View Full Version : ToGC

11-13-2009, 02:14 AM
Recently I switched back to tankadin because the guild I joined is in need of tanks. I've been a pretty successful tank, with weekly ToC runs (the guild's run is a full clear) being done on all four of my 80s. However, the guild if wanting to run ToGC, and they want me to tank. My stats are as follows (all unbuffed):

Hit Points: 31,244
Defense: 550
Dodge: 19.82%
Parry: 21.04%
Block: 21.98%
Hit: 292
Expertise: 15 (25 with Seal of Vengeance)

So, in short, do my stats look like they are ready to tank ToGC10? If not, what should I focus on improving?

Thank you in advance.

11-13-2009, 02:18 AM
Your hit points seem really low. Without an armory link I really cant tell why.

You would definitely need to bump that up a lot if you wanted to be successful. Gormok is a tank killer.

11-13-2009, 02:27 AM
Seems to me your avoidance is bit low in addition to lacking somewhat in the stamina department. However I am no pally and I haven't done heroic trial at all so I could be bit off base with the low avoidance thing.

11-13-2009, 02:38 AM
With Holy Shield I'm at 60% Block; that's not including Kings, GotW, and what-not. Also, my HP is not taking into account Fort, Gift, Kings, or what-have-you. I could probably reach 37k fully buffed.

11-13-2009, 02:43 AM
In heroic trial its very easy for tanks with well over your health level to get insta-gibbed on a number of bosses because the individual hits are just so high. I don't mean to discourage you because skill and a solid team can overcome many gear set backs just be prepared for some "wtf just happened" moments on some fights.

11-13-2009, 02:47 AM
Yeah, I saw that last week. I'm going to upgrade my gloves today, which should put me over 32k HP unbuffed. At that point, should I put Armsman on, or go for the Heavy Borean Armor Kit?

11-13-2009, 02:53 AM
I usually use Armsman cause I probably worry about threat too much but I know a number of tanks these days put stamina in just about every possible place.

11-13-2009, 02:55 AM
You don't want to join ToGC with less than 34k unbuffed, the hits are just that high.(Personally I have 34,8k unbuffed, and switch my avoidance trinket with a +170 brewcharm for Gormok and Anub tanking)
Also ToC is the avoidance-hater of the instances, so I wouldn't worry about it much.

If you really want to tune your avoidance, your dodge is too low compared to your parry, optimally, it'll be 3 or 4% ahead of parry.

11-13-2009, 03:02 AM
Threat isn't an issue. I mean, just coming back to tanking i was putting out roughly 5k TPS, and peaking at about 6.5k. Also, to be fair the majority of my gear is Naxx25-equivalent, with some Ulduar and ToC10 as well. I have the tanking trinket from the Onyxia turn-in. I also have Defender's Code in my inventory, though I'm not sure if that is a huge buff over The Black Heart (850 armour, use to give +455 dodge rating for 20 seconds every 2 minutes vs. 126 STA).

11-13-2009, 03:05 AM
Nah Black Heart is still one of the best trinkets because the proc is strong and has a very good uptime. And for your I would guess 18 stam would be marginally better just to help get to a comfortable health level. As was said just keep in mind ToGC is quite a step up.

11-13-2009, 03:06 AM
The stamina is better, it's just that better.

11-13-2009, 03:07 AM
Oh, I know it is. Ran it on my druid (Boomkin) and it was a kick to the balls. I'm just comfortable with my own competence and think I'm ready, I just don't want to waste attempts if I'm really not up to par.

As for stats, what should be the bare minimu, unbuffed, that you think I should aim for prior to ToGC? Am I ready for ToC25, at least?

11-13-2009, 03:12 AM
Totally, again wasn't trying to be insulting just I don't think many people realize the jump in difficulty. I just haven't tried to say a min stat cause I don't have the actual experience just reading and watching things. As far as ToC25 goes tho from what I understand its not really harder than ToC10 just requires more people obviously.

11-13-2009, 03:15 AM
Bah, I'm not insulted. If I was afraid my feelings would be hurt, I wouldn't have come here in the first place!

Also, playing on an Aussie server for a few months toughens you up. They throw the "cu" word around a lot. LoL.

11-13-2009, 03:20 AM
Haha right on, best of luck with it either way. If ya don't make it this week get a new piece of equipment and try again next time. Great thing about infinite lives, you can always try again as long as there is time (and some mana I guess).

11-13-2009, 03:29 AM
I just realized I haven't run VoA10/25 on my paladin this week! Goodie!

11-13-2009, 03:47 AM
You seem to have a heap of block, but not enough dodge.
Don't worry a bout trying to get the hitcap, above 100 is fine.

Personally with your stamina I wouldn't try Totgc 10, mainly because it will hurt. A lot.
The minimum I've ever gone with is 36k unbuffed, and even then it hurt.

11-13-2009, 05:49 AM
By all means go for it if your guild wants to, but as others have mentioned - you will get insta-gibbed at that HP level. I am tanking TotGC10 on my warrior with 39k unbuffed (around 49k raid-buffed) and still get dangerously low sometimes with consecutive hits/stuns from Icehowl/Anub.

As another example, last night we were attempting an alt run of heroic 10-man ToC and our tank sitting at 36k unbuffed was really really difficult for healers to keep up. I might say focus on clearing ToC10/25 consistently every week and grabbing what upgrades you can from there.

11-13-2009, 05:59 AM
Your health and avoidance are far too low for ToGC. Especially your health, even buffed you will be at high risk from dying to simple things like a couple of bleed ticks and a melee hit, or an icehowl headbutt + melee hit. You'd probably die to the worms' breath attacks too.

11-13-2009, 06:02 AM
There are some pieces that you can pick up for badges that will represent upgrades for you so continue to do Heroics wherever possible. Some of your enchants could do with an upgrade (seriously, +8 All is no good for you - go with 22 Defense or Super Health) and your gems confuse me a little.

For example, you've put a green Def/Stam gem in your shield (blue socket) and then missed a +6 Stam socket bonus in your boots by putting straight stam in a yellow socket. If you simply switched the two gems around, you'd gain Stam overall and that's the kind of thing you'll want to be planning into your gear to ensure it performs optimally for you.

Unfortunately I'd say you're probably still a little shy of being able to tank TotGC. You can probably do some of it but it won't be easy so, as others have said, be prepared for some "wah, one-shot" moments.

I'm reluctant to put minimum stats on the encounters just because I don't think that really works - just continue to upgrade your gear - run TotC-10 and -25 (you should be fine tanking both) each week and put those badges/Trophies to good use. There are some great upgrades you can get from early bosses in Ulduar too, even on Normal Modes.

I'd say try TotGC just to get a feel for it but be prepared to invest some time each week periodically upgrading your gear. It should then just get easier and easier as time goes on.

One final note - all that Block Rating stuff you have on at the moment - do not throw it away. Trust me, when you get to Heroic Anub you'll be kicking yourself if you vendored it all.

11-13-2009, 07:34 AM
I believe it was Ghostcrawler's own words that said if you're in all ilvl 226 gear, you shouldnt expect to survive Grand Crusader. After clearing 10/25 normals i had thought, lol, i'm good and you budget for rare gems - with epic gems i can handle it. Boy was i wrong. That comment while it may not be 100% true, is pretty close.

Right now we're clearing ToGC10 with the insanity achievement regularly. I'm going in with 53K raidbuffed hp and i still pop all cooldowns pretty regularly.

As a measure of what to expect: Gormok will impale you for 20K, melee you for 20K and his previous impale will tick for 7.5K. And it's very possible to take all that damage in the space of 0.5 sec. And that's with AP reductions going on (you dont have vindication in your build - BAD move)

I suggest you gear up a little through the badge gear and the normal mode drops first before trying heroic. Normal 25 is as much a walk in the park as the 10man is, go ahead with that - pretty good upgrades in there and it's even puggable.

PS: Go read Mert's bold words - commit them to heart. Cursing the day i vendored Lavanthor's (2.5 weeks of VH heroic and no trinket. grrrr)