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Kreldin
10-20-2009, 11:51 PM
Hello, new here, seeking advice for my warrior in 25-man ToGC. I'm one of my guild's main tank, although I'm a bit lower on the totem pole than the paladin main tank. But I seem to be having some trouble when it comes to tanking here - I die a lot. -A lot-. I'm consistently at the top of the death meters (dying multiple times in one attempt). I have 40616 hp unbuffed (about 50600 buffed), 26.09% dodge and 21.08% parry in my effective health gear set (which is what I pretty much always use).

But I'm just the tank that always die. The two paladin tanks never seem to have a problem, so I'm beginning to wonder if the healers just don't like me or I'm doing something wrong.

On Beasts, for example, on Gormok, I'll tank the boss second after pally tank #1 gets two stacks. We'll go through this just fine, pally tank #2 will get third set of stacks. But when it comes back to me for the second round of impales (by this time he has 4 buffs), I -have- to blow shield wall just to survive. If I don't, it's a guarantee death for me, even if I only have one impale. The funny thing is, even when I did blow shield wall, I sometimes died with the buff in effect.

By the time the worms come around, I'll tank Acidmaw first just fine. But when he comes back up for his kiting phase, I'll die almost as soon as toxin hits or shortly after.

It's just getting me angry, and guildies are starting to accuse me of being bad, not having enough avoidance, etc. But I've always assumed (and have been told) that effective health is the way to go in ToC, and I've stayed true to that. I do have an avoidance set which gets me 30.14% dodge and 19.75% parry, but I lose over 4k health. What should I be doing? Is it me, is it a healing issue, or just a problem with warriors in particular? Thanks for any help.

This is my armory just in case: The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Arthas&n=Kreldin)

Shortypop
10-21-2009, 12:32 AM
You've definitely got the gear for ToGC25, think you're logged in your avoidance gear but you've still got a lot of 245ilvl gear. Pallys are very good for tanking Gormokk, and if you normally have two I'd recommend timing it so they take the last 2 rotations as this is when he hits hardest. The second time you tank, blow some cd's especially just before the second impale hits, they'll be up again for P3 and you shouldn't need them in P2 if you're tanking acid - you dieing in p2 (not on enraged mob) sounds definitely like a healer issue (or alternatively too much dps taking too much damage and healers stressed out) - I'm assuming you're being bop'ed between phases to help out.

Can't really help, I tank heroic TogC for the first time this week with about 38k unbuffed hp (we use 2 warrior and a pally) for our first kill, we put the pally on last rotation and the other warrior tank (slightly better gear than me) on second to last. But I don't see any reason why you can't survive.

Do you have all demo-shout type debuffs up?

Kreldin
10-21-2009, 02:57 PM
Woops, I did log off in my avoidance gear, my bad. My health isn't that low ;p But yeah, I do blow my cooldowns when I'm tanking the second time around (this is when the boss has 4 stacks of his damage increase buff up). This is the most difficult part for me. It has thus far been impossible for me to survive it without blowing shieldwall as soon as the first impale lands. I then use enraged regeneration and even my Brewfest trinket to heal me up some. But like I said, the sad thing is that I'm even dying while I'm using shieldwall during this. I'm just getting beat up hard. He rips through my 50k + shieldwall like it's nothing.

I am being bop'd between the phases, yes, so I'm just taking damage from Acidmaw alone. We just have a running joke through my guild now that the healers just don't like me, since the two pally tanks emerge unscathed, but some people are starting to point fingers at me and it's getting annoying. There is literally nothing more I can do to prevent myself from dying; I use my cooldowns when I must, and I pray the healers keep me up.

Stackhouse
10-28-2009, 08:34 AM
Krelden,
Just started TOGC 25 man last night with my guild, and I have the exact same problem (Stackhouse, Horde, Aegwynn). I'm a warrior tank with very similar stats to yourself, and our Pally MT was definately having a much easier time tanking Gormak. I'm saving gear up for straight Armor set, as maybe the increased mitigation will help. Look up Xav from Premonition, he has this build.

Squirrelnut
10-28-2009, 09:44 AM
This kind of thing has been covered in other threads but here are some basic tips:

- You are correct, EH is king and armor is second (avoidance is nice but won't save you on fights like NB)
- Good timing on aggressive cooldown usage is HUGE (For example Shield Wall should be used .5 - 1 second before first impale so that it covers the next one as well). Shield block should be up at the start of each of your tank rotations. Combine with Last Stand, Enraged Regen, Trinkets, Armor Pot, etc
- Have a Pally bubble your stacks off when Gormok goes down to reduce incoming damage and make your healer's lives easier
- You are in DPS gear so I can't look at that but I would switch Glyph of Command to Glyph of Thunder Clap. Also I prefer having points into Incite

I would say good cooldown usage is the highest priority factor in Heroic 25m because you can virtually eliminate spike damage and bad RNG deaths to impale/tick/melee on Gormok if you correctly have a cooldown up for each. That prevents your healers from getting surprised and falling behind.

Griff
10-28-2009, 10:29 AM
Make sure Gormok's getting an AP Debuff and make sure you're using indestructable pots too.

With the gear you've got, I'd be looking at your healers. Its a very intensive fight for them and its vital that tanks are kept topped off at all times. Unlike pallies, we don't have ardent defender and we need to use our cooldowns proactively.

As for the worms..how much are you kiting? You might be ranging healers. My guild kites very little, just enough for the tank to keep out of the slime pools - they do a ton of damage and cooldowns are good for these guys too.