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Gid101
08-13-2010, 01:36 AM
Hello,

I just had a quick question for all you theory crafters out there.
Why is it that the Ashen band of Vengeance is so much better then the Ashen band of Might?
Iv looked at the difference and it's 1.28% crit vs. 100 AP. Is the crit worth that much?

Im sorry if this has been explained before, if so, please link the other post. If there isn't one, then would someone be kind enough to explain the math behind this?

Thank you again,
A nub warrior

PatrikL
08-13-2010, 05:47 AM
Don't know anything about warriors but from what I understand (and did a quick rawr on) the Endless Might is better than Vengeance for DKs. Are you sure it actually is better? Asking since I saw some discussions before it was introduced but not sure we had the right stats then.

Loganisis
08-13-2010, 06:50 AM
Here's my understanding of it. Guys with better math, please let me know if I screw this up.

100 AP / 14 = ~7.1 DPS per swing (constant)

ON AVERAGE, 1 crit per 78 swings (100/1.28 so you'll receive an extra crit every 78 swing ON AVERAGE not a given) = say 2000 extra damage (lower end ICC gear) between a normal and a crit = 2000/78 = 25.6 DPS per swing (average, RNG, meaning sometimes more sometimes less, sometimes none in a boss fight)

So while it's not a given in any particular fight that the crit will make your DPS better than the str ring, on average, over time, the agility ring will give you more DPS.

Erkebrand
08-13-2010, 07:40 AM
found the mathy explanation on EJ for you - note the stats used are outdated(as the original stats were nerfed abit iirc) but the principle of 4 stats vs 5 stat items still rules.

The STR ring provides 103 STR, 107 STA, 59 Hit, 59 Crit and the AP proc (if you gem for the socket bonus) plus the effects of an Orange gem. The AGI ring provides 92 AGI, 84 STA, 135 AP, 59 Hit, 59 Crit and the AP proc (if you gem for the socket bonus) plus the effects of an Orange gem. Canceling each side out to find the differences, and it's 103 STR vs. 92 AGI, 135 AP.

103 STR works out to 271.92 AP when you factor in Blessing of Kings and Imp. Berserker Stance. 92 AGI works out to 1.62% crit when you factor in Blessing of Kings. Subtract out the 135 AP the AGI ring provides and it's ~137 AP vs. 1.62% crit, or ~137 AP vs. 74.37 Crit Rating. Working back even further to convert that AP into what it would look like written as Strength, it's 51 STR vs. 74.37 Crit Rating.

It's not even a contest. Crit Rating is actually valued slightly higher than STR at higher gear levels before the crit softcap, which makes it even more imbalanced, but at no level of gearing is Crit valued at less than ~.7 SEP - which is what you would need it to be for the STR ring to win out. The only advantage the STR ring has is a marginally higher amount of Stamina, which is just plain not required for Warriors of all people.

The reasons for this massive stat imbalance are somewhat technical, dealing with the way item budgets interact with the number of stats on an item (the more of any one stat, the more it 'costs' from the item budget - meaning that items with 5 stats have a far higher stat total than items with 4). Adding up all the non-Stamina stats the Agility ring provides (and recognizing that it's 2 AP per 'point') and we get a total of 277.5. Adding up all the non-Stamina stats the STR ring provides and we get a total of only 221; the difference in effectiveness between AGI/AP and STR is just not high enough to compensate for that huge of a stat difference. The saving grace of most 4-stat items is that they provide a higher bonus to the two extra stats they provide, in this case Hit and Crit, and that just doesn't happen here.