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sangeface
09-24-2009, 02:54 AM
hello everyone

Just a quick question, I am a warrior tank on the aggramar server, I am tanking again after dpsing on my dk for awhile but i am finding it a bit hard to tank agains't people that can do more than 3k dps.

I done Gun drak last nite as it was the daily heroic and had to mages in the group. Everything went fine, there was no wipes and i done it quick which was a bonus hehe. I know mages are aggro magnets but man it was hard keeping it from them. i was in ulduar tanking a couple of days ago and we done the Iron council and same again it was hard keeping aggro from the hunters and the warlocks they were doing 3k+ dps, I was Offtanking runemaster and stormmaster.


I am doing my rotations fine, Charge or heroic throw with thunder clap, shockwave, cleave, sheild slam revenge etc.


Does anyone have a tips to help me keep aggro? or is it a case of once i get better gear it will get easier. Still have blue chest and cape but the rest is between purple item lvl 200 to lvl 226

Thank you to everyone that answers this form

P.S
This is my second time post a thread ever so i hope it's in the right place. Sorry tankspot if it ain't

Mačl
09-24-2009, 03:23 AM
When do you have your problems? Immediately after the pull? After heroism?

If directly during the pull, start out with a shield slam when only one mob. Then do your priority thing. Don't forget to throw in HS depending on rage.

If a group of mobs then start out with a T-Clap. If rage permits it follow it up with a shockwave. Shield slam the primary target, and cycle thru the rest of them. Cleave whenever possible. If you also have strong single target dps then mark a target for them and make it a priority.

Vigilance is also something I'd put on my strongest DPS. Depending on the mobs the strongest AE or the strongest single target DPS.

You could always install Aloft. It replaces the health plaques over the heads of the mobs and also includes your threat level. Also Omen is quite useful while cycling thru the mobs so you know which one needs extra love and where you have a nice comfortable lead.

As for your problems in Ulduar, if you see somebody pulling too much threat, call them out. Every DPS can do something about it(warriors excluded).

DPS pulling aggro is either due to DPS being undisciplined or you not communicating to them what to kill next.

Equip should be fine if you can survive Iron council. The odd blues will only limit your survivability but I guess you are working on that.

For 5mans I would suggest a 15/3/53(Major: Devastate, Blocking + one of Sunder, Revenge, possibly Cleaving depending on rage and preferences; Minor: Battle|Command, T-Clap for extra range, Bloodrage) build and for the OMG I'M GONNA DIE I'd suggest a 5/15/51(Major: Blocking, Shieldwall, Last Stand; Minor: Battle, Command) build. You'll cleave quite a bit in 5mans so picking up a nice&slow DPS weapon for that could be a good idea. Cleave costs quite a bit of rage so I'd make it count.

Having two tanking specs is a QOL thing, really.

sangeface
09-24-2009, 05:10 AM
Thank you for the reply, The problem is normaly after the pull, once i got the mobs pulled and got a good threat lead, I cycle through the targets doing my rotation of cleaves and revenge and sheild slams etc, but by the time i get back to the main target (which is about 4 secs or less) the dps have very quickly caught up with me on threat, with people doing 2.5k dps or less it's not a problem, it's just the higher dpsers i seem to getting it,

In ulduar after 2 of the iron council were down we were fighting the stormmaster and the hunters and warlocks just went for it, instead of the MT picking him up we decieded to leave me tanking him because i was in a good rotation of interupts etc, but keeping the boss off the dps was a nightmare once he was the only one left. I was telling them to back off but never happened, I had to keep taunting it off the hunters and when my main taunts were on CD (HS and Taunt, MB etc) the MT had to help out, It got abit hairy but we managed it in the end. Was our first time on that boss and downed him on the 3rd attempt.

i am dual spec for tank and dps but because i got a really good dk i am gonna change my spec on my warrior for the both prot builds and give them ago, I use omen but will give aloft ago aswell Thank you very much for the advise

Mačl
09-24-2009, 05:18 AM
I had the same problem with multi mobs like you. The first mob got DPSed so hard the by the time I'd switch back to him he would nearly be on the run.

That's why I suggested marking a primary target which would eat shield slam with a priority. Revenge and dev and TClap and SW are enough to bind the rest of the group against AOE.

About your Ulduar experience:
Did you keep Vigilance on the worst offender?
You where interrupting a lot, I gather, could it be that you neglected HS? Interrupting spells screws up the usual tanking habits so it could be that you missed a S&B proc.

After a fight I usually study my recount and try to assess where I could've improved.
I only wish there where target dummies for tanks :/

Gromblee
09-24-2009, 05:29 AM
If you are still wearing some blues DPS pulling 3K and above will challenge you on aggro. That and it is a bit harder for warriors to keep mobs stuck on them (Damage sheild only goes so far) TC is your freind as well as cleave for multi mob situations. I have had situations that I ask DPS to wait 3-4 seconds for me to develop aggro before they jump in to avoid scattering the pack. Just the thoughts of a Dwarf Warrior. As I mostly OT I am dualed to tank / DPS for the times they only need 1 tank.

sangeface
09-24-2009, 05:42 AM
lol wish there was target dumbies too for tanks,

I will try out the sheild slam priority tonight, I sometimes been getting into a habbit of using revenge more than sheild slam

in ulduar i had it on the 1 of the hunters that was causing the most problems but on the last stage it became the other hunter with the one with vigilance a close second then the warlock.
The interupts were taking up some time, he does that chain lighting and whirlwind alot which puts alot of stress on healers if not interupted. I would imagine i would have missed some S&B proc's, Was going crazy in there lol

Like in Gundrak i had vigilance on one of the mages and the other just became the problem, once i switched the vigilance the other one, then the first mage became more of the problem. i couldn't win but the healer managed it, there wasn't any near deaths or wipes. but I just wanna improve on my tanking abilites :)

sangeface
09-24-2009, 05:45 AM
yeah i have had to do that sometimes to Gromblee, I even made a macro when using the gun to pull telling them to wait 4 secs or so for me to get threat, but that was more back when i started tanking but in some cases i am still doing it, like with the 3k+ dpsers lol

asphodel
09-28-2009, 08:25 AM
I have found the information very useful. Our guild has just started farming TOC and have found it difficult to hold aggro against the three boss encounter. Similar issues just after I pull and everything seems fine until the dps gets it. Will try the suggestions as well. :)

Rhysata
10-03-2009, 01:02 PM
Little late to the party here, but I've never had any issues, even when not geared well. So I'll offer up what little advice I can.

In a multi-mob pull as a warrior, we obviously lack a lot of tools for holding the threat. But, I found that as long as the DPS killed things in the order I marked them in, that they would not pull off of me.

Let us take the 3 champions in TOC as an example. Mark your starting target(healer for the sake of this discussion). Then figure out which targets might be a pain to hold on to(Mage or hunter due to them wanting to stay away from you and shoot at range). That target would be the one you want to charge off the bat.

Now, when you charge, the non-ranged folks should come to you on their own. Either way, hit thunderclap as soon as you reach your target of charge. Let them gather up, and position yourself for a shockwave.

After that, focus on the primary target(the healer you marked). Shield slam, devistate, etc. Use your big threat guns on the healer while the DPS focuses on him/her. Meanwhile, use cleave to replace your white attacks(I was specced into the talent that increases cleave damage, had glyph of cleave, and a deep wounds build). Hit thunderclap and shockwave whenever they are up for the extra AOE threat.

So to recap quickly: Your main threat skills are on the skull. The other enemies are being held with: Cleave, Thunderclap, Shockwave.

So long as your dps is killing your targets in order, those 3 aoe skills should EASILY hold the aggro on the other targets. This leaves all of your major threat skills on the main target. You no longer need to cycle around through all your targets. Doing it this way will allow you to hold threat against folks doing far more dps than before.

Generally once I thunderclap and shockwave a group, aggro cannot be pulled off of me so long as the group follows the kill order.

I hope this helps you.

P.S. - When the mage is one of the targets, I save it for last. Reason being that I just use spell reflect everytime it is up to send a 6k fireball back at it. That holds threat and seriously reduces how dangerous the mob is.

asphodel
10-06-2009, 08:02 PM
Thanks for the help. I have been able to tank this encounter a couple of times now. :p

Installing Omen3 has also helped. Must remember to use vigilance more consistently as well.