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View Full Version : DW frost tanking Vs. 2H Frost tanking



domking
08-12-2009, 04:54 PM
Was wondering with 3.2 if DW frost tanking would be the best way to go instead of 2H frost tanking. any ideas and comments would be sweet. Just wanted to get some opinions before I make a decision.


Thanks guys

toonnamefail
08-12-2009, 06:54 PM
As I have stated across several forums, Blizzard did not include RS into ToT for a reason. Do your healers a favour and stick to 2H, go DW if you want to DPS!

vine
08-12-2009, 07:15 PM
Almost every DK I've come across since 3.2 is DW, and failing miserably at threat. They don't seem to realise you need much much more +hit, and it will gimp your other stats by not using SSG to reach 540. Stick with 2h and those big numbers.

darkesnight
08-12-2009, 07:38 PM
ok as far as dw tanking it is viable and i dw tank. I do not have threat issues and i am in just naxx 10 gear with a couple 213 pieces. Now what i would recommend is sticking with what you are used to unless you are willing to give it alot of work and time. do not go dw then go try and do naxx 25 unless you are ulduar geared. I would start low and work your way back up till you are used to it. That is what i did and have had great success. Its not for everyone but just my opinion. Its lots of fun.

toonnamefail
08-12-2009, 08:23 PM
So what you are effectively saying is Tanking the content lower then your geared for is viable because the dps isn't at your standard? I would LOVE to see someone take 2 little axes and put them in Steelbreaker/Thorim/Vezax face and see just how long it would take before they are tanking the floor.

DW Tanking has

Marginally more Avoidance through 2 pure tanking stat sticks + 4 parry (runes)

And looses

Large amounts of threat and lets not kid, its large
Much higher chance to be parry hasted

Gumurak
08-12-2009, 11:36 PM
Dw tanking and you.......

To make something clear to everyone. Dual weild tanking is viable if and only when you meet the criteria for it. Things to know about DW tanking.

Threat issues
Survivability issues
Decent ae tanking ability
Good mitigation if using frost
Slower instant threat, requires wait time by dps.

Ok now that we have some typical points of view out of the way lets get to some of the dirt.....

You will need SLOW weapons for any DW tanking build to improve threat.

The hit soft cap is 383.

You will NEED 26 expertise soft cap minimum to make the build work. if you do not have the expertise you stand a large chance and I mean exceptionally large chance of getting parried to death. The mecahnic for parry has not changed in the game. DW'ing will give the mob twice the amount of chances to parry you. Unless you push parry off the table to some degree via expertise. you are going to stress your healers to thier maximum.

And I highly suggest an addon called tellmewhen in either to maximize your rime procs if you are old like me and miss the buff in your other buffs.

There is a common misconception that DW tanking is viable for anyone and everyone. And to a small degree it is, it however just is not very effective at lower gearing. DW sepcifically scales better with gear as does anything else. But DW tanking excells when you are at dreamstate. In otherwords you have farmed the raid zones enough to push the gear for it. it's a tinkering tank set that most high end guilds are playing with. it however causes way too many issue at lower gearing to make it worth while. When you can simple adjust to 2 handed builds for the time that you are gearing up.

You can however do whatever you like. If you enjoy it then do it. But from personal experience, Id leave the DW builds to the dps until a later date.

Evassara
08-13-2009, 06:28 AM
I would almost completely agree with the post above.

My main concern I noticed when I switched to DW from 2H was the complete lack of defense.

I had to re-do all my gems and most of them because defense gems.

I'll list what I felt were the obvious changes to me:

- 1.5k HP
+2-4% avoidance (2% from parry on each weapon)
+DPS (Went from around 1500 on avg to around 1900 with ilvl 200 weapons)

I think that my threat has gone up for single target fights due to more runestrikes, but has gone down for AoE since I'm not able to build threat as fast due to smaller hits.

My recommendations would be to wait until you have at least all ilvl 213 and up items. It's very hard to get the expertise, defense, hit and hp that you need at lower levels of tanking without gimping yourself severely.

I do like the feel of dual wield better than 2H, and on many fights I can switch to DPS when I'm not needed as OT and do decent damage.

So to summarize wait till you have the gear if you want to switch. You will lose HP and some AoE threat, but will gain dps and avoidance.

Evassara
08-13-2009, 06:30 AM
Dw tanking and you.......

You will NEED 26 expertise soft cap minimum to make the build work. if you do not have the expertise you stand a large chance and I mean exceptionally large chance of getting parried to death. The mecahnic for parry has not changed in the game. DW'ing will give the mob twice the amount of chances to parry you. Unless you push parry off the table to some degree via expertise. you are going to stress your healers to thier maximum.

I heard somewhere else to shoot for around 21 expertise. I'll have to do some research because currently I'm at 22 expertise and may need to regem a little more :(

Phazze
08-13-2009, 10:38 AM
IMHO, I think that 2H is just flat out better because of the Rune of Stoneskin Gargoyle runeforge enchant. It lets you get other gems and enchants instead of having to put more into defence rating and more into stam and avoidance. This is just a general approach if you have amazing 1H's then go for it. :p

Gumurak
08-13-2009, 12:02 PM
I heard somewhere else to shoot for around 21 expertise. I'll have to do some research because currently I'm at 22 expertise and may need to regem a little more :(

trust me the expertise soft cap is 26.

darkesnight
08-13-2009, 02:50 PM
maybe i miss typed or something let me make a re-statement. All i was stating is that you do not need to be naxx 10 geared and try tanking ulduar even if the wow-heroes says you are gear wise ready. Most likely you probably do not have the expertise or hit. I know i am according to wow heroes ready but me personally know i need more at least 213 gear before i go so that way i can get the expertise and hit. So far im only at 18 exp and 258 hit. So no i am not ready for that. I was stating that gear lvl for instance lvl it is viable. i was stating doing the lower instances to see how you do with it before you move on to the higher. Testing grounds so be it.

Hades
08-14-2009, 04:19 AM
I've been toying with the DW idea as well, and my wife's DK is a DW tank build. However, this thread has pretty much told me everything I need to know. Thanks both to the OP and the informed responses.

Maz
09-10-2009, 11:08 AM
:casts spell of resurrection:

So, DW vs 2H Frost Viability....

Myrddraak
09-10-2009, 04:47 PM
I was just reading some of the patch notes. And guess what. Rune strike has been added to tot. Just some food for thought

Gumurak
09-14-2009, 06:42 AM
It's still too spikey of damage for ulduar tanking. Blood tanking is pretty much the warrior effective health equivilant. Frost brings good mitigation if utilized properly. Dual weilding with frost tanking even with rune strike added is still not effective enough to be worried about using it. And parry gibbing still exsists. 213 gear is irrelivant. The main thing people forget is that the progression was done before any of that gear exsisted. What happens is people get used to having decently geared tanks and stuff now. Which leaves people waysided.

Skill of your raid party speaks more highly than grabbing gear numbers. And gear scores are for ridiculous for judging raid viability.