View Full Version : Threat Issues as a DK

10-16-2009, 02:01 AM
Hello Tankspot! I've been a reader here for awhile, but I finally need some advice, and need to know if other's are experiencing the same thing.

Basically my problem is that I've been having threat issues on my Death Knight. Maybe I'm just spoiled from my warrior, whom I have no threat issues on at all but I just want to know if there is anyway I can improve my threat. It would be nice to be able to be confident when tanking on my Death Knight.

-I am currently spec'd blood.
-I am over the expertise soft cap, but a tad low on hit. But to be honest, I don't notice a lot of misses.

Armory Link:
The World of Warcraft Armory (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kil%27jaeden&n=Calithis)

The rotation I use is:
IT > PS > DS > HS > HS > DS > Then I begin the HSing once I have 2 blood runes and 4 death runes, throwing in Runestrikes anytime I can.

It seems that rng doesn't like me too much, because I can go for long periods of time when I'm not able to runestrike and it just destroys my threat.

-Usually, I'm not running with a warrior tank, so there are usually no sunders on the boss I'm tanking. Could it affect my threat that much?

Should I be gemming differently, or is there something else I'm doing wrong? My tps is usually 3-4k (sometimes lower) with spikes up to 6k(which is extremely rare), where my warrior is usually 7-8k sustained with 10k + spikes, and my warrior isn't too much better geared than my death knight.

Hopefully, some of you guys will be able to help me out and tell me what I'm doing wrong, if it's a case of rng just hating me, or if I should gem for more avoidance to try and offset rng some. I just have no idea as to how to increase my tps anymore.

10-16-2009, 10:17 AM
The one thing I can suggest is that I don't see Death and Decay anywhere in that rotation. I don't know if you simply forgot to mention it or figured it's such a staple in DK Tanking that it's not really worth mentioning, but...

Either way for me, I end up dropping DnD whenever I can. It can be very difficult to get and hold aggro otherwise, especially if you're blood. I switched back over to Frost probably a few months ago. the improved health really didn't compensate for my frustrations in not being able to hold multiple targets while focusing on one. So I use a combination of DnD and Howling Blast to make sure everyone's held in place as best as I can.

Another thing I also don't see is Blood Boil. After a (very) fail scholomance run back when I was in my late 60s, I learned the usefulness of using Blood Boil. It works alot better if all the mobs do have your diseases, but even without, it's still a quick burst of threat on all mobs within it's radius. great for quick stealing a mob back when someone's accidentally pulled it off and the threat-difference between the two of you isn't large. Of course that's presuming something hasn't changed and I missed it, which is possible of course, but it still works all right for me these days.

Your gear is waaaay beyond my level at the moment so I doubt that it's really anything to do with that although I'm not a hundred percent sure. Gems look cool too. Mostly I'd say you just don't have some things in rotation.

Also I'm not sure how well this works, but I did run across a useful little macro while I was poking around...if I understand it right, outside of combat it seems like the normal auto-attack. However when in combat, it automatically Rune Strikes whenever possible. Again, not a hundred percent sure how it works or if it works well, but the concept seems solid to me.

/cast [target=target,harm,combat] !Rune Strike;Attack

That's about all I got. If anyone has any contradictions feel free to disprove me. Otherwise, good luck!

10-16-2009, 10:31 AM
On a single target, I find DND unnecessary, and burns 3 runes to boot. :P

If you are manually triggering RS, it's entirely possible that you are just missing opportunities to RS, with all the other stuff a tank needs to pay attention to. As was (kind of) mentioned, you can macro RS to your other abilities, for example:

/cast Icy Touch
/cast Rune Strike

In the above example, every time you Icy Touch, it will try to queue up RS.

You may see some macros that insist you use "!Rune Strike", but this is completely unnecessary; the "!" is to prevent an ability that can be toggled on and off from toggling off; but RS doesn't toggle. It doesn't hurt anything to have "!" in there, but it's not needed.

10-16-2009, 10:37 AM
After looking at your spec, part of the "can't RS" issue may be that you are RP starved sometimes (but I dont think that would come into play too often unless you are RP-dumping very frequently). Scent of Blood at 2/3 would give you more RP than Butchery 2/2. I've found 3/3 to be a bit overkill unless I'm dual-wielding. I'd shift the points from Butchery into Scent of Blood.

10-16-2009, 12:06 PM
You may see some macros that insist you use "!Rune Strike", but this is completely unnecessary; the "!" is to prevent an ability that can be toggled on and off from toggling off; but RS doesn't toggle. It doesn't hurt anything to have "!" in there, but it's not needed.
You sure RS doesn't toggle? Thought it did, or at least used to.

10-16-2009, 12:23 PM
It may have toggled at one point, but I didn't actually play a DK until after the first couple of patch changes. When I used to manually trigger RS, I'd sometimes spam the key, and never saw it toggle off; I was using a 2H at the time so it couldn't have been a "maybe you RSed between presses and it just didn't look like it unlit" situation.

10-16-2009, 12:59 PM
I use the !Rune Strike in my macro's too. I remember when not having that in there and Rune Strike would not go off when I popped my next attack in rotation (I haven't played with it in a few patches however so I digress).

Tylovan - your talking more about AOE tanking. BB and DnD don't really serve a purpose in single target threat rotations (they aren't these big burst like shockwave or conc blow but little bity taps like dmg shield sans the deep wounds goodness).

Calithis - Your avoidance isn't terrible so you shouldn't be seeing too long of stretches w/o any Rune Strikes. I'm mainly in 10mans with my guild anymore but I can sustain 5.5-6.5k tps thru most stretches in those cases - unless of course Rune Strike isn't procing. My main issue, is when getting thru that first rotation, if I don't get a !Rune Strike off or a big HS crit, a warrior (especially with Vengance up on a dps) or pally is gonna pull off me pretty quick but not once I get my Rune Strikes going.

I think Bashal has probably pinpointed your problem tho (doubtful you are Runic power starved tho unless you are burning it on Death Coil's?) - missed Rune Strike opportunities.

10-16-2009, 01:08 PM
Alright guys, I'll start using that macro and see if it helps any. I appreciate the answers and the help!