View Full Version : Tanking Oh Jeez, Bye Bye Dodge

12-09-2009, 08:49 PM
Hello, I am Darkwen. I am a tank for <Whatever> on the server Anetheron.. Although i have not seen all of the content, i believe my questions are on the mind of every current content tank. I also believe my limited input may help shine some light on certain aspects of warrior tanking that go un-answered.. I have not gone through each thread of tankspot to see if there are similar posts, therefore i created my own. I will do my best to organize this post, and go into as much detail as i can.

Dodge Gone Bye, Bye
Well ladies and gents, it looks like ICC will be extinguishing dodge from us tanks.. Atleast for the time being.
So here is my little theory..
Although Parry's DR ( Diminishing Returns ) are for lack of a better word.. beat.. http://www.tankspot.com/forums/f63/40003-diminishing-returns-avoidance.html ( Refer to this for DR check ).. I believe for the time being, Parry > Dodge.. The reason being because ICC gear does have an excessive amount of dodge on it... ( No link available at this time ) and overtime our Dodge will show itself to be at a decent %. This brings the question of.. "When the heck to i start gemming for dodge again?".. And "Why not stack stam?".. I cannot answer the first question, But i believe survivalism at this point in warrior tanking should be obtained through Parry. This being said, i believe warriors who depend on avoidence gear for most boss fights should switch from dodge to parry... From what i have learned, after 30% dodge, most warriors move on to strength or parry.. I believe 25-30% parry ( Not exact, Just Guesstamating ) should be sufficent enough to begin stacking a small amount of strength/dodge ( Dodge, Not so much ;) )... I will be testing this all out.. But if anyone agrees/disagrees or would like to add on.. Please do.

12-09-2009, 10:03 PM
First off, who is gemming str?

Secondly, ICC normal modes probably aren't going to matter THAT much how you gear, but based off of gunship and saurfang, if heroic modes are hard at all, tanks will want to have 2 sets of gear: 1 for EHP, 1 for avoidance. Saurfang is a fascinating fight in that dodging 1 extra time over the course of a fight could literally be the difference between a kill and a wipe.

I am really really confused at what you are getting at for the most part. the DRs on dodge currently are still lower for me if I were to gem for it. I probably will have a set of gear that is avoidance, and if parry is a lower DR at a point then yes, I will gem parry. But not every fight is going to be avoidance, a lot of fights will be EHP fights again.

Edit: oh and... what warriors are gemming raw dodge for survival fights right now?

12-10-2009, 07:55 AM
I mixed up a few things i was aiming at.. Sorry.
I also use 3 sets of gear.. Block ( Don't flame me for it.. I find it usefull ), Avoidence ( No i do not stack straight dodge, I simply use stam+dodge gems and switch my trinkets out a bit ) and simple HP ( Stacking stam, /facepalm I know ) I may be going overboard with the whole 20% dodge debuff, but i was getting trucked.. And it came to my attention that parry would seem better until i obtain gear from ICC.
This was all about dodge.. And switching up avoidence sets. Sorry for the confusion.. But mabye i squared a few things away just now.. Reply pl0x.
Edit: Str is in my block set.. I refrain from using it for PVE.

12-10-2009, 07:56 AM
You might want to review the font size for this post. It does go against the rules of posting on this forum. Drop the font size please.

12-10-2009, 07:58 AM
Just to be clear (though this topic has been beaten to death here, welcome to Tankspot),

The -20% does not affect or interact with diminishing returns at all. The balance posted elsewhere on the forum stands.

You will still get superior % avoidance gains from dodge rating provided you are paying attention to that proportion.

The *only* way that Chill of the Throne can change your priorities is if you are going into ICC with less than 20% total/final dodge. If that is the case, given the amount of dodge and defense on gear of the appropriate level, then you are most likely not geared for ICC to begin with.

12-10-2009, 08:00 AM
simple HP ( Stacking stam, /facepalm I know)

Why is this /facepalm? This is what you SHOULD be doing.

12-10-2009, 08:05 AM
Why is this /facepalm? This is what you SHOULD be doing.

Meh. Stacking stam usually = getting flammed..
As for staying with dodge.. Than i will.. Thank you for the input.

12-10-2009, 08:07 AM
You really haven't been around here much have you, if you think stacking stam will somehow call negative attention on you. Ha.

12-10-2009, 08:08 AM
You really haven't been around here much have you, if you think stacking stam will somehow call negative attention on you. Ha.

Nope. :\
But, for an avoidence set.. I guess stick with dodge?

12-10-2009, 08:13 AM
Nope. :\
But, for an avoidence set.. I guess stick with dodge?

Whoever is flaming you for stacking stam is simply wrong. As for your avoidance set, stack stam!

Seriously though, until you get to like ICC hardmodes... stack stam. Really you should gear for the fight, but right now for the most part that means stam!

If you are going to go for avoidance, it depends on if you want complete avoidance or if you're counting block. If you aren't counting block, probably dodge will give you the best returns, but you may want to go find a calculator or mess around with RAWR to see what really does give you more avoidance if you're wanting to min/max

12-11-2009, 03:52 PM
Meh. NOT Stacking stam usually = getting flammed..
As for staying with dodge.. Than i will.. Thank you for the input.


If you want to help survive, start thinking in terms of Effective Health.
To introduce the EH crew
Stamina - The glory star that everybody mistakes for being EH
Armor - The unsung hero of EH
Magic Resistance - The mostly unheard of and largely ignored stat, to the peril of the stupid. It's the anti-magic armor.

If it's a heavy magic fight (Case in point: VoA) there's just no reason why you should not be quaffing a Resistance Flask over Stoneblood, for the sake of argument. Felhoof has an excellent post where he used magic resistance on Anub'arak 25 man to effectively do save 6k HPS on the boss by resisting leechning swarm, or more to the point, he effectively did 6k DPS in phase 3 because of it.

Having said all this, don't go ignoring stamina for armor/resistances, it's pretty good which is why everybody loves it. But also take a look at the all EH options, namely armor on rings and necklaces, and even armor bonuses on certain pieces (there were the saronite leggings in Ulduar, and there's another piece with armor bonus to it in ICC content). You have to see how much EH it gives you, and decide if the EH boost by armor/magical resistance is better than the stamina bonus.

12-14-2009, 11:29 AM
What about stacking Defence? Defence up's parry/dodge/block, maybe I'm wrong but it could seem that the Onyxia Trinket can find it's use after all :D

12-15-2009, 05:59 AM
If you need an unhittable set like when tanking anub adds, then yes, stack defense, otherwise if you are uncrittable, leave it alone.