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Brackit
12-29-2009, 09:39 PM
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Malygos&n=Zalios)

Should be updated soon.


I know i'm not hit capped. I know i'm not expertise. I understand my talent build is bad. :P However, I have no issues running heroics etc...but now I have began to raid tank. Icc10-Deathbringer, I do alright...30% I get crushed. :P

Anyways, tonight I was in ToC10 tanking, it seemed to me the healers were having a rough time keeping me up. Im crit immune atm, 544 defense. So I get out, cause our leader said the raid makeup was not going to beat the faction champs...even though we could have. :P Anyways, I get out and grab my t9 chest. I then have 550 def. So I decide to remove some of my def gems and throw in stam gems. Was that a bad move? She tells me I need to get my defense higher so I can take more hits.

I understand 540 isnt a cap, its just not getting you owned by a massive 27k crit. Where am I going wrong for raid tanking? Other than build change/hit/expertise. She is a paladin with 572 defense. So she gets to MT. :P plus 47k hp helps alittle. Sorry this post looks all messed up, but it's late for me. :P Any tips on how I should go about my gemming? I normally don't die in heroics. Deathbringer is the first raid I have gone to where I just get smashed by a few hits. I used my CD's when needed etc. Meh this could go on forever. :P

Tazlex
12-29-2009, 10:16 PM
First, you made the right choice. Get more stamina if you are over the 540 defense skill (in your case that is).

There are quite a few things you can do. Several pieces of your gear is not enchanted. Bracers, Chest, Feet. That could be another 1k health for you. Also you have to upgrade that block trinket. Keep the trinket, useful for some fights but if you are doing ICC whether 10 or 25. You will need more health. Your avoidance for ICC is bad. With Chill of the Throne. Your dodge will go down 20% leaving you susceptible to more hits, and Deathbring Saurfang hits hard as you can tell. Also you have only 24k armor. I'm sure it goes up a bit more towards 27k once buffed, but I would even say that might be a little low.

Biggest overall difference that you can do if you want to do raid tanking is upgrading your gear as you may already know. You will get more armor and everything with upgrading. Get the Black Heart from Regular ToC 5 man. Good trinket with easy access to. Glyph of Indomimably (however you spell it) is also a solid trinket to use if you don't have anything else right now. Also you can probably toss that hit gem away for more stamina or a gem that gives stamina + another stat.

Wait till Aggathon or another Warrior tanks comes in, they can probably give you more precise advice.

Surmaaja
12-30-2009, 12:04 AM
As previous poster said, enchant your current gear and switch all non epic gems to epic ones. Glyph of indom is definetly great choice to replace that block trinket also try running some normal toc5 for Black Heart for your second trinket.
You should spec into improved demoshout and remember to keep it up. Glyph of shieldwall and last stand shortens your most powerfull cooldowns down to 2min each if you spec into imp. disciplines aswell. Glyph of cleave and sunder are pretty bad choices for Saurfang specially, you might hit one of the bloodbeasts with sunder when they spawn. There's no need to worry about getting more defense after 540 (536 with that resilience shoulder enchant) just stack stamina for now.
Saurfang after 30% goes into soft enrage so this is great time to chug down Indestructible potion and start using some cd's everytime its your turn to tank it.
Check Agg's guide below for gemming/enchanting help:
http://www.tankspot.com/forums/f97/60155-aggs-prot-war-tanking-guide.html

Aggathon
12-30-2009, 02:44 AM
Wait till Aggathon or another Warrior tanks comes in, they can probably give you more precise advice.

I'm flattered! <3

What you say is essentially true except for needing more avoidance for CotT. CotT really doesn't change avoidance/ehp priorities unless you are below 20% dodge or something, which if you are, you probably shouldn't be in ICC.

Brakit, you are a bit on the undergeared side. I would highly suggest the changes already stated and looking over the guide surmaaja already linked. If you have any more specific questions after reading it, then please feel free to ask!

Brackit
12-30-2009, 05:44 AM
Alright, so what I need to do is.

1.Change my build. I took out my fury build and switched it with another prot build. The cookie cutter one. That does leave me with only 14% block though. Seems alittle low to me. Also, I guess I should ask...is 14% a bad block? Meh, just seems low to me. :P
2. Get the black heart. (got it!)

3.Chant my gear. Got my chest good to go with +275. My bracers and feet I was kinda hoping to get a better drop before I chanted em. It's not happening. :P I run H:FoS everyday in hopes of those boots...they just sass me. The spiked deathdealers run for 5000-8000g on my server. No smith will make em for less than 1k with mats. So far...low pop server ftw. :P

4. More cowbell...or armor.

Thanks guys, leading me in the right direction. :D Anymore advice feel free to leave it. :D I wanna be a pwning tank. :P Not one that does little pwning then gets pwned! :P ...the word pwn is so sweet. :D Thanks again!

Tazlex
12-30-2009, 01:52 PM
To number 1. I think other warrior tanks can better answer that. Sadly being a paladin I am use to Holy Shield lol. Wow Armory does show your block at 18%. Overall I think your stats look much better (to me).

Just remember your health will go up more with the new enchants. With Max health buffs (flask and Food buff) I'm guessing you can get around 47k give or take some. Just keep running those Heroics and don't forget you can run Regulars to. There is a pair of boots off Regular FoS, Devourer of Souls. The boots only have Def Rating, Parry and Block value. That is an upgrade over what you have so take what you can get.

Brackit
12-30-2009, 01:59 PM
Yeah, but when I switch over to the cookie cutter tanking spec. (my 2nd spec) it drops my block down to 15%. :( Been looking to see what I may take it out of, or see how well it does on a boss in Thursday's ToC. If I get to tank. :P My parry and dodge stay pretty high though. 27% dodge 19% parry.

Eravian
12-30-2009, 02:12 PM
Generally, unless you're going for a passive unhittable set (which is essentially used for one fight - 25-man Heroic Anub'arak), there's really not a whole lot of reason to worry about your Block Rating too much, since a Block, even a critical block, is generally not as useful as armor and stamina in terms of survivability (at least for warriors, since we don't have a permanent 30% block or whatever it is that paladins get). It's not really that Block is bad, per se, it's just that getting a lot of block generally means you're hurting you other avoidance stats and/or your armor and stamina, all of which generally contribute more to survivability. The 10 seconds of 100% block time from Shield Block will make up for it most of the time.

Brackit
12-30-2009, 03:57 PM
Awesome, thanks Eravian. Makes me feel alittle better about the 14% block. :P

Aggathon
12-30-2009, 05:00 PM
Generally, unless you're going for a passive unhittable set (which is essentially used for one fight - 25-man Heroic Anub'arak), there's really not a whole lot of reason to worry about your Block Rating too much, since a Block, even a critical block, is generally not as useful as armor and stamina in terms of survivability (at least for warriors, since we don't have a permanent 30% block or whatever it is that paladins get). It's not really that Block is bad, per se, it's just that getting a lot of block generally means you're hurting you other avoidance stats and/or your armor and stamina, all of which generally contribute more to survivability. The 10 seconds of 100% block time from Shield Block will make up for it most of the time.

^ This exactly, also I have 12.8% block, don't worry about it =D

Brackit
01-01-2010, 05:54 PM
Thanks for the help everyone! I Think im heading in the right direction now. :P

btw, do Paladins and warriors defense scale different? was in debate today in Trade and was just wondering what you guys though.

Aggathon
01-01-2010, 07:59 PM
I'm fairly sure defense scales the same for all tanking classes, it just depends on what your current DRs are at. If you have a lot of dodge then defense will add the same amount of dodge rating but that dodge rating will not give as high a dodge percent because the dodge is already high. Agi does scale differently though. Someone can correct me if I am wrong though.

Satrina
01-01-2010, 08:13 PM
You are correct.

Brackit
01-18-2010, 08:02 PM
Me again guys. :D I think my gear is starting to take a better turn! I got a questions. BTW Normally I have the shield wall glyph. Anyways, I was tanking Lord M tonight. We did em last night and almost got em...the guild im in isnt the greatest but I have fun. Anyways, tonight I was dropping as if I was a mage. I know stacking stam is the way to go, but I see other warriors stacking +dodge+stam. Should I be going this way for ICC? Just wondering.

krc
01-18-2010, 08:18 PM
For Marrowgar EH is the right choice because you mainly die when a healer is spiked and you go three hits in a row without heals. In that situation you rely on RNG too much since you are basically praying to the RNG gods that you avoid one of those attacks.

Marrowgar doesn't hit all that hard just make sure you pop a CD when a healer on you is spiked. Also make sure you flask and use an Indestructible potion.

Brackit
01-18-2010, 08:21 PM
Cool, then im doing all the right things. We'll get there. haha Thanks. :D

Aggathon
01-18-2010, 10:33 PM
Cool, then im doing all the right things. We'll get there. haha Thanks. :D

Also make sure the OT stacks on top of you. You could be taking full cleave damage, and that would hurt.

Brackit
01-19-2010, 07:20 AM
Actually she doesn't. She stands to the side of me, or front. Ill suggest that next time.

krc
01-19-2010, 03:30 PM
That's probably the reason why, you should see your damage drop dramitically when she is in front of the boss along with you.

Brackit
02-05-2010, 09:55 AM
Me again guys. :D Your such an awesome help I keep coming back.

yesterday I did a pug for Lord M. It was the weekly. The other tank and I tanked em where he stands with the back to the door. It went flawless. The guild that I run with prefers to tank em with his back facing toward the west wall(still in the middle). We seem to always fail...I have only seen the Deathbringer and that was with a pug as well. Dps is on the spikes, the ...try to dodge the fire and same with the healers. Where do you guys tank em? I dont wanna step on my guild leaders toes. She does lead...

Another thing. I actually had to heal ICC one week. (on my shammy)
We had another tank, and we drop em no problem. My parry is 18.79% and hers is 21.4% and about 1k armor difference. Her favor. Is having 26.3k armor bad? My parry low? I dont think it's me, I really wanna push it towards the healers not dodging fires. :P They are the first to die most of the time.

Anyways, when said tank looked at my gear, again she said "Your def is to low." It's at 559 with no gems or chants...it's just there. Minus the shoulder chant. You guys have answered this before, but is there something im missing? Everytime another tank looks at my gear they tell me that.

Selene
02-05-2010, 03:34 PM
The raids I have done, we have just tanked him at the doorway, with his back into the room.
The Entire Raid, not counting the tanks, but Everyone but Hunters are to stand inside his hit box, with hunters just behind as close as they can get. All DPS is to turn and destroy the spikes when they hit.
Has worked quite well unless the DPS are being stupid... Like not attacking a Spike that has the Druid Healer on it...