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View Full Version : having some issues with aggro and people say im not gemmed right for a warrior tank



Wisedwarf
07-22-2010, 06:53 AM
hi, i have been tanking for a very long time and i still do have some aggro issues people say that i don't have the hit cap. and they say i should not spam solid majestic zircon. but some of them say its a bad idea. i do need help which one is the right one for gemming and how do i solve this issue regarding my aggro. here is my link on my toon

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Aggramar&cn=Leandre

thank you so much in advance.

Martie
07-22-2010, 07:08 AM
Where do you have aggro issues? (5, 10 and 25 are hugely different in that regard, as is what you are fighting.)

Looking over your gemming, I see that you have way too many nonstamina gems in there. You should consider going for 9 stamina socket bonuses, but when getting 6 stamina per offcolor gem, you wanna spam more majestic Zircons. Your hit is over the melee cap right now, so that's definatly too much.
Even if you don't want to spam stam, you should take dual color stam/somethingelse gems.

The best tip I can give you without going into detail is using marks. Put a skull on a mob so people kill it first.

Yobi1Kanobi
07-22-2010, 08:04 AM
My Warrior tank seems to be less geared than you are. And I gem gear for EH. Your talent build seems to be a bit off though. And what are you having issues with MOBs or bosses. I occasionally lose a single target to a DPS if the DPS is over DPSing a single target in that mob but thats it. I can usually peel targets off even my OT.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Blackwater+Raiders&cn=Dahiarian

MellvarTank
07-22-2010, 08:12 AM
Can you give us a rundown of what abilities you use in what sequence?

Kyoki
07-22-2010, 08:15 AM
you have impale but no deep wounds, why?


If you regemmed stam you would gain almost 3k health, that a pretty big difference. The expertise gems are not going to help your threat much but changing your spec and rotation will vastly improve threat. Your way over the melee hit cap so definatly ditching those hit gems will help. Look at aggs prot warrior guide for your spec and rotation.

Infantry_11b
07-22-2010, 10:04 AM
Here are a few posts that will help with your overall effectiveness as a Protection Warrior:

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http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?65700-Expertise-Hit-and-your-Threat.-What-it-means-to-all-Tanks.-%28Current-for-3.3.3%29

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Originally Posted by Dreador
"If your threat is bad, more threat stats are not going to make it better; you'll be a bad tank with a lot of expertise. Threat is fundamentally based on playstyle (kids, that means how you press your buttons). This means your rotation better be tight, your spec better be in line (this means glyphs too), and your raid (whether or not you carry tards and downies) better understand how to use MD and ToT on the tank when first pulling a boss. Without these fundamental elements, your locks, shaman, hunters, DKs, furies, ferals, mages and priests are going to constantly pull off you. Knowing how to build threat as a tank with gear that guarantees low rage, with little to no threat stats and with no rogues or hunters that know what's what is what defines a tank. The movement, taunting and using cooldowns at the right time, that's for everyone. Threat is ours alone, learn how to generate it well and you'll never have an issue."
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and from here you can read Aggathon's EH post for ICC progression

http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?66564-Why-We-Do-What-We-Do-%28An-in-depth-explanation-of-EHP-and-ICC-3.3.3-tanking-mechanics%29

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Basically, threat comes from specing right and using the correct rotation/priority. After that, using a hunter's MD/rogue's Tricks. Then after all that, you have mastered your rotation and have MD and Tricks on you, then its up to the DPS to watch their own threat and be sure to use their own abilities to wipe their threat or slow up on DPS.

bluntobject
07-22-2010, 10:11 AM
Having a faster weapon might help you get more heroic strikes in for smoother threat gain. It has been said time and time again on here that threat issues are not from low hit or expertise, but from poor rotation execution. See the llink below for a guide to tanking and footnote 2 has advice on fixing threat issues.

http://http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?60155-Agg-s-Prot-War-Tanking-Guide

I think most everyone here is in agreement that you should be gearing/enchanting/gemming for effective health. I'm going to make some suggestions for you gearing/enchanting/gemming.

Gemming - Other than the red gem in your helm change them all to +30 stam gems, once you get the rotation down you will not need the excess hit/expertise and will see better survivability.

Enchants -
Shoulders - Pick up the 30 stam 15 res enchant, sold in SW by the pvp gear vendors for 10k rep

Cloak - swap to the armor enchant

Chest - 275 health is superior for tanks

Bracers - +40 to stam

Weapon - When you get a tanking weapon get blood draining on it

Shield - +18 stam is the way to go, just solo a BC heroic to get greens to DE for the mats if they are hard to some by on your server

Gloves - Stam or Armor are better choices for this, parry isn't that useful and rotation will fix your threat issues

Gear-
Weapon - Get a legit tanking weapon a slow dps weapon won't fix your dps issues and using one of the 10 man tanking weapons will net your 500ish health

Trinkets - The corpse tongue coin is a pretty weak choice in this slot, the black heart or glyph of indomibility are much better and easy to obtain replacements.

Neck - I'm making a wild guess that you have dropped to a lower neck for the hit, once again armor and stam are going to be the way to go, so if you have the scratching choker go back to it.

Bracers - If you have or can get the bracers from saurfang 10 they are going to be better for most fights than the 25 man icc bracers. If you havn't seen them I feel your pain 20 kills and still no drops.

Hope this helps, reading the full link above will help. It's also a great link to send the naysayers that think you need to be gemmed and enchanted for hit/expertise.

Wisedwarf
07-22-2010, 01:45 PM
thank you so much for your reply guys. ill answer each of your questions.

Martie : ALWAYS on PP i loose the slim. every time i OT it i always loose the slim.
Yobi1Kanobi : When it comes to mobs. i do lose like 4 or mobs with the OT tank.
MellvarTank : Rotation (with mobs) charge, thunderclap, cleave, shockwave (once i have them all), devistate 5 times, heroic strike, POP all thunderclap, bash, shield slam when able to use.
Kyoki : you do have a point there. i copied my spec on some warrior tank who stole aggro from this pali tank. on an icc. and he was doing great doing 4k - 5k dps as a tank so i copied his build.

thank you so much for the reply guys. really thanks a lot!

Dekar
07-22-2010, 02:22 PM
Martie : ALWAYS on PP i loose the slim. every time i OT it i always loose the slim.

That's because you don't tank the slimes on Putricide. The green one will randomly pick a target and immobilize it until it either dies or hits the target. The orange slime picks a random target and must be kited and not let it hit you.

The only reason I can think of that would make you think you're losing aggro on slimes is, if you're the abom (you said you were OT so I'm assuming you're the abom) and you're right there as the slime spawns, you can melee it and it will target you for a few seconds before picking its random target. When my old guild was progressing through putricide on 25m way back in the beginning of the year, I tried to do this every chance I could to give the dps a few more seconds of burn time before the slimes did their mechanics.

Wisedwarf
07-22-2010, 04:58 PM
That's because you don't tank the slimes on Putricide. The green one will randomly pick a target and immobilize it until it either dies or hits the target. The orange slime picks a random target and must be kited and not let it hit you.

The only reason I can think of that would make you think you're losing aggro on slimes is, if you're the abom (you said you were OT so I'm assuming you're the abom) and you're right there as the slime spawns, you can melee it and it will target you for a few seconds before picking its random target. When my old guild was progressing through putricide on 25m way back in the beginning of the year, I tried to do this every chance I could to give the dps a few more seconds of burn time before the slimes did their mechanics.

sorry may bad! not PP! LOL its Rotface! there we go sorry bout that

Dekar
07-22-2010, 08:56 PM
sorry may bad! not PP! LOL its Rotface! there we go sorry bout that

Well that makes more sense lol. And yeah, Rotface as a warrior isn't easy. It's doable, but it takes a lot of practice and it's easier for every other tank class to do it so I suggest if you're having trouble, get another tank to do it.

uglybbtoo
07-22-2010, 10:15 PM
ALWAYS on PP i loose the slim. every time i OT it i always loose the slim.


How do you lose it as its tauntable? ... Taunt matches your threat to highest and heroic throw now your good for a while till next taunt.



Yobi1Kanobi : When it comes to mobs. i do lose like 4 or mobs with the OT tank.
MellvarTank : Rotation (with mobs) charge, thunderclap, cleave, shockwave (once i have them all), devistate 5 times, heroic strike, POP all thunderclap, bash, shield slam when able to use.


You have no hope of holding a group to a good OT with cleave whilst useful as dps boost and holding stuff in like heroics it wont work on mobs that stay up a while it's threat is too low. Learn to tab target thru the mobs and use your priority high threat moves SS/revenge/devestate. If you get to a mob first which you should with your charge there is no way any OT should be able to take them off you without taunting as warrior threat is quite high compared to other tanks. I get complaints from pally's all the time that I have all the mobs apparently there is a myth warriors can't aoe tank.



Kyoki : you do have a point there. i copied my spec on some warrior tank who stole aggro from this pali tank. on an icc. and he was doing great doing 4k - 5k dps as a tank so i copied his build.


IMO his spec wasn't why he was great he knows how to do the tab thing :-)

The spec is average IMO but it was working for him and thats fair enuf there is alot of flex in warrior tanking much more than any other class. You aren't as comfortable I would suggest staying with the cookie cutter deep wounds build as it does help alot with AOE tanking till you have it down to an art.

Wisedwarf
07-23-2010, 01:02 AM
i did ask him and he said. "oh! yeah! i do the tab thing dont you?" and i said.. @#$%! XP

Sirloinsteak
07-23-2010, 01:45 AM
hi, i have been tanking for a very long time and i still do have some aggro issues people say that i don't have the hit cap. and they say i should not spam solid majestic zircon. but some of them say its a bad idea. i do need help which one is the right one for gemming and how do i solve this issue regarding my aggro. here is my link on my toon

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Aggramar&cn=Leandre

thank you so much in advance.

Easy mode warrior tanking .... do what i set out here and you'll never have a problem again

#showtooltip Devastate(Rank 5)
/cast Devastate(Rank 5)
/cast Heroic Strike(Rank 13)

copy and paste that into the macro section and assign whatever pic u want to it (this will even work for a clicker) make sure u have the glyph of devastate and the glyph of heroic strike ... basicly spam it as much as u can, only ever stop spaming that macro when something else comes off cool down then straight back to spamming it (tbh you can actually hold threat off most dps by spamming that macro alone) but literally spam it don't wait for gcd just spam the hell out of it ... i guarantee that will work (a good intro into key binding is to bind this to 1 or 2 and just spam that all raid and use your other key binds to hit your sword and board procs and shield slams and revenges and shockwaves ... whatever is easier for you ... trust me this will work have fun ...

so basically if you bind this to your 1 or 2 buttons your rotation after the shield block shield slam/shockwave opener (assuming you bind the macro to 2 for demonstrations sake and 1 as all your other abilities) 22222222122222122222221222222211222 2. As i said before ... usually just spamming 2 alone would hold threat.


So change your glyph of shockwave to glyph of heroic strike.


change your spec ... its not very good tbh, most of it is ok ... easiest way to fix it is ...

1) Remove the 3 points from Focused rage and the 5 points from cruelty, giving you 8 free points.
2) With those 8 free points place 3 points in improved heroic strike, 2 points in impale and 3 points in deeps wounds then if you have followed what i said above you will never ever have threat problems again.

ok with the gemming and enchant part of your gear here are some pro tips. (for ICC tanking you want to focus on EH)

1) Helm (parry gem very very bad) use a 10 agi / 15 stam gem in it period.
2) Shoulders, Change out that rep enchant for the 30 stam 15 resil from pvp vendor
3) Cloak, 225 armor enchant
4) Chest, 275 HP enchant
5) Gloves, remove threat / parry enchant (its terrible) get the 18 stam armor kit
6) Shield, get 18 stam enchant
7) Weapon, donno what you have as you have gut buster or something in there now, but make sure it has mongoose on it.

your way way over in the hit department, depending on what gear set i use my hit is anywhere between 80 and 150 and i never have threat problems, your expertise is low and you should try and get it a bit higher ... but it shouldn't effect your threat to harshly if you stick to what i said above and use your proper priority ability listing.

Devilkuerk
07-23-2010, 04:40 AM
Well that makes more sense lol. And yeah, Rotface as a warrior isn't easy. It's doable, but it takes a lot of practice and it's easier for every other tank class to do it so I suggest if you're having trouble, get another tank to do it.

Tanking the slim by rotface encounter is very easy for a warri. The only thing you have to do is put vigilance on a strong group heal, like shami or druid. Thats 75% of your needed threat the rest comes from a good timing. When the slim is coming up (in this moment he do not any damage) shield slam him and then get away. Thats all and you will not lose the threat.