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View Full Version : Death Knight Halls of Reflection (HEROIC), Major Issues =\



Aronoth
12-15-2009, 04:27 AM
I've cleared HOR about 3 times as a tank on my DK.

But have noticed that the trash for the first two bosses is really tearing me down fast. Healers can hardly keep me alive.

My general stats are as follows:
Armor 27.8K (~64% Mitigation)
Dodge 24%
Parry 23%
Health 30.1K Unbuffed

The bosses themselves are cake, but waves 7-8 usually kill me at least once (mainly because I've already used my cooldowns to survive in prior waves.)

I've had at least 2-3 healers say "you're taking too much DMG".

Is there something I'm doing wrong?

My Wowhead Armory Listing:
Profiler - Wowhead (http://www.wowhead.com/?profile=us.blackwater-raiders.aronoth#inventory:0-2)

Any tips would be appreciated.

Synapse
12-15-2009, 04:37 AM
This trash is interesting in that they all have some sort of neat trick. Except the footmen, they don't deserve attention.
Mercenaries are good backstabbers. They'll shadowstep often and they do MUCH more damage when they're behind you. It's like comparing shiv with mutilate. They also kidney shot, but there's nothing you can do to prevent it, and it happens often enough a trinket isn't likely to help.
Magi can clone themselves and cast heavy aoes. Remember the worshippers in Ahn'Kahet? With the fire aoe that would kill pugs within seconds? It's more or less that.
Riflement have a few ranged attacks and no, you don't lose aggro to them randomly. They are designed to randomly shoot people with debuffs, like curses that make you take more damage, or freezing traps and the like. Priests can fearalyze people.

So, when you have either of those in the pull, things can get bad.
Imagine you're backstabbed while the healer is feared
Or the hunter froze the healer while the mage aoes

Harmacy
12-15-2009, 04:44 AM
You're using the wrong runeforges. Nerubian Carapace all the way, 2% stamina and 26 defense is (even if you're over the defense minimum purely from gear) much, much more important than the threat gain from your current runes. Using these runes will also free up some enchants for stamina and armor.

I would use the Black Heart over Ick's Rotting Thumb. Dodge is nice (the on-use is pretty cool too), but you need to have enough stamina to withstand a beating as a tank. I would recommend that unless you're building a set for a gimmick fight (like Vezax, or tanking Anub heroic adds) you should use at least one stamina trinket.

Don't gem parry, it is significantly worse than both dodge and agility. To meet red sockets with decent bonuses, use dodge/stam or agi/stam.

Why do you only have one point in Anticipation? It's a key tank talent, that 4% dodge is one of the reasons you were getting hit like a ten ton truck. I would spec like this (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EZhxe0A0I0c0fuzAo0x) with the last four points wherever you want (I filled out Deathchill, and then Chill of the Grave and 1/3 Scent of Blood for more RP).

Glockopop
12-15-2009, 04:46 AM
I dont know, i tank this on my warrior i never have a problem when a priest or druid heals. but anthing else and party is good as dead in 8th or 9th wave. holding aggro, picking up mobs and holding aggro on them is crazy at first. it just seems like more of a challenge for warriors then other tanks.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Blackrock&cn=Gl%C3%B6ck%C3%B6p%C3%B6p&gn=AOTP

I know my weapon sucks i cant get anything to drop for me

Theotherone
12-15-2009, 05:05 AM
Holding aggro seems to be a major issue on the mobs for everyone. I'm thinking the mechanic of the fight (like the random targeting by the Rifleman) is that mobs will get loose. Last night I had DnD all over the place, spammed HB, BB, Pestilence i.e. diseases all over the place and the rogue and Rifleman were still getting loose and going after our annoying healer.

As a side note, beware the angry child/moron who refuses to rez when you have no kick vote left. Happened last night, we had one wipe - last wave on the run from Arthas and the healer got pissed and refused to rez, we couldn't kick him (apparently, there had been an earlier kick vote in the group), it just made the group break up. The leader not being able to remove cross realm creeps is a major flaw in the new LFG.

makkaveli
12-15-2009, 05:08 AM
i struggled with HoR aswell and still havent done it. Im not sure if it was my group or what.

i have 35k hp 26% dodge and 19-20% parry

i felt it was the kinda of place that needed some good cc on them warriors to nuke the mages and rogues.

the dps in my group was crap so we couldnt kill the mobs to break the walls quick enough on the lich king. maybe i should go back with a different group.

Glockopop
12-15-2009, 05:15 AM
Yeah, we will see what happens. sure they will nerf it. But it is hard to pick up adds as a warrior when you want to save thunderclap for when most of the mobs are there for aggro gain and it doesnt seem like cleave is enough to hold them and shockwave is nice but cooldown doesnt seem fast enough to help keep up aggro when i dont have druid or priest healer cause they just heal through damage till i can get control again.

Aronoth
12-15-2009, 05:22 AM
Thanks for the input Harmcy. I'll modify my spec to this:
Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft (http://www.wowhead.com/?talent#j0EZhxezA0Iof0fuzAo0x:ToaVmM)

Filling Lichborne, Deathchill, and Merciless Combat.

As far as runes go, I switch them for other instances which give me no trouble. But, do use the Nerubian runes for HOR.

As far as gems go, is there a reason why +parry is not a good way to go?

Could you please tell me what is the logic behind choosing +dodge over +parry?

Roana
12-15-2009, 05:22 AM
This trash is interesting in that they all have some sort of neat trick. Except the footmen, they don't deserve attention.

The footmen have Shield Bash. Not good if you let them come near healers (which happens very easily if you stay grouped up in the alcove).

Genesis_Omega
12-15-2009, 05:26 AM
As a warrior I have also found this place to be hell, and I have 40k Unbuffed. Here is three of the strats. I have used.

1. CC - In my Heroic group I will always generally have atleast 1 Lock, and a Ret Paly...the lock fears the crap outta them and the ret paly will use repetence, among the other things ret palys have in their arsonal.

2. LoS - Get all 5 people into the corner where one of the bosses are so none of the ranged can get to you with out getting into melee and pick them all up via AoE, or whatever you need to do. The only problem with this is it tends to get hard to see with so many people in that one corner.

3. Two Tanks - Yes, 2 tanks. Am I a scrub for suggesting this? Maybe, but the one time I decided to pug this, the DK that was there had a Tank Offset....needless to say after the first few wipes we were getting down, and I asked if he had one....Not a single full wipe on all 10 waves, it made the mob control SO much easier.

Hopfully some of these can help out anyone reading this thread. Good luck in the future with this. :D

Tahriel
12-15-2009, 05:28 AM
The place is horrid for tanks.

I've not ran it much just because i find it such a boring place, but what i found helped as a priest was to shackle the footmen.

I had the tank i was with mainly just pick up any melee classes they could, the hunter and mage didn't really cause too much damage that i felt i couldn't heal somebody being attacked by one. Aslong as the melee classes didn't get me, i could have a hunter or mage comfortably attacking me and i'd heal it without problems.

/Tahriel

makkaveli
12-15-2009, 05:30 AM
ive tried all thre of those. first one almost worked but struggled if the cc failed. the corner thing sucks because its hard to see if someone if getting popper from one of the ranged mobs in the stupid lil corner. and the 2 tank thing is great until u get to the end. unless they they have a 3k+ dps spec its gonna be extremely hard to kill the lich king mobs quick enough!

the place sucks

Harmacy
12-15-2009, 05:31 AM
As far as gems go, is there a reason why +parry is not a good way to go?

Could you please tell me what is the logic behind choosing +dodge over +parry?

Parry has much greater diminishing returns than dodge rating. Death Knights get 25% of their strength as parry rating, so simply by being a DK, your parry is already pushed way into diminishing returns. That's why dodge is better to gem for.

Aronoth
12-15-2009, 05:34 AM
Parry has much greater diminishing returns than dodge rating. Death Knights get 25% of their strength as parry rating, so simply by being a DK, your parry is already pushed way into diminishing returns. That's why dodge is better to gem for.

Thanks. I'll get some new +dodge or +agi, when needed.

With the +2% DMG mitigation, and increased Dodge I'm hoping tomarrow will be an easier time on completing a Heroic HOR.

wazdaa
12-15-2009, 06:10 AM
first thing is make sure to tell your healer/dps to do nothing and stay hidden in alcove while they spawn and stay out of los, use HoW when spawned so you get initial aggro. it's hardly any threat so if anyone is drinking or whatever they'll overtake you and make it harder right of the bat.

2nd drop your D&D as they come to you but tell your dps to wait till you mark a skull, but healer can start healing. when all mobs grouped up on you in the D&D mark a mob so dps can start and spread out, move away a bit from healer (don't los him though, healer obv has to move aswell for this) and move from fire aoe if it's down.
also tell ppl to use cc that doesn't break on dmg, aka stuns, cyclone, fears (after some aggro is established and only melee targets)... (prime target's for this are mage, rogue, hunter (only if there still is mage up)) also this is single target, aoe isn't the right way to handle this.

order should be priest 1st (both bc heal and can fear your healer which is real bad) > mage (as the aoe is very annoying) > rogue (stun is a killer) > hunter (he's not nearly as bad when no mage is up anymore) > footman.

as for cd's use your ibf only on groups that have rogues, as ibf also prevents the stun from happening, if there is no rogue in the group or the group isn't very threatening use another cd if any, ams if there is a mage, preferably very soon, so hopefully it's up before you get stunned, reducing the burst that inevitably is gonna happen while you are stunned. also try to only use 1 cd/wave and try predict if it's an easy wave and if so do without cd. that way you'll have cd for waves were you need it.
don't forget to tell dps to jump in where needed paladin 'raid shieldwall', feral/boomkin casting aoe heal, enh shammy using maelstorm stacks on chain lighting, ...
and ofc one wave you can make totally obsolete by cast AotD, more if you have dk dps with you

as far as your gear goes, it's good enough, though the suggestions given by others are correct so you can improve on that.

gl trying it out


ps. if you run with a cc heavy group with ppl you know that are competent, you might just wanna stand in middle and have ranged mobs cc'ed, but obviously that involves you relying on puggies, not always the smartest thing to do in my experience ^^
benefits of this are that you can more easily move out of bad stuff, less risk of los the healer, you can make use of cc that breaks on dmg and it looks way more pro xD, downside is if ppl aren't fast on the cc, you're healer is gonna receive a bit to much love from the mobs.