PDA

View Full Version : Moving up from one R25 to 2 x R25



Sitar
01-26-2010, 02:27 AM
Hello,

I'm an officer in a guild which runs a good R25 5 times a week (we've killed putricided and are on Queen). We have like 35 raiders everynight and we were wondering if we could open recruit and moving up to be able to run 2 x R25.

I just wanted a feedback from people who already do that, and how they handle it.

Anyone could help ?

Thanks

Daydream
01-26-2010, 12:12 PM
I have been in guilds that has done this and can work out real well or bad depending on how you handle it. The main thing is once you have enough people for two 25 mans make groups equal ( Unless the 2nd group will be made of casuals in your guild ), because you do not want people thinking they are getting in the lesser group all that leads to is angry guildies. Another thing to mention is before doing this you might want to try and do this with some pugs in the 2nd group one week to see how the leader of that group handles it, and how people like being in separate group.

If all goes well though this can really help out progression and, it is nice to have another group that goes and can help you out if they see something is working that may help the other group kill the boss more easily.

Proletaria
01-26-2010, 02:36 PM
From personal experience:

Only, only, ONLY, contemplate expanding into multipul 25man raids if you are assured of the following:

1. Strong recruitment: Obviously you want to fill the second raid (and get it a few back-up's) quickly.

2. Strong Officer-core: You'll probably want raid leaders in duplicate for each group, not to mention the logistical staff for keeping track of your loot system, player attendance, player performance, and the nightmare of scheduling.

As you can probably tell, my experience with this was negative. My old guild in BC had two 25man raids. The second raid was generally viewed as inferior to the first (largely because we had to drop recruitment standards a bit to fill out the second team). Although both raid teams progressed relatively close to one another, drama cropping up from the two-team system forced me to spin the second group off into our sister guild. After a few months our co-guild was a competitor and by the time WOTLK was on the horizon cannibalism between our two guids had broken us.

I'm aware of guilds who still do this, but personally given the same situation that you're in I would try to stream-line the population of your guild rather than grow it exponentially larger.

Darksend
01-26-2010, 04:17 PM
Everyone in the raid has an alt with at least 25 toc gear. We kill everything but blood queen on them, like 5 mains and 20 alts. That way it is people you know already

Sitar
01-27-2010, 01:22 AM
Everyone in the raid has an alt with at least 25 toc gear. We kill everything but blood queen on them, like 5 mains and 20 alts. That way it is people you know already

We thought about that but when hardmodes will come, i doubt we'll have time to run 2 x R25 at 2 separate times.

@Proletaria, i agree with you, it might more of a guild killer than anything else. My problem is that with 35 people everytime, i've a hard time making everyone happy. This badge thing is crap because you can't say to someone, "don't worry i'll take you on wednesday, i'll take an apply today to test him" because that main who's good will loose his frost emblems to an apply we might not keep in the guild, or to a member who's not as good and thus can only take to farmed content.

How do you handle that ?

Mookey
01-27-2010, 02:00 AM
Worked for ToC for us, but we abandoned it later on since we needed more team synergy even in ToC25 to be able to play more fluid in ToGC.

We started ICC with best team and have alt 25 that's struggling beyond DBS. Not sure how it might work for ICC, not trying it, whoever is not saved with main team goes with alt for now.

Proletaria
01-27-2010, 01:40 PM
We thought about that but when hardmodes will come, i doubt we'll have time to run 2 x R25 at 2 separate times.

@Proletaria, i agree with you, it might more of a guild killer than anything else. My problem is that with 35 people everytime, i've a hard time making everyone happy. This badge thing is crap because you can't say to someone, "don't worry i'll take you on wednesday, i'll take an apply today to test him" because that main who's good will loose his frost emblems to an apply we might not keep in the guild, or to a member who's not as good and thus can only take to farmed content.

How do you handle that ?

We trial recruits either on day1 of icc (some members have told me they don't mind being sat and loosing out on a few badges) or on our togc night. Although when progression really picks up into hardmode icc, togc night will probably get nixed, at that point hopefully we won't be recruiting as hard.

In the event your schedule forces you to have recruits get tested during actual progression: tell your raiders what is going on, why they are sitting temporarily, and hope that their egos can handle it. We've been in this (unfortunate) spot a few times in the past. Sometimes you win a good recruit and the raider totally understands. Sometimes you loose the raider to jealousy and the recruit ends up being lack-luster. Fact is, recruitment being on-going and strong is more important than the ego of a few raiders who want every single frost badge they can possibly get. Make sure everyone understands what you're going to do, when people are going to get substituted out for a trial, and minimize the chance things will go south on you.

Sitar
01-28-2010, 01:17 AM
That's how we try to do it, thanks for the tips. I guess keeping recruitement going on is the key.

Proletaria
01-28-2010, 01:20 PM
I mean, at a certain point you can kick back and say "wow, this raid is full of high performance players and we have a great makeup with a few on the bench." Assuming that became the case, I would probably back off on recruitment for the time being. That being said, it rarely happens even in great guilds that everyone is always irreplacable and awsome at the same time as the raid is well balanced.