aggro up until I started raiding with that guild. Then 1-2 people started giving me problems. Now I know why.

Thanks guys.

pinnacle2009
08-19-2010, 01:48 PM
Any tips on breaking the habit of being a clicker? lol

Harmacy
08-19-2010, 05:58 PM
Any tips on breaking the habit of being a clicker? lol

There's really no way to stop except for binding your keys and diving in. Unfortunately there's no training wheels involved :-(

I just set my 6 keys (HotR ShoR) to the R and F keys, and the 9 keys (Cons, HS, Judg) to 2 3 and 4. This keeps the two sets distinct in my mind, helps cut down on the random button mashing a bit. Your mileage may vary.

I'm still working on keyboard turning, it's a habit I've been unable to break except for absolute life-or-death situations like Sindragosa or what-have-you.

pinnacle2009
08-22-2010, 03:02 PM
http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/

New log. This reflects me trying keybindings and mouse turning. I am not sure how to review my skill list so I am not sure if I used the right rotation again. I have them set up on my action bar correctly. Just not totally sure if I am doing it right yet..

Lumines
08-23-2010, 01:59 AM
I am not sure if I used the right rotation again. I have them set up on my action bar correctly. Just not totally sure if I am doing it right yet..

You're not.

You have repeating patterns of:

[12:07:06.473] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Judgement of Wisdom (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/53408/?s=782&e=1051) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/23/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:08.135] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/61411/?s=782&e=1051) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/23/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:09.799] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Holy Shield (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/48952/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:11.374] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/53595/?s=782&e=1051) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/23/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:13.099] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Consecration (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/48819/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:14.713] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Judgement of Wisdom (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/53408/?s=782&e=1051) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/23/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:16.582] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/61411/?s=782&e=1051) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/23/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:17.978] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Holy Shield (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/48952/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:19.775] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/53595/?s=782&e=1051) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/23/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:21.422] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Consecration (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/48819/?s=782&e=1051)
[12:07:22.978] Logikal (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/6/?s=782&e=1051) casts Judgement of Wisdom (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/spell/53408/?s=782&e=1051) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-re6gzz2yg85ho3yv/details/23/?s=782&e=1051)

You're doing 9696996, not 969. I don't know how to state it other than alternate a 6 second cooldown with a 9 second cooldown. ShoR and HotR are 6s. Cons, Judgement and HS are 9s. Never cast two 6s back to back (except maybe on the pull for solid snap aggro, but that's more advanced than where you are just now). Never cast two 9s back to back. If you're going it correctly, you use every GCD seamlessly and are never waiting on a cooldown. Never "go back to the beginning" - it doesn't work that way. There is no beginning.

That sequence should have been J, ShoR, HS, HotR, Cons, ShoR. You had ShoR available but pressed Judgement instead, pushing back the effective cooldown on your highest/second highest (depends on stats, haven't checked yours) ability, and hence doing lower threat and DPS. You want your rotation to look like this:

[18:27:57.430] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/53595/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:27:59.115] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Judgement of Wisdom (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/53408/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:00.531] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/61411/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:02.011] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Consecration (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/48819/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:03.772] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/53595/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:05.234] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Holy Shield (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/48952/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:06.922] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/61411/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:08.447] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Judgement of Wisdom (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/53408/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:10.043] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/53595/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:11.682] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Consecration (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/48819/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:13.069] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/61411/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:14.621] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Holy Shield (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/48952/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:16.246] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Hammer of the Righteous (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/53595/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:17.975] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Judgement of Wisdom (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/53408/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:19.403] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Shield of Righteousness (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/61411/?s=91&e=297) on Lord Marrowgar (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/30/?s=91&e=297)
[18:28:20.963] http://worldoflogs.com/media/images/icons/transparant.png Lumines (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/details/0/?s=91&e=297) casts Consecration (http://worldoflogs.com/reports/j5h4l88vcfahk4tu/spell/48819/?s=91&e=297)

Except preferably without the ~6.2 seconds between HotR and ShoR casts (wireless and lag induced). EDIT to clarify - I have gaps of 6.2s where the lag-free, human error-free space would be 6s. My gap between subsequent abilities is ~1.7s where, again, you'd prefer 1.5s.

pinnacle2009
08-23-2010, 05:10 AM
Ohhhhhhkay. I know exactly how I can fix that. That seems like an improvement from before but yea lol

I'll just add a 2nd SHoR to the action bar and see if that fixes it.

pinnacle2009
08-23-2010, 05:32 AM
oh, how do you get to that info in worldoflogs? Every time I look I just can't find it. I just think from this point on I should be checking the rotation myself instead of coming on here everytime I get a new log lol

Lythac
08-23-2010, 05:35 AM
It is unlikely adding a 2nd ShoR will help you. 969 repeats itself over 12 GCDS/18 secs, with 3 ShoR, 3 HotR, 2 Conc, 2 HS and 2 Judgements being cast.

This video may be useful - Protection Paladin TPS / DPS Tanking Rotation 969 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZyOoMKtREI). In that setup the 6s are separated from the 9s. Another simple option is to have the 6s on the bar above the 9s.

pinnacle2009
08-23-2010, 05:39 AM
Would making a macro work? One that casts SHoR if HoR is on cooldown and vice versa.

Lumines
08-23-2010, 06:00 AM
I'll just add a 2nd SHoR to the action bar and see if that fixes it.

I might be way off, but that suggests to me that you're putting them on so you can click them in order? That's a band-aid fix (what goes after ShoR in that case? Think about that and you'll see why it doesn't fix your problem). You should really get used to keybinds for a long term solution. What Lythac said, basically.


oh, how do you get to that info in worldoflogs?

From the top menu, Full Report --> Kills --> pick a fight you're interested in. Marrowgar, Saurfang, Festergut, Rotface (if you're on the boss), Blood Princes (if you're not on Keleseth), Blood Queen etc. have periods in which you're standing still and just churning through your rotation.

From there, Dashboard (on the top menu) --> Log Browser.

Remove the initial query, click "Add Query". You want to check "Spell cast" and add your character's name in "Source".

(Alternatively, add "Hammer of the Righteous" to the "Spell" box to see what the gap between HotRs is).

Click "Save", and then "Run". Voila.


Would making a macro work? One that casts SHoR if HoR is on cooldown and vice versa.

You could do this with a /castsequence macro. But I really wouldn't, because it's a poor substitute for simply learning your rotation. It's 5 abilities, the order of which are set in stone after you do the first 4. After that point you just use the one (the only one) that's off cooldown. It isn't complicated, and doing it correctly for a short while with decent keybinds will leave you able to tank through muscle memory. Macroing your rotation can work well as long as it's not a substitute for not knowing what to do in the first place (and as long as you have resets or modifiers in there so you can choose what to cast - e.g. Blood Queen has gone up to air phase, or has buggered off across the room to bite someone; you have to be able to adapt to those situations).

Glorc
08-23-2010, 07:54 AM
As Harm pointed out the only way to get into keybinding is to dive in at this point.
Some helpful setups might be putting your 9's on the scroll up and down of your mouse. Change zoom in zoom out to page up page down . click the chat log buttons if ya need to scroll it.
Q E Z V B ~ X are all very very close to your movement keys and nothing that cant be moved around
Side Buttons on your mouse if you have a 5 button mouse. If you dont have a 5 button mouse i highly recommend one.

Find some commonality between characters if you play alts to make key binding easier.
Charge on a warrior turns into blink on a mage
Counter spell on the mage turns into kick on the rogue
Gouge on the rogue turns into Hammer of judgment
Consecrate on the pally turns into Death and Decay on the DK
etc etc etc..
Same keys across my characters help
Pallys have 2 taunts So Consider a Shift modifier lets say Q = Single taunt Shift Q = multi taunt

In the end it takes awhile to get used to keybinds but they are very much worth it at the end of the day. Do what you are comfortable with. but clicking takes you out of the moment, looking all round you instead of at your hotbars is so much more fun and worth the trouble.
I do not play a pally but ill give you my warriors set up
Q= Taunt
E= Shield Bash
Z= Charge/Intercept/Intervene cast sequence macro + friendly target for intervene
V= Cleave
B= Bloodrage / Zerker rage cast sequence macro
~= Shield wall
X= Last Stand
Side mouse 1 = Auto run Sorry 2 button mouse run sucks for me but still use it from time to time
Side mouse 2 = Thunderclap
Shift+Side mouse 2 = Demo Shout
Scroll up = Concussion Blow
Scroll down= Spell Reflect or Relevant trinket / Sometimes Rend
Center Mouse = Push to talk

For gunship i usually drop health stone off my bars stick shield bash over there and put Jet pack on my interrupt key as there is nothing to interrupt on that fight.

Its well worth the trouble, but it is a hassle. And nothing says you cant keep them on your bars and key bind around them, you may find moving key bound stuff off the 1 2 3 4 5 6 keys helpful though.

pinnacle2009
08-23-2010, 12:36 PM
I might be way off, but that suggests to me that you're putting them on so you can click them in order? That's a band-aid fix (what goes after ShoR in that case? Think about that and you'll see why it doesn't fix your problem). You should really get used to keybinds for a long term solution. What Lythac said, basically.


Not to click, just as a visual.




I've got the keybindings down I believe. The way I did it was I replaced movement from my keyboard almost entirely. The only thing I do on my keyboard that involves moving is to back up. I move completely with the mouse. My two side buttons are strafe.

I am using Q, W, E, A, S, D, ~, 1, Z, and X with spells. V is what I use to move backwards with. So far, I have found I don't need anything more with my pally. I also have my taunt on middle mouse click and DP and AW on the wheel turns.

At first I thought this setup would restrict me in PvP, but from I've noticed, its helped quite a bit.