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View Full Version : Death Knight With the 30% buff causing threat issues.



Carterhova
07-26-2010, 08:07 AM
Recently with the release of the 30% buff into ICC I have begun to have some threat issues in ICC and RS both 10 and 25m. Usually I have never needed tricks of the trade or misdirects to help build threat and keep it. Has anyone else been having these issues?

Here is my armory link: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Arthas&cn=Carterhova

I don't think I am really doing anything wrong gearing wise, except my low hit rating and high expertise that is on my gear.

MellvarTank
07-26-2010, 08:14 AM
I didn't think Ruby Sanctum had the damage buff, which basically means you should check out your rotation and gearing selection. (ie. Time to build a threat set)

Carterhova
07-26-2010, 08:32 AM
Threat set meaning above the 26 expertise soft cap and I'm going to assume include more than 47 hit rating...?

MellvarTank
07-26-2010, 08:37 AM
And dps pieces such as boots, trinkets and anything else you can sacrifice without getting gibbed.

Aggathon
07-26-2010, 08:41 AM
idk, he already has a TON of expertise, I'd say that's as close to a threat set as you can get, heh.

Bashal
07-26-2010, 08:44 AM
Our tanks in ICC tend not to have threat issues, but then again, our hunters and rogues always MD on pulls, and our DPS doesn't nuke full-bore right at the pull. We usually give the tanks about 5 seconds to get settled, can even blow heroism/bloodlust after the first 5 seconds and the tanks keep threat.

My point is, a smart group works with the tanks, not against them. It's possible you have some folks who aren't being...helpful.

Dreadski
07-26-2010, 08:45 AM
I don't see how you are having threat issues now that there's 30% but you weren't when there was a 25% buff? 5%?

turoktwo
07-26-2010, 08:59 AM
well, the only thing i'd say for a dk tank, is build a bit more expertice, mine as a tank is dubble what it should be, and i hold when the raid goes full bore on a trash pull, and i always pop dnd to hold argo.
just be sure you have some cd's pooped when you pull

Insahnity
07-26-2010, 09:11 AM
I fail to see what the buff has to do with anything. If their DPS went up by 5%, so did your threat. There is no mystical bubble which prevents you from getting the same damage (and therefore threat) bonus. This is why you have the same problem in RS10.

If you really, truly believe in your head that the buff is causing you grieve, quaff an endless rage flask instead of Stoneskin. With a 30%, a stoneskin flask is moot (each 5% is More than a single flask, and by a fair margin). The Endless rage flask will also benefit from 30% boost, which in turn is magnified by your frost presence threat multiplier.

Bigbad
07-26-2010, 09:26 AM
every 5% buff is about 3k more hp on my warrior the same as a stam trinket. Just switch 1 trinket in for deathbringer's will or something else.

Fledern
07-26-2010, 09:27 AM
DK tank shouldnt suffer that much. Otoh, as a warrior tank, i can see dps coming closer & closer every buff. With more than 75% of our threat coming from static threat modifiers, the buff is starting to catch up. With a good raid, proper vigilancing, dps playing intelligently, ofc it's still not a problem. But with a raid with no hunters/rogues and multiple "i is aws0m, i can haz 25K crit" dps, threat does become a problem. (previously, a good burst of initial threat could help me race them, now it's a coin toss)

As a DK though, with the superduperoverpoweredmegathreatofdoom icy touch, you really shouldnt be complaining. I've yet to see people pull off anything with a double tap of icy touch on it.

Creelos
07-26-2010, 05:29 PM
D

superduperoverpoweredmegathreatofdoom icy touch

I tank a normal ICC 10 for my guild mates that are not part of our core raid on my DK. I don't even use plague strike in my rotation unless I am setting up for a full heal on DS. ie as Blistering Cold hits and AmS is on CD. And the amount of threat makes me die a little inside since I have mained a warrior for almost six years now.

The point of that is not " LOOK AT ME, MY EPEENIS IS SO HUGE" it is to make the point that I don't play DK as my main but have some relevant experience with it.

So with that in mind my thoughts on it would be if you are lacking threat, and your rotation is spot on, dump some of that expertise for hit since AFAIK Icy Touch counts as ranged and is only affected by hit.

The quote is because the superduper...is epic win and I felt it needed to be repeated : )

latormenta
07-26-2010, 09:22 PM
Correct me if I am wrong which i am sure someone will be all to glad to do. But isnt a Blood tank's main focus of gaining threat through physical damage. I am a frost tank and I have not seen any issues with having to race or overcome threat problems posed by the Dps in the groups i have been in. If in fact, a blood dk's main threat generation is from physical damage and dps, then of course the 30% buff to the raid is going to hinder his threat generation because the dps is geared for dps and there fore doing even more where as the blood tank is geared for survival and the same 5% bonus to him will be greatly smaller in his dps stats than that same 5% bonus to a mage or rogue, and there fore making him do a larger percentage less than those geared dps'ers he has in his group with that same 5% bonus, Is that not true. If I am geared to do all out dps and i get a 5% buff then my dps will increase because all of my stats are geared toward generating dps, so that same 5% bonus isnt going to push his damage stats that much higher, in relation to mine to keep up with me to do enough damage to keep me from over running his threat. If i am completely off the mark here please let me know, I welcome the chance to learn all i can.

Insahnity
07-26-2010, 10:17 PM
Regardless of frost or blood tanking, it really doesn't matter. If the DPS damage goes up by 5%, then so does the tank's DPS. Although there are some innate threat abilities which won't get boosted by buff, it isn't the bulk of your TPS.

Referring to http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?40485-Death-Knight-threat-values , you can see that the only ability that has a non-scaling threat component is Scourge Strike, and I don't see any Unholy Tanks QQing in here.

Honestly, referring to http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?39775-wow-3-0-threat-values , you can see warriors have more reason to QQ than you DKs, as they have more non-scaling static threat values than you do (SheildSlam and Sunder armor, which comes with devastate). Even then, they can probably start using more DPS moves like revenge to compensate, and do fun stuff like using a slow DPS weapon.

If your rotation needs work, but the DPS rotation is doing well, they will outpace you, and perhaps that is what you are observing. That means sharpen your tanking skills and get your game on.

turoktwo
10-18-2010, 07:38 PM
one of the major was to build argo at the first trash pool is dnd, that and icy touch, spam that when there up and do what you'd be doing as a blood tank, just be sure your up for the task.

Prexie
10-19-2010, 06:47 PM
one of the major was to build argo at the first trash pool is dnd, that and icy touch, spam that when there up and do what you'd be doing as a blood tank, just be sure your up for the task.

You bumped a 3 month old thread to contribute inaccurate and poorly worded advice.

Icy touch spam is no longer one of our optimal means of threat gen.