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View Full Version : Tanking warriors takeing to much damage



ironoar
03-17-2010, 08:28 AM
I have heard alot of complaints of warriors taking to much damage and after prot warrior tanking in a crap load of raids i agree. Im deffinatly speced survivabilty and geared and gemmed that way to and still find my self takeing more damage then other tank classes in end game raids. after alot of looking into it and talking to alot of other tanks of all classes ive come to the conclusion it isnt our spec our gear or are set up it blizzard. they have given all other tanks more of what is needed for survival and continue to do so, not to mention we do 50% less dps then all other tanks. warriors are ment to be main tanks as well as druids who are given extra armor extra life the same cool downs as warriors and everything is speced for them so its not taken away by the 20% reduced dodge in icc yes its true to thous who didnt know this all ready druids do not lose 20% dodge in icc. they have decided to make the shield better for palidans then warriors and give them argent bs crusader and to top it off they give us dk tier gear and tell us to like it. forget the broken shield block stack dodge and parry so we can take away 60% of ur dodge in icc. pallys with 5k gs have better survivabilty then my 5737 gs warrior who set up totaly for survivabilty. how the hell dose the druid get more health and armor then me hello im a druid i wear leather but when i transform into bear form i have better then plate armor. the dk laughs at magic damage healz him self and dose 1500 more dps then us and has alot better panic bottons then a warrior and dont be surprised the dk tank is getting alot more help in the next patch.. blizzard get off ur butt and fix the warrior who clearly should be the best single target boss tank in the game but were not thanks blizzard

MellvarTank
03-17-2010, 08:34 AM
Not broken, QQ belongs on the official wow forums, not here.

http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?46395-Posting-Chat-Rules-READ-ME-BEFORE-POSTING

woodyman
03-17-2010, 08:47 AM
im a warrior tank and even i sigh at these we are broken posts *sigh*

Inaara
03-17-2010, 09:58 AM
undergeared/misgeared tanks takeing to much damage

Fixed. Left your spelling for flavor.

P.S. I would LOVE to see your armory sir.

Fledern
03-17-2010, 10:13 AM
ive come to the conclusion it isnt our spec our gear or are set up it blizzard.

You've reached the wrong conclusion. Spending some quality time on this site should fix your erronous conclusions

Inaara
03-17-2010, 10:15 AM
Erroneous*

ExistentialSoundandFury
03-17-2010, 10:21 AM
My main tank is my warrior, the healers I run have told me that I am one of the easiest tanks to heal, easiest in my Guild for certain. I do not use a 'high survival' spec, I use the defacto EJ spec with decent gearing choices. My biggest rule is that Armor is your friend, never underestimate what a difference it makes in smoothing your damage intake.

MrMooky
03-17-2010, 11:07 AM
If I were asking blizzard for anything as a warrior tank it would be more ways to generate AOE threat. I don't have an issue with damage I take.

Akeber
03-17-2010, 11:24 AM
........yes its true to thous who didnt know this all ready druids do not lose 20% dodge in icc.........

/facepalm

Please do yourself a favor and research the other classes you are comparing your toon to. I'd also love to see an armory link of your "speced survivabilty and geared and gemmed that way to" warrior. My guess is that we won't see you back in this thread before it's locked.

EDIT

at least he used his toon name as his tankspot username: http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Stormscale&cn=Ironoar&gn=unfallen+heroes

No, that's not a "max survivability" spec.

jh7468
03-17-2010, 11:34 AM
This is funny. I have a warrior tank as my main and a holy priest as an alt, and I cringe when a dk is tanking because they are tougher to heal. Druids in bear form are pretty easy and pallys are okay, depending on the player, but warrior tanks are close to, if not the easiest to keep alive. Sure, the other classes have certain pluses, but they also have certain minuses. I'll take a good warrior tank over any dk or druid any day.

Spirithooff
03-17-2010, 12:01 PM
druids do not lose 20% dodge in icc.

Everyone lose 20 % dodge in ICC, INCLUDING druid.

luv2tank
03-17-2010, 12:33 PM
lol this dude is a total retard

Inaara
03-17-2010, 12:41 PM
lol this dude is a total retard

I appreciate your bravado kind sir but comments like these are better reserved for www.worldofwarcraft.com/forums

MellvarTank
03-17-2010, 12:44 PM
O.o

Wow... first time I've seen people referred to the official WoW forums twice in one thread.... and on the first page too!

Inaara
03-17-2010, 12:58 PM
O.o

Wow... first time I've seen people referred to the official WoW forums twice in one thread.... and on the first page too!

"I come to you now, at the turn of the tides."

MellvarTank
03-17-2010, 01:00 PM
...... I'm looking to the east but I don't see Kaz on a white horse yet....

Bodasafa
03-17-2010, 01:02 PM
This thread has it all:

- Druids do not suffer from Chill of the Throne.....
- 50% less DPS than other Tanks......
- Warriors and Druids are meant to be the main tanks.....
- Something about taking away 60% of your dodge in ICC...

And the icing on the cake some Gear Score references!

I normally don't get down on people, but this is quite possibly the most uninformed post I have ever read on tankspot.

Inaara
03-17-2010, 01:57 PM
That's why we exist Boda lol.

timsobuff74
03-17-2010, 02:04 PM
This thread has it all:

- Druids do not suffer from Chill of the Throne.....
- 50% less DPS than other Tanks......
- Warriors and Druids are meant to be the main tanks.....
- Something about taking away 60% of your dodge in ICC...

And the icing on the cake some Gear Score references!


Tankspot Drinking Game?

Inaara
03-17-2010, 02:08 PM
Tankspot Drinking Game?
Indeed! A variation to the "Every time Luke Skywalker complains" drinking game! "This is impossible!"

Dreadski
03-17-2010, 02:28 PM
I think this thread is definitely

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e259/dreador1/beating-a-dead-horse.gif

But alas,

http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e259/dreador1/In-Before-the-Lock.gif
.

ironoar
03-17-2010, 02:34 PM
ill be happy to list my armory http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Stormscale&cn=Ironoar no shame as i have done my research and have been a sucessful tank and my comments about warriors dieing easier then other tanks are accurate i have talked to many other tanks of all classes refer to warrior tanks being soft ever since togc gormok fight, right up into 25 man icc. ill admitt as a warrior tank i have no problems holding agro over any other class of tanks. I still beleave many things ive said very rooted in fact. Palidans have become the perfered main tank to most sucessful guilds due to there argent crusader abilty. this isnt hard to see check which tanks have the end game gear most often. and yes i beleave pallies and dks where ment to be add tanks and ot s not main tanks. No one can denie shield block is broken for the warrior if it isnt tell me why blizzard is giving warriors, dk tank gear for our tier sets and totaly deserting our shield abilities. No honest warrior tank can tell me they turn out the same or similar dps as other classes of equaly geared tanks. I often see all other tank classes turning out 4k dps in 10 man icc content. Thou dps is not our job it is still sexy to raids to pick up an extra 1.5k dps from a non warrior tank. Many of the things i said before were ignorant ranting for this i am an idiot. Thou many of the things i said do hold marriot and are acurate. like in what world dose leather magicly turn in better then plate armor and why do druid retain 40% dodge in 25 icc where warrior get 13% fully buffed if there well geared? I love many things about warrior tanking and the warrior class. pallies are more appealing right now then warriors the can keep up over 102.5% mitigation for most of the fight and have argent defender any honest healer will tell you there easier to heal then a warrior. Blizzard has broke our warrior dps in fury and never gave us enough in prot. a warrior was ment to be the hands down best melee boss tank in the game and blizzard has done little to offer us propper gear or extreme survivability.

Bodasafa
03-17-2010, 02:36 PM
Sorry I have to ask.. Can you please for the love of good use paragraphs (you know hit enter) and make an attempt at proper punctuation and spelling.

This is not a chat window or the wow official forums.

ironoar
03-17-2010, 02:38 PM
Ill work on that in the future.

MellvarTank
03-17-2010, 02:47 PM
Again....


This isn't a chatroom; all those abbreviations are unnecessary here. You aren't in a hurry. An attempt at decent spelling and grammar is appreciated by the majority of readers. This generally isn't going to be something you get called out on, but if your posts are incomprehensible because you couldn't be bothered to press a few extra keys... yeah.

Class comparisons rarely go anywhere but downhill and are almost certainly going to just get closed.

Whining of any sort will be deleted. That's about all that needs to be said about that.

All this and more: http://www.tankspot.com/showthread.php?46395-Posting-Chat-Rules-READ-ME-BEFORE-POSTING


Also to add, any of your quams about druids and Dk's and such are likely discussed in the theory and mechanics section of the forum. I would go have a look through to apprise yourself of the current tank mechanics.

Bodasafa
03-17-2010, 02:48 PM
Here let me see if I can help educate you on the facts.


my comments about warriors dieing easier then other tanks are accurate

That's your prospective and that of the other tanks you talked to, doesn't make it true.


i have talked to many other tanks of all classes refer to warrior tanks being soft ever since togc gormok fight, right up into 25 man icc.

I'm not trying to turn this into a "I did something you have not situation" but.... I have tanked ToGC 25 Gormok as a warrior tank with another warrior tank and 10/12 ICC 25. Our healers have never complained about either of us being squishy or soft. We also have a Druid and a Pally that fill in as the 3rd tank when needed on 3 tank fights and the healers have never indicated that any of us are easier to heal than others.


Palidans have become the perfered main tank to most sucessful guilds due to there argent crusader abilty. this isnt hard to see check which tanks have the end game gear most often.

This is pure speculation. The simple fact is established end game raiding guilds go with the tanks that have been their the longest with the most experience/skill/gear. It has absolutely nothing to do with class.


and yes i beleave pallies and dks where ment to be add tanks and ot s not main tanks.

There are plenty of both those classes main tanking raids in end game guilds. Blizzard did not design them to be meant for add only duty. This is pure uninformed miss understanding of the facts.


why do druid retain 40% dodge in 25 icc where warrior get 13% fully buffed if there well geared?

Druids do not have Parry or Block, we do. Therefore they will have more Dodge than us (after chill of the throne) because it is their PRIMARY avoidance stat. Warriors that are at a similar gear level of a druid will have the same amount of combined total avoidance (dodge+parry+block+defense) after chill of the throne. This clearly tells me you have not read information on this site.


prot. a warrior was ment to be the hands down best melee boss tank in the game and blizzard has done little to offer us propper gear or extreme survivability.

No were not. Blizzard has said many times over in numerous blue posts they want ALL 4 tanking classes to be viable main tanks for EVERY encounter.

Muffin Man
03-17-2010, 03:11 PM
ill admitt as a warrior tank i have no problems holding agro over any other class of tanks.

I should hope not.

You're specced and geared for threat!


prot. a warrior was ment to be the hands down best melee boss tank in the game and blizzard has done little to offer us propper gear or extreme survivability.

So please don't complain about survivability until you actually try it out.

Inaara
03-17-2010, 03:13 PM
Holy crap I just had like a 3000 word response and it was killed by my work internet going out.... FML

Fortunately Boda said pretty much exactly what I was going to say..... Something that he didn't touch up on is your profile.
Your gear, gemming and enchanting needs work. You have a parry/stam gem in your shoulders that needs to be changed out, parry should never be gemmed over dodge, ever. The gem in your helm needs to be changed out so you can get the bonus. I don't understand why you took the shoulder bonus (6 stam) yet ignored the helm (12 stam), a 9 stam loss compared to a 3 stam loss. The general rule of thumb is +9 stam or better when socketing for the socket bonus. Your glove chant should be switched over to stam or armor instead of 2% threat/parry.

Now on to your gear. You're missing out on ALOT of armor in your chest, glove and leg slots. Switch out the chest and gloves for the T10 pieces or off set badge items and get Pillars of Might crafted for your legs.

Realize that you taking more damage than your fellow guild tanks may be in direct correlation to gear/chanting/gemming differences. If they have better gear, they're going to take less damage period.

Lastly, remember that everyone at TankSpot is here to help although some are more sarcastic than others. When posting keep your ideas to the point. Instead of saying "warriors take too much damage" ask if someone can tell you why you may be taking more damage than everyone else. Broad generalizations don't fly here.

Bigzoman18
03-22-2010, 12:15 PM
Despite all the posts going against this posts statment I can relate to this warrior tank. At one point in my tanking career healers constantly complained that i aparently got hit to hard. However after coming to this site and asking around I fixed the problem. Now my healers say I am one of the easiest tanks to heal while others say they have a hard time, However I just came to the conclusion that the healers that said they had a hard time healing me had perception issues. I would have to see your WoW Armory to confirm that you are speced into survibiliaty but other then that I really can't assist you even though I would like to

Happy Tanking

Aggathon
03-22-2010, 03:29 PM
Just adding my 2cp, but warriors are definitely not "more squishy" than other tanks. I actually have a lot of logs where I've taken less damage than our pally tank because I can pre-emptively use cooldowns like shield block whereas he has to wait until he's below 35% and the healers start to panic in order to see the damage reduction benefits.

Warriors are like Manual Transmissions and Pallies are like Automatic Transmissions.

Also: Dreador, your dead horse graphic is way better than mine.

Also Ironoar, after looking at your armory you have made a bunch of bad gearing decisions and gemming selections. You have probably about 4k+ armor less than you could/should have, a bunch less HPs, and are gemming for avoidance in places you REALLY shouldn't be. The fact you would put the 30 stam enchant on your shoulders then put a 20 dodge gem and a 10dodge/10defense gem in your gloves baffles me. I don't want to derail this thread any more, so if you want to talk about it more in depth, feel free to PM me.

Rithiel
03-22-2010, 09:56 PM
I sort of agree with your post; I felt squishy in ICC-25 until I got to about 32k armor unbuffed. Now I'm fine.. but on fights like Festergut, I'll still pop an Invuln potion for some extra armor. Paladins have a little more survivability, but warriors are perfectly capable of tanking all content in the game.

I also have a druid tank, and I have to say that while it is much easier with the AoE threat, it's much worse for single target threat. Plus, if all hell breaks loose, I have many more tools on my warrior to save the raid from wiping. I'd take my warrior over my druid any day.

Bigzoman18
03-23-2010, 06:03 AM
Also one thing i forgot to mention is the indestructiable potions. I recently began to use these in my ICC raids and I personally think there is no reason NOT to have a good amount of these. It doesn't mess with your stoneblood potion and it gives u 3500 extra armor for 2 mins. Whats there not to like?

Dugan
03-23-2010, 09:26 AM
Also one thing i forgot to mention is the indestructiable potions. I recently began to use these in my ICC raids and I personally think there is no reason NOT to have a good amount of these. It doesn't mess with your stoneblood potion and it gives u 3500 extra armor for 2 mins. Whats there not to like?
1 thing extra with these pots i use it just before the pull, so the cool down is up 2 minutes into the fight and can drink another. I <3 'em

Mawini
03-23-2010, 09:47 AM
Palidans have become the perfered main tank to most sucessful guilds due to there argent crusader abilty.
That's golden.

But seriously, everyone here is hitting the nail on the head when they say your spec/gear/gems are NOT maximum survivability and that you have some serious issues with understanding other classes. With the 3.3.3 buff, warriors will, in my opinion, be the ideal tank for any boss that isn't an absolute face smasher (heroic Festergut). Every day I log on and tank on my cruise control paladin, I think about how much I would LOVE to trade 1/2 of the warrior-paladin EH gap for1/2 of the paladin-warrior CONTROL gap. 696969696969696969 barf.

Yeah, I know HS is a terribad mechanic, grass is always greener, blah blah blah... but in the grand scheme there is so much a good warrior can do that an amazing paladin could never hope to.

Aggathon
03-23-2010, 09:53 AM
Warriors are the batman of tanking classes. =P

Dreadski
03-23-2010, 09:53 AM
/clap

Inaara
03-23-2010, 09:54 AM
Yeah, I know HS is a terribad mechanic, grass is always greener, blah blah blah... but in the grand scheme there is so much a good warrior can do that an amazing paladin could never hope to.

Seriously, like Hand of Protection........... oh wait...

Mawini
03-23-2010, 10:02 AM
Bah, you know what I mean. Tanking stuff!

MellvarTank
03-23-2010, 10:08 AM
Warriors are the batman of tanking classes. =P

You know, this is one of the most true analogies I have ever heard. We don't have any special abilities (laser eye beams, etc.), but what we do have is our brains and the forethought of "Hey, the Joker may use sharks today, I'mma bring shark repellant."

Warriors - Prepared for the rediculous.

Aggathon
03-23-2010, 10:09 AM
Bah, you know what I mean. Tanking stuff!

Well you could BoP yourself and watch your healers panic and sacrifice a couple pesky dps to save yourself.

Bashal
03-23-2010, 10:10 AM
*raises hand* healer here.

Any tank that knows what he's doing as far as gear and cooldown management goes is "easy" to heal. I've never noticed an extreme difference between any of the tank types, assuming equal gearing and roughly equal skill.