PDA

View Full Version : The BFF Report -- Heroes of Newerth vs League of Legends



Ciderhelm
05-26-2010, 11:38 PM
hMZwgeG%2BLgI%2Em4v

Click here for more episodes of the BFF Report! (http://www.zam.com/bffreport)
Check out Mike (http://twitter.com/iamthemikeb) and Zam (http://twitter.com/zamnetwork) on Twitter!
Subscribe to Mike's YouTube channel (http://youtube.com/wowfony) for regular updates.

Ciderhelm
05-26-2010, 11:55 PM
Heroes of Newerth for LIFE.

LoL is lulz.

Bluedot
05-27-2010, 12:14 AM
Heroes of Newerth for LIFE.

LoL is lulz.

Chamenas
05-27-2010, 12:21 AM
None of the above?

SiS Feeder
05-27-2010, 06:31 AM
If your a Hardcore Gamer, you'll like HoN...
If your a Gamer, you'll like LoL
If your a Idiot and don't like tu change... you'll keep on playin DotA... for the next 20 years and so...

Kazeyonoma
05-27-2010, 09:48 AM
Heroes of Newerth for LIFE.

LoL is lulz.

Lakshata
05-27-2010, 12:45 PM
Never played LoL, only played HoN.

so yeah...

Khue
05-27-2010, 03:07 PM
I thought the video was pretty good. He hit a lot of the positives about LoL. I felt like he kind of painted LoL in a more positive light then it deserves. I love the game and I even picked up on it. He even completely neglected to mention the TERRIBLE availability of the game. It's constantly down during prime hours. I suspect that their developers push stuff into production late day PST around 5pm and then just go home. Completely kills playable hours for EST patrons. Sidenote about LoL: NO ONE... uses RP to buy heros. RP is for skins.

How about from the HoN side of things? How was the overview? Pretty good? Game does look pretty polished. I also like all of the out of game services.

Kazeyonoma
05-27-2010, 03:41 PM
the biggest thing about HoN is the steep learning curve, there is no "easing" into the game, you get thrown right into the game, and sure you may not be a 1700 rated player at first but you might as well be because everyone on the team is counting on you to be awesome. They just have different styles of play, the graphics on LoL seem to have been more polished than my initial screenshots.

Khue
05-27-2010, 04:00 PM
Yeah, and they've made some UI adjustments too. It's still not near the quality of HoN but I think that's the sacrifice you get when you run off of Adobe AIR.

Papapaint
05-27-2010, 04:08 PM
the biggest thing about HoN is the steep learning curve, there is no "easing" into the game, you get thrown right into the game, and sure you may not be a 1700 rated player at first but you might as well be because everyone on the team is counting on you to be awesome. They just have different styles of play, the graphics on LoL seem to have been more polished than my initial screenshots.

To be fair, LoL at high-level play is an ENTIRELY different experience than low-level. Getting into high-level games is a really harsh learning curve.

mero12513
05-27-2010, 04:21 PM
I have two problems with this genre as a whole:

The learning curve is obviously one of them. Even if you were excellent at DotA, LoL is extremely difficult at first simply because you don't know what every hero and every item does.
I'm personally of the opinion that LoL's RPG-style summoner system is a springboard for fixing this glaring flaw. In the same way that you start with very few abilities and almost no items in WoW, only a couple of heroes and items should be available for players who have just picked up a new game. When you level up outside of each individual game instance, you move up in ladders, unlocking more heroes and items. Each level adds complexity and depth, but allows you to learn new content inside the game at the same rate that people you play with, so you aren't overwhelmed at the outset.

My other problem with the genre is the positive feedback nature in conjunction with the length of many games. Often, 30-minute or hour-long games are decided within the first 5 or 10 minutes, and the rest of the game is spent playing an inevitably unsuccessful game of catch-up. While come-from-behind victories do occasionally happen, they are pretty rare. There's also the awful feeling of helplessness when your allies allow your enemies to become extra powerful quickly. Even if you have made no mistakes, you can be less than 20% through with a game and know its outcome, and your only (good) option is stay and wait patiently while you get obliterated. Leaving mid-game in this type of game is extremely hazardous to your reputation, and can (in DotA at least), get you kicked out of playing semi-permanently.

Papapaint
05-27-2010, 06:37 PM
I have two problems with this genre as a whole:

The learning curve is obviously one of them. Even if you were excellent at DotA, LoL is extremely difficult at first simply because you don't know what every hero and every item does.
I'm personally of the opinion that LoL's RPG-style summoner system is a springboard for fixing this glaring flaw. In the same way that you start with very few abilities and almost no items in WoW, only a couple of heroes and items should be available for players who have just picked up a new game. When you level up outside of each individual game instance, you move up in ladders, unlocking more heroes and items. Each level adds complexity and depth, but allows you to learn new content inside the game at the same rate that people you play with, so you aren't overwhelmed at the outset.

My other problem with the genre is the positive feedback nature in conjunction with the length of many games. Often, 30-minute or hour-long games are decided within the first 5 or 10 minutes, and the rest of the game is spent playing an inevitably unsuccessful game of catch-up. While come-from-behind victories do occasionally happen, they are pretty rare. There's also the awful feeling of helplessness when your allies allow your enemies to become extra powerful quickly. Even if you have made no mistakes, you can be less than 20% through with a game and know its outcome, and your only (good) option is stay and wait patiently while you get obliterated. Leaving mid-game in this type of game is extremely hazardous to your reputation, and can (in DotA at least), get you kicked out of playing semi-permanently.

Actually, LoL is very, very different from this (which is part of why I like it so much). In absolute worst-case scenarios, your team might be getting roflpwned if their carry gets super fed, but even that can be manageable with proper coordination. LoL is very team based--that is to say, one person very rarely can carry the team. It's also very easy to swing a game in your favor, between counterpushing a lane and ambushing their defense, baron buff, jungle control, etc. Some characters snowball better than others, but are also fairly easy to shut down.

Not trying to push the merits over HoN, i only played a little of it and enjoyed it well enough.

veneretio
05-27-2010, 07:45 PM
Actually, LoL is very, very different from this (which is part of why I like it so much). In absolute worst-case scenarios, your team might be getting roflpwned if their carry gets super fed, but even that can be manageable with proper coordination. LoL is very team based--that is to say, one person very rarely can carry the team. It's also very easy to swing a game in your favor, between counterpushing a lane and ambushing their defense, baron buff, jungle control, etc. Some characters snowball better than others, but are also fairly easy to shut down.

Not trying to push the merits over HoN, i only played a little of it and enjoyed it well enough.
This sounds basically identical to HoN.

In regards to the genre in general, yes, it's very frustrating/unforgiving, but it's equally rewarding if you stick with it. I highly recommend finding a friend who is experienced and getting them to train you.

Kazeyonoma
05-27-2010, 10:05 PM
myself, veneretio, lore, ciderhelm, bluedot, rak, ttocs, etc to name a few on the HoN side of things.

mero12513
05-27-2010, 11:33 PM
I played DotA almost exclusively for more than 2 years. Very few moments in my gaming career since then have rivaled the epicness of some of my best memories from that. I did acceptably well enough when I played LoL to consider myself above the steepest portions of the curve, but it's still not enough make me want to go the extra mile to learn the rest.

They really are fantastic games, and have some of the best replay value of any game in existence. I'll always remember them fondly, but Starcraft II is just SO GOOD!!!

TylBronto
05-28-2010, 09:01 AM
I've played HoN only, but I'd agree with what was said above. I had a friend who recently bought HoN, and watching him learn was painful. There's a ton of things that separate good players from bad, but (unlike WoW), you don't get to wade through 80 levels, and several tiers of heroics/raiding before those little things become important.

BTW you can't really argue that HoN is different than Dota, because they're practically the same game.

I guess I'll keep playing HoN out of familiarity, and also because if I wanted to play a progression game, I'd go play WoW (I'm not a fan of level up systems outside of MMOs). I like HoN because when I enter the map, I'm on equal footing. Also, I like that team composition matters in HoN, even if it is often the bane of my existence at lower ratings.

Santah
05-28-2010, 03:58 PM
I do agree with the downtime on LoL was very annoying but I like LoL more than hon. The shop in Hon is terrible. It's worse than the dota store which was pretty bad. I did like the voice for hon, but the constant "denied" was very annoying. Oh yea and creep denying i always hated on top of losing money when you died. i also like the fact that you can tell who is on your team in LoL. I haven't played Hon in awhile so maybe they changed some things just saying.

Kazeyonoma
05-28-2010, 04:13 PM
denying is just another aspect of the game, while it doesn't make a ton of "sense" lore wise, it just added more micro depth to the game, likewise suffering gold loss is part of the game for dying, everygame always makes you suffer consequences for losing except WoW....

And the shop is no worse than LoL's, you gotta click all over the place to buy stuff just the same, except the shop in LoL takes up your entire screen so you can't even do stuff while shopping like you can in HoN like controlling your lane while buying with your courier.

Lakshata
06-02-2010, 12:49 PM
I like HoN just because of how much the game can change in just a few seconds. Some Hero combinations are very annoying (Any long stun and swiftblade) though I'm sure LoL has the same kind of thing too since they're both based on Dota.

The only thing I don't like is how quickly something can kill you in the beginning, and that can completely change the game later on if someone gets fed early.