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Jeisenne
12-21-2009, 12:18 AM
I have a simple question, and before I proceed with information I gained while reading various posts in various WoW related forums, I want some reliable advice, so I turn to you, denizens of TankSpot.com :)

I'm wondering if I need to resocket my gems, as the majority of the plate I'm getting lately has a lot of red gem slots. Currently I'm gemmed with nothing but +30 sta gems (Solid Majestic Zircon), but after reading how beneficial Agility is to a tankadin, I'm wondering if I should regem my red sockets with the agi/sta gems. I know ultimately I will lose some stamina, but will the gain in agility make up for the loss of base HP?

Here's my armory: My WoW Armory info (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hellscream&n=Jeisey)

Thank you for any and all help :) I've only been tanking since the end of August, and I'm confident with my abilities, my rotations, and my gear; but if there's room for improvement, especially when it comes to how to socket my gear, I'd love to hear it.

Aggathon
12-21-2009, 12:47 AM
Here's how I'd do it:

Helm: 10defense/15 stam
Shoulders: Re-enchant with 30stam/15 resil
Cloak: put 225 Armor on it and 30 stam gem
BP: Enchant to 275 HPs and gems 1 10agi/15stam 1 30 stam
Legs: Switch 1 to 10agi/15 stam
Gloves: 240 armor

Basically, go for any +9stam or higher set bonus, and if it's red toss agi in it, if it's something else, just gem stam.

Overall your gearing/gemming looks pretty good, enchanting could use a little work and the 10stats gem for a tank is kind of a no-no, but otherwise solid. If you wanted to save money it probably wouldn't make a huge difference if you left things the way you have them.

Jeisenne
12-21-2009, 12:52 AM
I'm sitting on 29k gold with nothing much to spend it on since among my toons I transmute my own gems and make my own flasks, so cost is not an issue.

Can you explain why the sta/resil enchant for shoulders would be good? I thought anything over 540 defense added to overall mitigation, and from my reading that's a good thing. A lot of the sockets I'm looking at are only a +6 sta bonus so maybe keeping the blue +30 sta gems there sounds ok. Overall I was wondering what to stick into my new cloak, and soon to be plate armor from the Frost Emblem vendors.

Also, wondering why straight HP enchants are what you're suggesting since a lot of info I'm reading says to try and work agi into the equation, which I've done with the cloak enchant and chest (stats). Understanding allows me to not ask noob questions the next time the issue comes up.

Thanks again :)

Harmacy
12-21-2009, 12:53 AM
It wouldn't hurt to gem to a few socket bonuses, but it also wouldn't hurt to leave things as they are. I'd like to add that the Titanium Plating shield enchant is pretty underwhelming (decent for threat, good for a shield block set, but not very useful as a MT in most situations).

The thing that's likely hurting you (much more than gems) is that spec. Divinity is not worth the talent points, and you only need 1 point in Spiritual Attunement. Take those points and put them in the ret tree for Crusade.

Jeisenne
12-21-2009, 01:00 AM
Harmacy I was looking at a 0/53/18 cookie cutter spec, is that the one you're suggesting?

Harmacy
12-21-2009, 01:03 AM
Yes. Crusade is one of the reasons that prot pallies have few if any threat issues.

To answer your other questions, defense over the minimum is not a bad thing at all but it's less than ideal. Avoidance < stamina, in most raiding situations, which is why we go with the pvp shoulder enchant.

Jeisenne
12-21-2009, 01:06 AM
Thanks. I'm the only prot pally on the guild, and the other tanks are bears and a prot warrior, whom I had to ask for advice. I don't have threat issues as it is without Crusade, so I'm wondering then if I should trade out the threat to gloves enchant (although Parry is good).

I've been underwhelmed with titanium plating on my shield, and it's what I traded in for defense to shield since I'm already sitting at 562 defense. Thinking then I'll go for maybe stamina to shield, which I think is a BC enchant.

Aggathon
12-21-2009, 01:10 AM
I'm sitting on 29k gold with nothing much to spend it on since among my toons I transmute my own gems and make my own flasks, so cost is not an issue.

Can you explain why the sta/resil enchant for shoulders would be good? I thought anything over 540 defense added to overall mitigation, and from my reading that's a good thing. A lot of the sockets I'm looking at are only a +6 sta bonus so maybe keeping the blue +30 sta gems there sounds ok. Overall I was wondering what to stick into my new cloak, and soon to be plate armor from the Frost Emblem vendors.

Also, wondering why straight HP enchants are what you're suggesting since a lot of info I'm reading says to try and work agi into the equation, which I've done with the cloak enchant and chest (stats). Understanding allows me to not ask noob questions the next time the issue comes up.

Thanks again :)

Hookay... so... as far as the shoulder enchant, the mitigation is nice, but frankly the SoH enchant overall is underwhelming. If someone is telling you to stack avoidance for Icewell Radiance or something, then they are wrong, Icewell Radiance really doesn't change priorities.*

Furthermore, for most normal mode and hardmode content, stacking EHP is still going to be the way to go, and as a palidan EHP goes even further for you because of your better stamina scaling (though that doesn't effect the 275 HP enchant) and because of AD. You get a lot more throughput from health than a lot of other tanks. Basically, avoiding is nice but most people stack it up to "RNG won't always save you, where as EHP is always there."*
The reason people are staying get AGI for paladins isn't because stacking AGI is critical, but because it is 97% as effective as dodge for avoidance, +armor +crit on the side. Overall it ends up being the best survivabilty red socket, however if it's a +6 stam bonus, the raw stam you get doesn't typically make the loss in stam worth the small gain in agi.

This man is one of the best tanks I've ever seen and is probably the best pally tank I've ever seen, he stays very up to date and is an absolutely exceptional player. If I ever have a pally question, I armory him!

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Maelstrom&cn=Eraduun&gn=Roll+Initiative)

He's the one that got me into tank theorycraft and the EHP scene to begin with. He's p much a badass.

Also 225 armor is better overall than 22 agi (44 armor and a small amount of dodge vs 225 armor, 225 armor wins).

*Edit: note: Icewell Radiance Doesn't change this and overall ICC doesn't, HOWEVER, there are some boss fights that will probably prefer avoidance in ICC, but that is boss mechanic related and probably won't even be necessary until hardmodes anyways.

Edit2: Jesus !@#$% $!#%!@# $#@!%$ he has 46.5k HPS unbuffed. !@#$ I miss raiding... I haven't been able to raid except once this month b/c of work. B/C of his Pillars of Might I even have less armor than him now, I used to have crap tons more... I'm a sad panda... I'm gonna go off and mope now...

Jeisenne
12-21-2009, 01:13 AM
Hookay... so... as far as the shoulder enchant, the mitigation is nice, but frankly the SoH enchant overall is underwhelming. If someone is telling you to stack avoidance for Icewell Radiance or something, then they are wrong, Icewell Radiance really doesn't change priorities.*

Furthermore, for most normal mode and hardmode content, stacking EHP is still going to be the way to go, and as a palidan EHP goes even further for you because of your better stamina scaling (though that doesn't effect the 275 HP enchant) and because of AD. You get a lot more throughput from health than a lot of other tanks. Basically, avoiding is nice but most people stack it up to "RNG won't always save you, where as EHP is always there."*
The reason people are staying get AGI for paladins isn't because stacking AGI is critical, but because it is 97% as effective as dodge for avoidance, +armor +crit on the side. Overall it ends up being the best survivabilty red socket, however if it's a +6 stam bonus, the raw stam you get doesn't typically make the loss in stam worth the small gain in agi.

This man is one of the best tanks I've ever seen and is probably the best pally tank I've ever seen, he stays very up to date and is an absolutely exceptional player. If I ever have a pally question, I armory him!

The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Maelstrom&cn=Eraduun&gn=Roll+Initiative)

He's the one that got me into tank theorycraft and the EHP scene to begin with. He's p much a badass.

Also 225 armor is better overall than 22 agi (44 armor and a small amount of dodge vs 225 armor, 225 armor wins).

*Edit: note: Icewell Radiance Doesn't change this and overall ICC doesn't, HOWEVER, there are some boss fights that will probably prefer avoidance in ICC, but that is boss mechanic related and probably won't even be necessary until hardmodes anyways.

Thank you for this! :)

Aggathon
12-21-2009, 01:15 AM
NP, that's what I'm here for *goes back to spamming F5*

Harmacy
12-21-2009, 02:16 AM
Thanks. I'm the only prot pally on the guild, and the other tanks are bears and a prot warrior, whom I had to ask for advice. I don't have threat issues as it is without Crusade, so I'm wondering then if I should trade out the threat to gloves enchant (although Parry is good).

I've been underwhelmed with titanium plating on my shield, and it's what I traded in for defense to shield since I'm already sitting at 562 defense. Thinking then I'll go for maybe stamina to shield, which I think is a BC enchant.

If you're having no threat issues without Crusade, well you would gain 6% threat by speccing into it (except for Ulduar and a handful of bosses and mobs outside of it, that's only 3%), so I think switching out Armsman for +240 armor or +18 stamina would be good. Personally I prefer the armor, but that's only because it brings me to 30006 with devo aura and my armor trinket, and I like big round numbers. (yes I'm weird)

And yeah I'd go for stamina to shield.

Jeisenne
12-21-2009, 01:21 PM
Thanks Harmacy! I've updated my spec, changed some enchants around, so hopefully I'm better off with the changes now than I was before.

The thing is, I wasn't having issues before (some people have jokingly referred to me as a trash mob in heroic instances) so if all the suggestions above are as good as you folks say, then hopefully I can only be that.much.better~

I like big round numbers too :) And I'm a girl tank, so it's even weirder... or maybe it's just my OCD quest for perfection.

Harmacy
12-21-2009, 01:27 PM
Glad to help, and you probably shouldn't admit you're a girl on WoW unless you want to be deluged with nerds who think that "LOL NEKKID PIX PLOX" is hilarious, witty, and original.

CatabriOnEarthen
12-21-2009, 03:54 PM
Glad to help, and you probably shouldn't admit you're a girl on WoW unless you want to be deluged with nerds who think that "LOL NEKKID PIX PLOX" is hilarious, witty, and original.

I'm a girl tank, too. My toon is male, so that might help. But if anyone actually asks for Nekkid Pix, I'll ask them if they are ready for their eyes to bleed. I'm build like a female dwarf. No really, I am.