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View Full Version : Tanking Prot Warrior Max Threat Rotation - Help please



Rossit
05-23-2010, 06:38 AM
Had my first tanking experience in ICC a few nights ago and basically I sucked. My threat was no were near that of the DK tank I was with. Only have Triumph Badge gear but have all the best Crafted gear. Now have Honored ICC ring after having previously done Rep runs.

Could I get some advice from experienced Prot Warrios of the best rotation for Trash and for Single target, perhaps including builds.

I understand that this build is the recommended Threat build (http://www.wowhead.com/talent#LAM0zfZ0LZiItrx0d0dIzsGo).

Really appreciate any help you could provide. I've searched the various forums some advice I found was dated 2008 so I thought perhaps not a good thread to follow.

Here's my char (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Aman%27Thul&cn=Zipzamzoom)


Thanks Guys

nserafini
05-23-2010, 07:25 AM
read this , it's up to date and should help you 10 fold

Agg's Guide To Prot (http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?60155-aggs-prot-war-tanking-guide)

Dreadski
05-23-2010, 10:21 AM
I understand that this build is the recommended Threat build (http://www.wowhead.com/talent#LAM0zfZ0LZiItrx0d0dIzsGo).

Really appreciate any help you could provide. I've searched the various forums some advice I found was dated 2008 so I thought perhaps not a good thread to follow.

Here's my char (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Aman%27Thul&cn=Zipzamzoom)


Thanks Guys

Where did you find that build?

THIS is the max threat build: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#LAM00fZZMItrx0didIzsGo:dcTomM

Also, read the guild that nserafini linked.

Supermonkey
05-23-2010, 10:45 AM
Your build seems to have been fixed but your glyphs need some work as well. Try this, if you are just beginning to raid tank these will help:

Major:

-Taunt
-Blocking
-Devestate

Minor:

-Bloodrage (You MUST have this one unless you have the T10 4 PC bonus, the amount of health you loose through the course of a 4 hour raid without it is SIGNIFICANT)
-Thunderclap
-Command - or- Charge -or Mocking Blow (This spot really depends on a few things. Are you raiding with another warrior? If you are and they are specd into Commanding Presence then you can skip Command. I would recommend you go Command for the moment until you get a good feel for what you will be doing.

Your gems are also a bit of a mess. No offense intended. The Guardians Dreadstone (10 Exper + 15 Stam) is fine, but the 20 Exper gems have to go. Replace them all with 30 Stam. Replace the 10 Str + 15 Stam gem in your boots with 30 Stam. Put 30 Stam in your ring. Drop the Trinks you are using, and replace them with The Black Heart from Regular ToC 5 man and the Badge armor Trink from ToC. Right now you need your frost badges for more important things than the Skeleton Key.

Drop your Defense Gems as well and enchant your shield with Defense. Go remove your bracer enchant and put 40 Stam on it. Drop 10 Stats on your chest and go with 275 HP, stats wont stack with other raid buffs to the best of my knowledge and 275 HP will give you a better overall return. You should still be defense capped drop Defense on your cloak and go with 225 Armor. Drop Stam into your shoulders.

Your rotation priority for single target raid tanking (This is debatable at points)

-Shield Slam
-Heroic Strike Spam
-Devastate (if you need threat spam devastate for a Sword & Board Proc)
-Revenge (yes I still use it)

Here is an example of what I typically do:

My priority is always Shield Slam, followed in order of importance with Revenge then Devastate. I make sure that Heroic Strike is always queued by spamming it. If I need a threat boost I will spam Devastate for a Sword & Board Proc.

On initial pull I Shield Slam followed by 3 Devastates to throw up a 5 stack of Sunder Armor. I follow that with Thunder Clap and Demoralizing Shout. I use Concussion Blow and Shockwave when I have a GCD free.

It is worth mentioning that I usually have Shield Block up if it is off CD unless I know I am about to take a hard hit then I will hold it. It helps me proc Revenge and Damage Shield and gives a threat boost on Shield Slams.

On trash try this:

Shield Slam is always my priority, making sure I never miss or delay a free Shield Slam from a Sword & Board proc is a priority (I use an addon for this). Revenge procs are my other consideration. On multiple mob trash pulls I Thunder Clap and Cleave frequently, I tab from target to target. I typically will throw a 2 stack of Sunder Armor before moving to another target, Heroic Throw on casters to bring them in Thunder Clap range Glyphing Devastate speeds up this process noticeably. I try to keep Heroic Strike queued but have to watch my rage on trash.

On initial pull I like to back up a few yards, it forces any mobs not casting to funnel in towards me. Once they are stacked I Shockwave and begin the rotation above.

As mentioned above read everything you can to get an idea of what all of us do. Most of this will come from you just grinding it out and making your mistakes.

Good Luck.

Dasverlassen
05-23-2010, 03:51 PM
I think the priority is more like
Shield slam (with shield block up) > Revenge > devastate
I'm pretty sure Devastate gives more TPS than Shield Slam if you don't have the 2pc T10 bonus

Rossit
05-24-2010, 01:41 AM
Thanks guys your all legends, really appreciate your input.

Dreadski
05-24-2010, 06:51 AM
Your build seems to have been fixed but your glyphs need some work as well. Try this, if you are just beginning to raid tank these will help:

Major:

-Taunt
-Blocking
-Devestate

Minor:

-Bloodrage (You MUST have this one unless you have the T10 4 PC bonus, the amount of health you loose through the course of a 4 hour raid without it is SIGNIFICANT)
-Thunderclap
-Command - or- Charge -or Mocking Blow (This spot really depends on a few things. Are you raiding with another warrior? If you are and they are specd into Commanding Presence then you can skip Command. I would recommend you go Command for the moment until you get a good feel for what you will be doing.

Your gems are also a bit of a mess. No offense intended. The Guardians Dreadstone (10 Exper + 15 Stam) is fine, but the 20 Exper gems have to go. Replace them all with 30 Stam. Replace the 10 Str + 15 Stam gem in your boots with 30 Stam. Put 30 Stam in your ring. Drop the Trinks you are using, and replace them with The Black Heart from Regular ToC 5 man and the Badge armor Trink from ToC. Right now you need your frost badges for more important things than the Skeleton Key.

Drop your Defense Gems as well and enchant your shield with Defense. Go remove your bracer enchant and put 40 Stam on it. Drop 10 Stats on your chest and go with 275 HP, stats wont stack with other raid buffs to the best of my knowledge and 275 HP will give you a better overall return. You should still be defense capped drop Defense on your cloak and go with 225 Armor. Drop Stam into your shoulders.

Your rotation priority for single target raid tanking (This is debatable at points)

-Shield Slam
-Heroic Strike Spam
-Devastate (if you need threat spam devastate for a Sword & Board Proc)
-Revenge (yes I still use it)

Here is an example of what I typically do:

My priority is always Shield Slam, followed in order of importance with Revenge then Devastate. I make sure that Heroic Strike is always queued by spamming it. If I need a threat boost I will spam Devastate for a Sword & Board Proc.

On initial pull I Shield Slam followed by 3 Devastates to throw up a 5 stack of Sunder Armor. I follow that with Thunder Clap and Demoralizing Shout. I use Concussion Blow and Shockwave when I have a GCD free.

It is worth mentioning that I usually have Shield Block up if it is off CD unless I know I am about to take a hard hit then I will hold it. It helps me proc Revenge and Damage Shield and gives a threat boost on Shield Slams.

On trash try this:

Shield Slam is always my priority, making sure I never miss or delay a free Shield Slam from a Sword & Board proc is a priority (I use an addon for this). Revenge procs are my other consideration. On multiple mob trash pulls I Thunder Clap and Cleave frequently, I tab from target to target. I typically will throw a 2 stack of Sunder Armor before moving to another target, Heroic Throw on casters to bring them in Thunder Clap range Glyphing Devastate speeds up this process noticeably. I try to keep Heroic Strike queued but have to watch my rage on trash.

On initial pull I like to back up a few yards, it forces any mobs not casting to funnel in towards me. Once they are stacked I Shockwave and begin the rotation above.

As mentioned above read everything you can to get an idea of what all of us do. Most of this will come from you just grinding it out and making your mistakes.

Good Luck.

I linked a build with glyphs intact, in case you didn't notice. Also, just how significant is that health over a 4 hour raid? Notsumuch.

"Holy Jeebus he lost a minuscule % of health! Quick! Someone Holy Light the tank!!!!"

Supermonkey
05-31-2010, 11:08 AM
I linked a build with glyphs intact, in case you didn't notice. Also, just how significant is that health over a 4 hour raid? Notsumuch.

"Holy Jeebus he lost a minuscule % of health! Quick! Someone Holy Light the tank!!!!"
:cool:

I did mention that some of this is debatable. Every tank is different. What I do works for me. If you disagree no need to be sarcastic.

dgen
05-31-2010, 12:35 PM
Major:

-Taunt I agree.

-Blocking I disagree. The small amounts of mitigation provided from this Glyph aren't nearly as valuable than the benefit gained from Glyph of Shield Wall.

-Devestate I agree.


Minor:

-Bloodrage (You MUST have this one unless you have the T10 4 PC bonus, the amount of health you loose through the course of a 4 hour raid without it is SIGNIFICANT)I disagree. Glyph of Charge is a lot better in my opinion, the added range helps a lot with mobility and the benefit from Glyph of Bloodrage isn't as required, in my opinion. Your point is silly too, that'd be like saying "Frost Resistance is viable for ICC25 trash, the amount of damage taken from trash mobs is VERY SIGNIFICANT."

-ThunderclapI agree.

-Command - or- Charge -or Mocking Blow (This spot really depends on a few things. Are you raiding with another warrior? If you are and they are specd into Commanding Presence then you can skip Command. I would recommend you go Command for the moment until you get a good feel for what you will be doing. I don't think anyone specs Commanding Presence for reasons regarding Commanding Shout? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.


Your gems are also a bit of a mess. No offense intended. The Guardians Dreadstone (10 Exper + 15 Stam) is fine, but the 20 Exper gems have to go. Replace them all with 30 Stam. Replace the 10 Str + 15 Stam gem in your boots with 30 Stam. Put 30 Stam in your ring. Drop the Trinks you are using, and replace them with The Black Heart from Regular ToC 5 man and the Badge armor Trink from ToC. Right now you need your frost badges for more important things than the Skeleton Key. Personally, I'd say Dodge / Stamina is more suitable than Expertise / Stamina, just 'cause threat is never a problem. 1 Misdirect & ToT from each of the Hunters and Rogues in the raid should suffice.

I don't mean to sound like a jerk, cause that's not my intention at all - just trying to help the OP as best possible.

Best of luck,

~ dgen

Supermonkey
05-31-2010, 10:34 PM
I agree.
I disagree. The small amounts of mitigation provided from this Glyph aren't nearly as valuable than the benefit gained from Glyph of Shield Wall.
I agree.
I disagree. Glyph of Charge is a lot better in my opinion, the added range helps a lot with mobility and the benefit from Glyph of Bloodrage isn't as required, in my opinion. Your point is silly too, that'd be like saying "Frost Resistance is viable for ICC25 trash, the amount of damage taken from trash mobs is VERY SIGNIFICANT."
I agree.
I don't think anyone specs Commanding Presence for reasons regarding Commanding Shout? Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Personally, I'd say Dodge / Stamina is more suitable than Expertise / Stamina, just 'cause threat is never a problem. 1 Misdirect & ToT from each of the Hunters and Rogues in the raid should suffice.

I don't mean to sound like a jerk, cause that's not my intention at all - just trying to help the OP as best possible.

Best of luck,

~ dgen


You didn't come across as a jerk in the least. On the note about you disagreeing with my thoughts on Blocking Glyph, my off spec is prot as well and I run with Taunt, Shield Wall, and Last Stand. All have their place, and I hop back and forth between encounters.

As for the note on Commanding and spec'ing into CP, you are right I need to reword that. I made it sound as though some prot warriors run with CP. I am sure some do but most of us do not.

Going back to this Glyph of Bloodrage point let me clarify. From pull to pull the amount of health saved using it does not matter and is not noticeable. But over the course of an entire raid it is a significant amount of healing saved. Does it really matter? Maybe not, but I use it because if I am in need or rage and I am being beaten on why would I want to cause myself to loose health and therefore need to be healed that amount.

Again going back to my point. Opinion is just that, opinion. If you disagree that is fine.

MellvarTank
06-01-2010, 07:25 AM
From pull to pull the amount of health saved using it does not matter and is not noticeable. But over the course of an entire raid it is a significant amount of healing saved. Does it really matter? Maybe not, but I use it because if I am in need or rage and I am being beaten on why would I want to cause myself to loose health and therefore need to be healed that amount.

I have never used bloodrage as a tank in ICC. I have never been rage-starved and charge will give you an initial amount of rage for a thunderclap. Using this, 3-6 mobs will hit you at least once if you are the first one in, and that will give you more than enough rage to do whatever. On a boss fight: Learn when NOT to heroic strike.

Also: I don't have threat issues. ;) It's all about rage management.

The Hoof
06-01-2010, 09:44 AM
I have never used bloodrage as a tank in ICC. I have never been rage-starved and charge will give you an initial amount of rage for a thunderclap. Using this, 3-6 mobs will hit you at least once if you are the first one in, and that will give you more than enough rage to do whatever. On a boss fight: Learn when NOT to heroic strike.

Also: I don't have threat issues. ;) It's all about rage management.

Honestly I don't have rage management issues in ICC. And I faceroll with a couple of macros that tie dev and HS or Cleave so I'm constantly spamming those usually. Very rarely have to worry about rage.

Loganisis
06-01-2010, 10:19 AM
Not to get someone to post the picture of beating the dead horse... but minor glyph of bloodrage is worthless. You don't use it during fights because you're sweating rage (unless you're spamming cleave - the ONLY way I've found to get low on rage in ICC is cleave spamming). And if you use it right before the start of a fight that pre-HoT thrown on you heals you back up to 100%.

Bascially if you need Glyph of Bloodrage to avoid damage, there are other things to look for first.

That being said - minor glyphs are... well pretty minor.

TC and Command shouts are given. Beyond that it's probably charge. but meh. I have battle for heroics with no/1 pally or for trash pulls when my health pool is already rediculous for the pull with 0/1 pallies. Charge is probably better but meh.

Griff
06-01-2010, 03:21 PM
THIS is the max threat build: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#LAM00f...idIzsGo:dcTomM

Couldn't you eek a little more by dropping imp disciplines and a point from focused rage and picking up 5/5 shield spec or even 2/5 cruelty. Imp disc is groovy and all but it doesn't do a lot for your threat unless you're popping recklessness/retalation during the fight?