View Full Version : Druid Cant seem to brake the 6k mark

Bubbaj Khaz
02-02-2010, 12:36 AM
Just trying to figure out which stats i should be working on ( which i should be ignoring etc) in order to get more bang for me buck on me toon, here is a link of my armoury page http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Khaz%27goroth&cn=Bubbaj

note i have tank and boomer spec, if anyone has any comments for tanking spec feel free to comment, but atm im working on boomer any suggestions muchly appreciated!!!!

Bubbaj Khaz
02-02-2010, 04:38 AM
i forgot to mention my rotation which is as follows, depending on situation boss/trash mobs but its along the lines of the following:

FF,MF,IS,Wrath till proc, Starfire,end proc, refresh dots treants/starfall, wrath, end proc refresh dots wrath till starfire proc. i save trinkets for when hero up or i wil pop trink as we engage combat so its ready to use again later on for boss fights.

On saying this, i realise that hybrid dps classes should and iirc blizz wont let then out dps pure dps classes, but im sure i can get out this toon from moonkin spec, im a bit hesitant to spend frost badges on gear atm as im reworking tank gear however spending frost badges on moonkin gear is not entirely out of the question.

02-02-2010, 06:15 AM
Well I know you can't do anything about it right now due to server maint but you are logged out as Feral which makes it a little difficult to help you out :(

Bubbaj Khaz
02-02-2010, 06:31 AM
Dang i thought they made it so we can view each respective spec on the armory now >.< maybe not huh, oh well ill try member to log out next time in boomer spec, and yes u r right, i just looked on armory and it shows my balance spec but not gear >.< but as far as spec is concerned would (or should) there be anything i should drop/pickup?

02-02-2010, 08:35 AM
I'll take a look and see what I can come up with. In the meantime, I suggest you read up on information about Balance DPS I already provided over in this other topic:


Proper understanding of the balance DPS phases is very important to proper execution. Could you also provide the context that you are "only doing 6k" because it's hard to gauge where you are at without understanding the context. At a quick glance I'd say 6k is quite respectable for your current gear on certain encounters.

02-02-2010, 09:25 AM
Alright, running your information from a cached armory from about 4 days ago on wow-heroes, your self buffed DPS comes out to about 4700 according to the WrathCalcs spreadsheet. Your fully raid buffed DPS would come out to 6500 DPS. If you're pulling off 6000 DPS in a raiding situation you're actually doing fairly well for yourself.

Areas to improve.

It's well past time to start droping those efficiency talents. You should no longer require points in Intensity at all at this level of progression. You should also drop your Moonglow down to about 1 point. You are currently over hit capped and should drop one point of Balance of Power that isn't needed. You never drop Improved Faerie Fire (the crit alone makes it worth keeping) but it is ok to drop Balance of Power if you go over hit cap. You also aren't speced into improved range and threat reduction. Even if you don't need the threat reduction, improved range means you move less to get into range of things, thus increasing the time you are actively DPSing. This is also why Tuskarr's Vitality is always considered a good enchant because the sooner you get into the position the sooner you resume your duties, same holds true with extending your range (you may it more flexible where that position is).

I would advise you to respect to something like this.

http://www.wowarmory.com/talent-calc.xml?cid=11&tal=5012203125331303113305311231000000000000000000 000000000000205003012000000000000000000

Drop your two points in Intensity, drop two points from Moonglow (leaving 1 point in it), and drop 1 point in Balance of Power because you're over hit capped. Pick up Nature's Reach because every balance druid should have that talent. With the remaining 3 points pick up Typhoon and Gale Winds to make AoE more viable, you may also be required to use Typhoon in Icecrown Citadel for the Deathbringer Saurfang encounter depending on your raid's strategy. As an alternative, you can use a different trinket than Dying Curse and drop either one point from Gale Winds or the Typhoon spell (however, Dying Curse is the better of your two trinkets).

MP5 = The Plague
Unless the item is a very substantial upgrade over what you have, MP5 gear is extremely bad for a Balance druid because it is wasted itemization. Moonkin Form alone for you is already pushing 1000 MP5 effectively in a raid environment. You would always prefer an item with Spirit over MP5, and even then you would prefer an item that has two of Hit, Crit, or Haste on it rather than Spirit at all. Right now you have a few pieces of gear with MP5 on it and that should be avoided whenever possible. The big limitation you have is the fact that your haste and crit are very low for your gear level.

On Trinkets
Dying Curse is ok for a hit trinket, you should continue to hold onto that item because it is better than other hit trinkets when you only find yourself a little short on hit. Talisman of Resurgance however is a very weak trinket. Eye of the Broodmother from Ulduar 10 or Illustration of the Dragon Soul from Sartharion 25 would both be substantially better despite being lower item level. Muradin's Spyglass would be the best replacement for it.

Gemming and Enchants
Your gloves are missing the 28 spellpower enchant. Everything else is correct.

You are ignoring way too many of your socket bonuses going for pure spellpower. Many of those bonuses are worth having. You should not use a Nightmare Tear ever in a Red or Yellow Socket. It should only be placed in a Blue Socket since spirit is the lowest valued stat. For the most part, if the spellpower is 5, putting in a orange hybrid gem will net you about 1-2 DPS less than a pure spellpower gem once you are above haste or crit soft caps. Right now you are no where near the soft caps and using the hybrid gems will actually net you a DPS gain. 10 crit and 5 spellpower is greater in value (about 17 DPS) than the 11 additional spellpower you would get out of a Runed cut (about 15.4 DPS). Socket bonuses where it is 7 spellpower or more are where you typically would want to have the necessary Purified Dreadstones (or a Nightmare Tear) to meet your two blue requirement for the meta.

Regem your helm with a Potent Ametrine for 10 crit and 12 spellpower. Results in DPS gain. (Chaotic + Potent)
Regem your shoulder with a Potent Ametrine. Results in DPS gain. (Potent)
Regem your chest with Runed Dragonseye in red socket, Purified Dreadstone in blue socket. Results in small DPS loss (less than 5 DPS lost) but used to meet meta requirement. (Runed + Potent)
Regem your belt with a Potent Ametrine in the yellow socket. Results in DPS gain. (Runed + Potent + Runed)
Regem your legswith Runed Dragonseye in red socket, Purified Dreadstone in blue socket. Results in small DPS loss (less than 5 DPS lost) but used to meet meta requirement. (Runed + Potent)
Boots are gemmed correct, 4 crit rating not worth using something other than a Runed cut. (Runed)
Gloves are gemmed correct. (Runed)

The recommendation of using Potent (crit spellpower) instead of Reckless (haste spellpower) is to avoid needing to regem once you hit the haste soft cap. The haste soft cap is 401 with Wrath of Air totem's 5% spell haste, 585 without the totem. The crit soft cap is significantly higher, currently around 860 for your current intellect. When both are above their caps crit and haste are about even in value so it's better to keep stacking crit simply because there is more cushion on it.

02-02-2010, 09:44 AM
Forgot to mention...

Glyph of Insect Swarm is the highest DPS glyph. The two piece tier nine bonus makes Moonfire overtake it for that tier, but it remains second. At all other points in progression it is the single strongest glyph towards your DPS. Glyph of Starfall and Glyph of Focus are the two weakest glyphs which affect your DPS. You should drop Glyph of Starfall and pick up Glyph of Insect Swarm, that will net you over a 100 DPS gain.

Also for minor glyphs, you should drop Glyph of Typhoon. The knockback is something you will need in certain situations. The spell is a situational spell, it's not really much of a DPS increase to actually use it (given that Hurricane when hasted will tick faster than once per second and Typhoon when you reach the haste soft cap can't drop below the GCD minimum of 1 second). You only really use it when there is a need to knock things back such as Deathbringer Saurfang encounter. Minor glyph alternatives I would personally recommend Glyph of Dash, just nice to be able to run back faster.

02-02-2010, 11:04 AM
As for buying gear with Emblems of Frost. A balance druid is fairly close to a feral druid in that the set bonuses make it necessary to buy set pieces first. Generally you will go for Gloves and Shoulders to get your two piece tier 10 as soon as possible, however, there are some very good 264 gloves that drop off Lord Marrowgar in ICC25 (Handguards of Winter's Respite) that you may want instead (at least until you can have all 5 pieces of T10). I'm currently running 3 pieces of T10 with 2 pieces of T9 simply because set bonuses are significantly stronger than just max item level gear (though if I had the 264 gloves from Marrowgar I would use them until I got my 4th piece of T10). After at least 4/5 T10, the Idol of the Lunar Eclipse is the best in slot idol and Belt of Petrified Ivy is a very strong belt. The Volde's Cloak of the Night Sky is a decent cape however lower priority than the other Emblem of Frost purchases because it has Spirit on it, there are better alternatives which are drops (Lich Wrappings and Frostbinder's Shredded Cape from Valithria Dreamwalker on 10 man and 25 man respectfully).

Bubbaj Khaz
02-02-2010, 04:13 PM
Ok i have managed to log into wow and do a quick run and change over to boomkin spec and logged out so u ca nsee the gear im running as boomer dps if it helps at all :) and thanks for the info so far will be makingc the mentioned changes soon, lack of sleep is making me tired and methinks its gona turn pear shaped soon so it may be a few hours before i do much changing around, but thank you again for your time and info it is muchly appreciated. As for dps, my highest as yte target dummy dps has been 5.6k constant thats using innervate and burning all me mana in one sitting so to speak.

As for raid dps it varies depending on how much i am moving and if i can time my instant spells for when im having to move and doing my casting spells when im stopped, most of my time is as bear but im going boomer more and more now so as i said earlier i need to fine tune that part of gameplay.

Bubbaj Khaz
02-02-2010, 04:22 PM
not sure if i done it right , think slack of sleep is getting to me but i found a different trinket in my bank that may be better then the badge one i have, cant figure out how to make a link of it in here so ill jsut type it out, Ephemeral Snowflake its a healign trinket but i could possibly use it for the haste it gives me, but atm i think my haste is not to bad as i can caste wrath and the gcd finishes moments before the cast finishes. Also i have not specced for typhoon this new spec i have got as i am generally tnaking but i do like the blowback strat for saurfang as it makes the encounter = easy mode. :)

02-02-2010, 05:13 PM
Ephemeral Snowflake would be a very bad trinket for a balance druid. Mana per 5 is the worst stat possible. The only thing you gain is a haste use effect which really isn't all that great since you can only really use it during a Starfire Eclipse.
Change to my recommendations...
Your belt should be regemmed, now that its updated with a new belt, as all Runed cuts. The socket bonus isn't sufficient to justify using both a yellow and a blue socket.

Other recommendations seem to still apply.

02-02-2010, 05:18 PM
I'm guessing if you were pulling off that much DPS on a training dummy either...

1. You weren't attacking the raid boss dummy.
2. You had additional buffs or debuffs beyond just mark of the wild and those you yourself apply.
3. The random number generator really smiled on you.

Since your spreadsheet DPS was significantly lower it's unlikely you would be able to sustain these type of results repeatedly, rather it was a fluke and one or more of the above conditions contributed to it being almost 25% higher than what your self buffed DPS would be alone against a raid boss training dummy.

Bare in mind "highest dps" can mean you are just lucky. You want to know what you can consistently pull off time and time again. I break 9k DPS on Koralon the Flame Watcher and for VoA pugs I still only list myself as 6K+ DPS. Even though I consistently do over 8K now on those fights, I can have a streak of bad luck too and drop down lower (had my keyboard die on me once and did 6K with just clicking buttons on the mouse, that was amusing).

Bubbaj Khaz
02-02-2010, 11:27 PM
ok so i have changes to nightmare tear to the chest and the crit to the head, have changed badge trinnket to lower one that has crit on eguip and sp on proc, changed pants gem, will go for valor ring and conquest neck piece till i can get a better replacement, giving me one, a better neck piece to start with and a betterring then mp5 as well, will be putting sp chant on gloves when my chanter comes on line as well as changed talents over. crit now jsut over 30% with idol proc.

Dps on dummies with sp food and fsp fllask sorry not just self buffed. my bad, i had it on me from a previous raid still and forgot to clear it off.

Seems ot be doing better, but ithink till i get better gear dps is pretty much gona be where ts at really. dam hybrid classes lol!!!

Thanks you heaps for your help with this matter, worked a charm!!!